Credibility of the Bible

Originally posted by EvilPoet
"Let he who is without sin cast the first stone."
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A truly great example. What is interesting about your quote is that it found in neither the Codex Sinaiticus nor the Codex Vaticanus, i.e., the two oldest codices of the Bible. Isn't it wonderful what a good editor can do? ;)
 
Originally posted by shane1985
homosexuality is a sin just like any other sin, and it is impossible for an increase in sin to make the world a better place.
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I resent your view that my existance is a smudge on the consious of the world. Hence I argue.
 
Originally posted by shane1985
I find it humorous that athiests often ask Christians to defend their position without use of the Bible, and yet refer to it when trying to disprove the credibility of the Bible.
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Your sense of humor is apparently no more developed than is your grasp of logic. While the Bible does not constitute proof of God, it clearly constitutes a description of Judeo-Christian beliefs. Your problem - not mine.
 
Originally posted by RichRahl20
just because someone is a dick and they choose to try and use their religion as a tool to alienate people (ironically the people who wrote Leviticus just made up all these bullshit rules to isolate themselves), doesn't necessarily mean you have to stoop to their level by turning bashing religion into your favorite passtime.
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Disarming my enemys, and separating them from the faulty premises which they attack me from is more than just a pass time. It may be recrational here on the Sciforums, but it's good training for life.
 
shane1985,

I see what you are saying, thanks for the clarification. It may clear up the contradiction for you but it doesn't for me quite yet. I'm still not clear on something that I would like clarified. However, I am also running late so I don't have time to continue this discussion at the moment. I will be back later. :)
 
Originally posted by Mystech
Why do you think that the concept of faith was invented in the first place? If the events of the bible, as depicted, were actually completely true, then they would be provable and knowable, just the same as any other event or objective truth in all the world.

The fact that the stories told in the Bible are not true, necessitates the pathetic patchwork to hold religion together, which is known as faith. Belief without knowledge. What is another word witch fits this description? Delusion. Faith is a disease of the mind.
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Personally, I think the idea of faith was invented to weed out those who truly do not believe in God. Faith is not the pathetic patchwork, but rather the base of religion. Also, just because something is not provable does not mean it is not true. For example, take the concept of several dimensions. Scientists cannot prove the existance of dimensions past the 4th dimension, but these things can still be true. I hardly think that faith is belief without knowledge, because while you may not know that there is a God, I do.
 
Originally posted by Mystech
I resent your view that my existance is a smudge on the consious of the world. Hence I argue.
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I don't recall ever saying homosexuals are a smudge on the world. Homosexuality is a smudge on the world, but no more than any other sin.
 
Shane1985-

Personally, I think the idea of faith was invented to weed out those who truly do not believe in God. Faith is not the pathetic patchwork, but rather the base of religion.
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There would be no need for this weeding out process if substantial proof was put forth in the first place. This way there would be no people that do not believe, all would believe because it would be a fact of life, just like 2+2=4.

A truth so obvious that to think otherwise would be obsurd, this could have been the way. All the people of the world could have had the same hope that supposedly is privy to the select of today's world. There would be no need for this tug of war battle for understanding our existance, God could have made his existance concrete. An all loving God would not leave people hanging on, waiting, for a sign. A stronger base for religion to stand on, would be proof, or at least some viable evidence to give people the comfort of the absolute truth. It should not be a game of maybe/maybe not.

For someone so intelligent and superior he sure knows very little about his own creation. People search for answers of questions they do not know, some people go one direction, others another.

To me it is obvious that many religious concepts are utterly flawed. A personal God that is perfect would not do this to his creation. Say what you will but the fact of the matter is obvious. The concept of a personal God is obsolete, why is this so hard to understand. Have hope in yourself, not for some ancient writing that is so clearly false.
 
Look, I'll play God for a moment. I think I can do a better job anyway.

ahem *clears throat*...." Hello my children, This is God speaking. Its true I do exist, no need to harbor any more doubts. I love all my children therefore I want all to join me in heaven. I want all of you to know I exist so you dont have to worry anymore."

Now how hard was that.

Quite absurd in my mind that it would speak, but hey, im not the one who says there is a God in the first place, and may I remind you that he is supposedly "All-powerful" speaking isnt too hard now is it?
 
shane1985,

Just a couple of more questions for clarification ...

Why is it not mentioned in Samuel that Joab didn't finish
the census? It is confusing to me that it was mentioned
in Chronicles and not in Samuel.

Can you please explain to me why these two quotes read
differently?

"Again the anger of the Lord burned against Israel, and he
incited David against them, saying, "Go and take a census
of Israel and Judah." -2 Samuel 24: 1 (NIV)

"Satan rose up against Israel and incited David to take a
census of Israel." -1 Chronicles 21: 1 (NIV)
 
defsceptic

who said god doesn't speak today?
where on earth did u learn to speak god so clearly?

buddha taught that believing in god doesn't stop one from committing acts of evil. he observed this from the acts of those around him.
even the jews, who saw miracles performed, worshipped idols, and generally played the fool. they became like spoilt children. possibly, as in genisis, could this have suprised god? the bible is not only a written history, but also a history of work in progress.
wake up. wake up. (and remember - to look up, bend the knee a little more.)

thank u for your time and patience.
:D
 
buddha taught that believing in god doesn't stop one from committing acts of evil. he observed this from the acts of those around him.
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That's true but do not forget "belief" does not equal "fact". I believe aliens exist that want to suck out or eyeballs with metal straws- that does not mean i go round wearing concrete goggles. If their exitence and behaviour was fact then i would wear concrete goggles.

even the jews, who saw miracles performed, worshipped idols, and generally played the fool. they became like spoilt children.
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Like spoilt children? The poor bastards had been living on manna for 40 years while they had to kill all the cows for god and didn't even get to eat the meat. They asked for some and got given quails and were killed before they could even eat them. So much for god being nice. god demanded they make him a place full of gold- gold altar, gold lightstand, gold seat with blue ribbons yada yada and give him grain offerings, peace offerings, atonement offerings, sin offerings, make sure no cows had bruised bollocks, make sure no people were crippled, and so on and so forth. Who's the spoilt child?

If they did 'play the fool' who made them that way?

wake up. wake up.
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Aimed at yourself?
 
Originally posted by shane1985
Personally, I think the idea of faith was invented to weed out those who truly do not believe in God. Faith is not the pathetic patchwork, but rather the base of religion. Also, just because something is not provable does not mean it is not true. For example, take the concept of several dimensions. Scientists cannot prove the existance of dimensions past the 4th dimension, but these things can still be true. I hardly think that faith is belief without knowledge, because while you may not know that there is a God, I do.
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Look up the definition of Faith, Shane. It is belief without knowledge. And no, you don't know that God exists, to say that you do perverts the meaning of knowledge, you just believe that God exists.

Why would your God want faith if he really did exist? Why should he be relegated to the same place as Santa clause, and the tooth fairy?
 
Originally posted by shane1985
I don't recall ever saying homosexuals are a smudge on the world.
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It was a point I took from your previous post.

Originally posted by shane1985
Homosexuality is a smudge on the world, but no more than any other sin.
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I take little consolation in that view. Faith is the only true sin if you ask me. A regection of all that elivates man kind above the beasts.
 
Originally posted by DefSkeptic
ahem *clears throat*...." Hello my children, This is God speaking. Its true I do exist, no need to harbor any more doubts. I love all my children therefore I want all to join me in heaven. I want all of you to know I exist so you dont have to worry anymore."

Now how hard was that.
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You know, even if the big guy came down from heaven to address us all like that, I still think I'd have some major reservations about following him. I mean just because some dude can desend from the heavens and all, and be visiable to all man kind, how the hell do I know that his authority is rational and workable. I don't think I'd really be inclined to become a christian until I saw an interview with the big guy on Larry King Live, or something, you know something where viewers could phone in and ask him some questions first.

I can envision a God who favors those which disobey his word, those who don't believe, because he knows he didn't give them enough information to rationaly believe in him. I can imagine a sadistic God laughing at the clergy, because they are so gullable. . . I can also imagine myself laughing beside him, before I punch him in the face for being a big jerk.
 
snake

i think what god is trying to say is that heaven is unreachable. plain statement of fact. that only thru the sacrifice of jesus can one rest in his mercy.
"wake up. wake up". and also a general warning about god the father himself, the 40 year jewish hike being gods lesson for the gentile.
 
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