Defining what is God.

[Godless]

Wait just one F**ing minute!

Lets not change the damn meaning of words just to please a delusion! Ok!

Supernsatural:
Function: adjective
Etymology: Middle English, from Medieval Latin supernaturalis, from Latin super- + natura nature
1 : of or relating to an order of existence beyond the visible observable universe; especially : of or relating to God or a god, demigod, spirit, or devil
2 a : departing from what is usual or normal especially so as to appear to transcend the laws of nature b : attributed to an invisible agent (as a ghost or spirit) http://www.m-w.com/dictionary/Supernatural

Supernatural is plainly mysticism, that's it. If it exist, it's not supernatural, if it's claimed, asserted, or postulated, but the claimant in no way can provide emperical evidence, of said claims. Then it's basically BS, supernatural; above nature! PERIOD!

 

[lightgigantic]

Wait just one F**ing minute!

Lets not change the damn meaning of words just to please a delusion! Ok!

Supernsatural:
Function: adjective
Etymology: Middle English, from Medieval Latin supernaturalis, from Latin super- + natura nature
1 : of or relating to an order of existence beyond the visible observable universe; especially : of or relating to God or a god, demigod, spirit, or devil
2 a : departing from what is usual or normal especially so as to appear to transcend the laws of nature b : attributed to an invisible agent (as a ghost or spirit) http://www.m-w.com/dictionary/Supernatural

Supernatural is plainly mysticism, that's it. If it exist, it's not supernatural, if it's claimed, asserted, or postulated, but the claimant in no way can provide emperical evidence, of said claims. Then it's basically BS, supernatural; above nature! PERIOD!

its not clear what your point is

 

[Godless]

actually my point was that the living entity is always in the constitutional position of perceiving the "supernatural" because they are not in a position to have a full grip on the natural laws - thus god appears supernatural from our perspective, but to be "supernatural" is the "natural" position of god (in other words he is just like a phone technician and we are just like the jungle tribesmen in regards to the telephone)

My point! I'm a living entity, and I sure as hell don't perceive the supernatural, not because I'm not aware of natural laws, but because I'm aware of natural laws. To me the supernatural is just bull shit, made up by theist to explain their god, that's supposedly above nature. What exactly is that? Above nature? Super-Natural, is basically above nature, well nothing can be "above" nature, it's illogical. It's either natural or it's not! It doesn't mean that we don't know something, then it's "supernatural"; it means that science will never have the ability requirements to perceive such a notion as "above nature" which basically is inconsistent with reality!

 

[lightgigantic]

My point! I'm a living entity, and I sure as hell don't perceive the supernatural, not because I'm not aware of natural laws, but because I'm aware of natural laws. To me the supernatural is just bull shit, made up by theist to explain their god, that's supposedly above nature. What exactly is that? Above nature? Super-Natural, is basically above nature, well nothing can be "above" nature, it's illogical. It's either natural or it's not! It doesn't mean that we don't know something, then it's "supernatural"; it means that science will never have the ability requirements to perceive such a notion as "above nature" which basically is inconsistent with reality!

therefore the cutting edge of science lies in trying to determine the nature of what is beyond it

 

[Godless]

Wrong, the cutting edge of science lies in trying to determine that which exists, not what is beyond that which exists!!

 

[lightgigantic]

Wrong, the cutting edge of science lies in trying to determine that which exists, not what is beyond that which exists!!

if they didn't move towards what exists outside of current levels of knowledge there would be no progress in empiricism - in fact for progress empiricism, or even knowledge itself is dependent on that which doesn't exist (if you already know something it doesn't tend to warrant any further investigation)

 

[Prince_James]

Godless:

I don't think it can be claimed that the supernatural is ILLOGICAL, only unproven. That is to say, I see nothing contradictory about any claim that suggests an order distinct from that of the natural one. That is to say, powers exercising on a plane of natural law which differs in marked contrast with our own.

 

[Godless]

don't think it can be claimed that the supernatural is ILLOGICAL, only unproven.

If this is so, like you claim, than why not believe in the IPU?
http://www.palmyra.demon.co.uk/humour/ipu.htm
It too is of a supernatural realm, as is the FSM, or ghosts, gremblins, and the flying t-pot!

if they didn't move towards what exists outside of current levels of knowledge there would be no progress in empiricism - in fact for progress empiricism, or even knowledge itself is dependent on that which doesn't exist (if you already know something it doesn't tend to warrant any further investigation)

WRONG!!!
Science is not in the quest to determine if IPU's exists, or ghosts and gremblins, subjects of the supernatural. Science does move to progress, however they discover what exists in objective reality, not the subjective superstitions of "supernaturalism"

a belief in an otherworldly realm or reality that, in one way or another, is commonly associated with all forms of religion.

http://www.britannica.com/eb/article-9001322/supernaturalism

 

[geeser]

Technically, Geeser, religious and magical systems purport to give the person an understanding of the workings of supernatural forces in order that they might become comprehendable and work in the material world.

lol! and how is that possible, give me a break lol again.

 

[Godless]

(Understanding the workings of supernatural forces!???! LOL... That's funny indeed!

 

[(Q)]

so would it be incorrect or correct to say that a jungle tribesman views a telephone as supernatural?

Nope.

 

[SnakeLord]

Everything you've ever done, every step you take, every intent in your heart.....speaks louder in heaven than your words.

It's recorded somewhere to be played back before everyone at your judgment.

Well that's the last time I ever spank the monkey...

 

[geeser]

Prince_James is trying to tell you people something.
You should listen,

why if all it is, is BS.

Look at bacteria, microbes, things to small for the human eye to see.
If you told a staunch "scientist" a few hundred years ago these things cause illness.....

you can teach him, how they would have an effect, but the supernatural can have no effect. something supernatural is beyond anybodys knowledge, it can have no effect on the natural, unless it becomes or is natural.

Or how about atoms, molecules, carrier waves like Radio or T.V.?
You can watch a man thats been dead for fifty years, dance and sing.....in living color.
And the signal is right in the air.....all around you in the very room your sitting in reading this.

yes all those can be tested, they are in the natural, but the supernatural is untestable, unless it becomes or is natural.

 

[(Q)]

Look at bacteria, microbes, things to small for the human eye to see.
If you told a staunch "scientist" a few hundred years ago these things cause illness.....

Or how about atoms, molecules, carrier waves like Radio or T.V.?
You can watch a man thats been dead for fifty years, dance and sing.....in living color.
And the signal is right in the air.....all around you in the very room your sitting in reading this.

But you can't see it.
It takes a special crystal to catch it and make it visible to you.

Same with the things of God.
The things which are seen, were made of the things which do not appear.

Complete crap. You're talking about things in nature having a direct and measurable effect on nature that may have been deemed 'supernatural' when most, if not all people were ignorant and superstitious. Although many people, like yourself, for example, remain ignorant and superstitious, there are those who understand nature and no longer simply write-off the unknown to the supernatural. If it has a direct effect on nature, they know very well that some day it will be explained as our methods and abilities of measuring the effects of nature increases.

What is unfortunate is the fact that there remains those who are ignorant and superstitious.

 

[Godless]

The existence of what you call supernatural.....is just as real as the atom or bacteria.
You can't see it with your natural senses....and that relegates it to the realm of the supernatural to you.

WTF? don't you people understand what is and is not supernatural.

Once again, The existence of the atom or bacteria, is knnown to exist, the existence of "other dimention/realm of existence" is purely non-sense pseudoscience i.e. superstition to claim that an entity exists which controls/created the universe. It's all made up bunch of garbage by apolegetics to explain science advancements and explaining our natural world. In the anciet past, thunder/lightening were considered god's anger with humanity, today we understand this to be BS, so apolegetics keep re-inventing god, with every knew discovery in science that explains phenomena. Thus god's supreme power, now has reached above scientific observation, by creating another realm/existence unaproachable by science. The end all discusion is that apolegetics make up Bull shit as scientist explained away their freaking gods!! Thus the birth of SUPERNATURALISM!!

http://atheism.about.com/b/a/042260.htm

 

[Godless]

As a midwestern stormchaser, born and raised in Kansas....I doubt you could tell me anything about weather phenomna I haven't seen and experianced firsthand.

Really? Which part of Kansas? I've lived in Kansas, chased tornados, lived in Florida survived hurricanes, Lived in California, survived earhtquakes! WTF are you trying to say? I've been chased by god, trying to destroy me! LOL...Big deal, I've lost a home do to huricanes and floods, firsthand!! So don't tell me shit, about the fucking weather, I've been through it enough! That's why I live here in Las Vegas now, get away from floods! But guess what? I've seen floods here in the freaking dessert! Thank goodness it didn't happen in my neighborhood!

You have no idea what you are even talking about.

This is completely ad-hom you dont know me jack, you don't know what i've been through! so your the IDIOT!! who don't know shit!! get it?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_thunder_gods

 

[geeser]

scary tornado got a life of it's own is coming to get you,(your now entering the twilight zone) please do give us a break, please do not insult us with your mumbo jumbo BS.
I went outside yesterday, and I could have swore that a cloud gave me a nasty look, I'm scared it might fill up with water, and thunder bolt me.
( sarcasm lol.)

 

[Godless]

Well I have no problem telling you! since I lived there way past twenty years ago. the little town was Hays! I worked in the oil fields, so when tornados warning alarms went off, off we went a running! But my brother and I just had to see it close up, we drove, and saw first hand the path it was taking, good thing was it never came our way! It was exiting and scarry at the same time. But I never thought for once, that tornados have a mind of their own! or that they are supernatural, that's just bull shit for the deluded!

BTW did you even look at the link of Thunder Gods?

 

[I.D.]

"Today we understand this to be BS"......
You speak for yourself, there is no "WE".
Look around the room you're in.

As a midwestern stormchaser, born and raised in Kansas....I doubt you could tell me anything about weather phenomna I haven't seen and experianced firsthand.
I have personally seen three tornadoes, some people live their whole lives never seeing one.

The Native Americans called them the "twisting wind spirit".
The keyword there is "spirit".

Did you watch the movie "Twister"?
The stormchasers called an F-5 the "finger of god".

I have seen a killer tornado zero in on a trailer park, knock out the power to the tornado sirens before it got there, take out 500 mobile homes in the blink of an eye with people still in them completely unaware it was even coming.
Then zigzag through the countryside from farmhouse to farmhouse, and when there was nothing left to kill in the path of the storm....hop up on the Turnpike and ride straight down a four lane road for forty miles killing and maming every motorist that it could catch.

You have no idea what you are even talking about.

And I've seen a tornado touch down in a neighborhood without damaging anything at all. What's your point? That scientists currently cannot currently explain all of these actions, so instead you're calling it "supernatural?" Before the discovery of bacteria, viruses, etc, illnesses were thought to be caused by supernatural forces. Don't make the same mistake as medieval Christians; scientists simply can't explain these situations yet. (Operative word obviously being "yet")

 

[SnakeLord]

It is a subjective experience, you have to witness personally for it to be real to you.

At least now you realise the absolute futility of being on this forum. You've done nothing but preach since I've known you and yet here you openly state that everything you have done has been for nothing.

After all is said and done, we can only believe in your god if he shows himself to us, (although I've always wondered why you guys say "faith" and "believe" when if he had have ever revealed anything you'd "know").