death penalty - yes or no

[przyk]

In short: The death penalty accomplishes nothing that life imprisonment doesn't, with the disadvantage of being irreversible. Also agree with Pete: imprisonment = justice, execution = revenge.

The thing I will never understand about executions is the mandatory health checkups that preceed them.

 

[przyk]

No!
I support either slavery or isolation. I would like to send those who would otherwise be executed, on an island into community with anarchy. If they kill eachother, fine Island based on personality types would be nice.

Ever heard of Alcatraz?

 

[draqon]

No I Do Not Support Death Penalty.

Justification: Humans Are Not Gods To Decide Who Is To Live And Who Is To Die

Those who kill are sinners and their act cannot be justified.

 

[alain]

I voted no
its irreversible (you'd be surprised how many mistakes the legal system makes)
and regardelss. killing a murderer makes you no better then they

 

[przyk]

Yep. I disagree with the killing of anyone that isn't an immediate threat and is unable to defend themself.

 

[DiamondHearts]

yes, to punish those who engage in unforgivable acts like rape, murder without cause, selling people into prostitution, being involved in genocide of innocent people, sexual abuse of prisoners... etc.

 

[przyk]

That's what prison is for. Who are you to decide what is and isn't "unforgivable" anyway?

 

[Mystech]

There's always the danger of killing someone innocent isn't it? And once one becomes a murderer, one becomes a murderer, right? A justice system killing criminals aint a justice system. It's a killing system, which makes it no better than the murderer.

if we have to callously take even one innocent person with them - that's just immoral and the entire society has his blood on their hands. When the death penalty fails, we all become murderers.

Penn & Teller recently did an episode of Bullshit! (Their program on the Show Time network, where they take social and political issues and go about proving them to be a bunch of BS in one way or another through well reasoned arguments, and a good dose of entertaining humor, and the occasional magic trick) did an episode about the death penalty just recently – they had an interview with a man who was put on death row for a murder that he could not have committed.

He was fingered by two witnesses, tried, and sentenced, and sat on death row for two years. The real kicker? He was already in jail when the murder took place! The witnesses who fingered him turned out to be the murderers, and the prosecutors in his trial knew that he was in jail at the time, and withheld that information. The death penalty is a horribly flawed system of “punishment”.

What really gets me is that most people who support the death penalty don’t even trust the government to put up street signs or license and register vehicles – but they’ll trust them with the supreme power over who lives and who dies. It just doesn’t make any sense at all to me.

 

[john smith]

Good point.

But do you believe that in ANY circumstance the death penalty is justifiable?

 

[Mystech]

I really don't think so. People always bring up things like "Well what if you had hitler" or "What if they caught the guy that killed your family" or things like that - well of course I'd want revenge, but revenge and justice are two different things.

 

[john smith]

True, but it would be hard to see how different these two things would seem if ( now im going to fall into the trap of 'the guy that killed your family') you were in the previously mentioned position.

And, after that event, if you heard on the news that some guy had killed a different family, then surely you would be pre-disposed in taken the side of the harsher form of punishment i.e. death penalty?

I could be wrong, but i really do think that mass murderers, mass rapists and child molesters deserve nothing but death induced punishment.

Can you see my point?

 

[thedevilsreject]

sustained child abusers should be put to death...but there are also so many different kinds of murder, do you think it is acceptable when the child is being abused to turn around and stab him. that i think is the problem with the death penalty, apart from the fact that sometimes you may put an innocent man to death there are so many grey areas in the law system. however if there is ABSOLUTE proof and the crime is heinous enough then the perpurtrator should be put to death.

 

[Chatha]

I agree, life imprisonment is plain stupid and a waste of resources. Death should replace all life sentences. I don't know what the big deal is, thousands of people die everyday we wake up.

 

[thedevilsreject]

look at milosovic he died in jail and no-one but a few serbs cared one bit

 

[Alejandro]

The real problem w\ being against the death penalty is that many are UNTILL the crime effects them.

 

[Naat]

Ever heard of Alcatraz?

Alcatraz still had guards and rules. I was thinking more in the lines of an island in oceania. I am in no position to tell that this is more humane, but those who would otherwise be sentenced with death penalty would appriciate it, I hope

 

[domesticated om]

I'm undecided on the issue right now, and haven't voted yet.

When a person is executed, what kind of problem is being solved?
It isn't an effective deterrant. People are still compelled to do the crimes for one reason or another, and continue to be executed.
It doesn't really make an effective spanking. Usually, a punishment is intended to somehow reinforce ethics, but it doesn't do the criminal any good becuse death removes the opportunity to comply.
I'm not really sure what benefit/context it has to the victims families (justice perhaps?)..... maybe I should think it through and post later.
It certainly eliminates the criminals ability to repeat the crime, so that's something in the DP's favor.

I dunno.

 

[spuriousmonkey]

Crime statistics may show a lower rate in Europe, but the prisons are overflowing with up to 4 times as many inmates as they were designed to hold. All this does is provide breeding grounds for more criminals. Many Judges in the UK now avoid handing out jail sentences because of this overcrowding.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/4841938.stm

On UK prisons:
Although many people might expect the tougher line on crime to be connected to an increase in offences, this has not been the case, the Prison Reform Trust says.

The number of people found guilty by the courts has remained "comparatively static", rising from 1.7 million to 1.8 million between 1993 and 2004.

It also reports that there has not been an increase in the number of serious crimes.

What has happened, the charity suggests, is that many people whose offences would not have attracted a custodial sentence in the past are now being sent to prison.

And for those convicted of some of the more serious offences, sentences are getting longer.

Despite the stable crime levels, a factor other than the political climate which may have contributed is a change in the pattern of offending, particularly where drugs are involved.


There are now more people appearing before the courts with long strings of convictions who have failed to comply with non-custodial sentences, says Mr Allen.

It may be that courts believe "these people have run out of road... and prison is inevitable", he says.

Another factor is the 250% rise in the number of people recalled to jails for breaching release conditions.

Some 11,081 inmates were recalled in 2004/05, compared with 3,182 in 00/01 - a "staggering" increase, Chief Inspector of Prisons Anne Owers reported in January.

It seems a change in social values has caused the overflooding of the UK jail. Not an increase in crime perse.

And the Uk might not really be representative for Europe:

Nowhere in Western Europe jails more of its population than England and Wales, where 143 people per 100,000 are in prison.

Bloody hell. Just found this:

1 on every 140 persons in the US is in prison! 2.1 million Americans!

Within Europe:

 

[przyk]

Alcatraz still had guards and rules. I was thinking more in the lines of an island in oceania. I am in no position to tell that this is more humane, but those who would otherwise be sentenced with death penalty would appriciate it, I hope

You mean like what pirates did? Left on a desert island with a biscuit, bottle of water, and a gun with one bullet?

 

[przyk]

sustained child abusers should be put to death

Why? I've heard life can be pretty tough for you in prison if the inmates know you were convicted for child abuse.

however if there is ABSOLUTE proof

There's no such thing as absolute proof.

and the crime is heinous enough

Where do you draw the line?

then the perpurtrator should be put to death.

Again, why?