Big Bang Evidence for God

pywakit said:
Empathy for one. Of course, there are just as many reasons why humans don't assist each other as they do. We are both simple and extremely complex beings. Unfortunately, Christians have been conditioned to believe morality is unique to those who accept God and God's teachings. Secularists by definition (according to Christian beliefs) have no morals/are immoral.

Well, arauca, would you not agree that indoctrination is immoral? Then why do Christians engage in such pervasive and deliberately immoral acts?

Babies have no concept of gods or other alleged supernatural phenomena. They are, by birth, realists. Over the first couple years of life, they become aware of, and learn to interact with the real world around them.

Not only do they have to be taught there are such things (beings) as God/Jesus, but they have to be taught that these things are just as real as the physical world.

I find this especially repugnant. What%2
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Where did the rest of this post vanish to??? And why?
 
Mazulu said:
Alphanumeric, everyone,
Humans have been killing, raping and abusing each other historically for many reasons, not just religion. Religion is precious to those who embrace theirs; anything precious is worth defending. But people kill each other over money, land, resources, jealousy, sex, love, hate, and just because they can. You can't justify the position that religion is the only reason why people kill (harm) each other.
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Don't think anyone stated that religion is the sole reason. But religion certainly has been used to justify such things.

My point is that religion is an innocent bystander in the ongoing violence of man against man.
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I'm sure the Spanish Inquisition, the Crusades, and even Hitler (yes, I just did it) thank you for excusing their religious behavior. Unless you mean that religion is not responsible for organized religion's action. But they walk hand in hand, so I can't see how you can separate one from another. They support each other.

As for the big bang and the birth of the universe, science simply doesn't know what happened. Maybe it was a quantum fluctuation. But then you still need something "quantum" to exist prior to the big bang. Science should stick to "we don't know" and let everyone else draw their own conclusions: Quantum flucuation, hyperspace explosion, flying spaghetti monster flatulence, God, whatever...
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That's useful. Stop looking for answers. The next new discovery might make more people question their faith.

From the point of view of those who wrote Genesis, "Let there be light" is a perfectly good representation of "big bang". The details of the big bang are irrelevant because Genesis wasn't written for cosmologists and physicists. Genesis was written for laypersons, those who want religion and those who are searching for truth down through the ages. Know your audience.
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Fitting the text after the fact to justify it doesn't work. That's no different than the ones who come here from time to time claiming that some known science fact was revealed in the Koran long ago. So easy to twist things to make it work.


So you want to tell people that the universe was born in darkness? I suggest that you ask the Satanists to add that to their Satanic Bible. It has a perfectly evil poetic ring to it.
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Actually you should embrace this, as the Bible does start with darkness and God moving upon the waters. I'm sure you can make it fit to science facts.

As an aside, Satanists were born from sarcasm, not a different side of religion. They don't actually believe any of that stuff, but they enjoy how upset it makes the churches get. I don't approve of their methods, but I get the dark humor.
 
Rhaedas said:
Don't think anyone stated that religion is the sole reason. But religion certainly has been used to justify such things.
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Tyrants, killers, rapists and madmen can have philosophical and religious beliefs too. It's not the religion's fault there are psychos that misuse their teachings.

I'm sure the Spanish Inquisition, the Crusades, and even Hitler (yes, I just did it) thank you for excusing their religious behavior. Unless you mean that religion is not responsible for organized religion's action. But they walk hand in hand, so I can't see how you can separate one from another. They support each other.
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Oh God!!! You throw Hitler into your argument to make it stronger?

That's useful. Stop looking for answers. The next new discovery might make more people question their faith.
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Clearly you are unaware of the unseen hand that manipulates you. Yes!!! God created the universe! You can never prove that anything else created the big bang because there was nothing else before the universe! Only God! So repent before the Creator! Don't look for another cause!!!

Fitting the text after the fact to justify it doesn't work. That's no different than the ones who come here from time to time claiming that some known science fact was revealed in the Koran long ago. So easy to twist things to make it work.
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Doesn't work to do what? You are so blind to the forces that manipulate your actions. Your free will was robbed from you long ago by the gods and by God!! Now you serve the agenda of those you consider fools. Serve my agenda!!!
 
Mazulu said:
Tyrants, killers, rapists and madmen can have philosophical and religious beliefs too. It's not the religion's fault there are psychos that misuse their teachings.
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Misuse...I'm not going to go find chapter and verse, but the Bible itself has justified wiping out other societies, so how is that misusing? Let me guess, it was just a parable, and not to be taken literally, only it can be literal if you want to use the Bible as a history tool. Convenient.

The rest of your post was word salad...don't throw free will arguments around, I could easily claim that because I don't have free will I have no choice but to argue against the illogic of religion, because God makes me.
 
Mazulu said:
Tyrants, killers, rapists and madmen can have philosophical and religious beliefs too. It's not the religion's fault there are psychos that misuse their teachings.


Oh God!!! You throw Hitler into your argument to make it stronger?


Clearly you are unaware of the unseen hand that manipulates you. Yes!!! God created the universe! You can never prove that anything else created the big bang because there was nothing else before the universe! Only God! So repent before the Creator! Don't look for another cause!!!


Doesn't work to do what? You are so blind to the forces that manipulate your actions. Your free will was robbed from you long ago by the gods and by God!! Now you serve the agenda of those you consider fools. Serve my agenda!!!
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You are joking? Hopefully? Yikes.
 
Rhaedas said:
The rest of your post was word salad...don't throw free will arguments around, I could easily claim that because I don't have free will I have no choice but to argue against the illogic of religion, because God makes me.
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Actually, you are powerless to help me achieve my agenda. I'm just yanking your chain cause it's fun.

As for free will, do you even understand what motivates your actions?
 
Just as with the origin of the universe, it's okay to admit that you don't know the answer to a question. But if you must use one liners...whatever.
 
Rhaedas said:
I recall reading the rest, but it shows an edit later. Maybe a database error? Did you try and edit it?
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No. I had done a minor edit earlier, but that was posted. Mystery.

I went back and restored the important part: the link to the Catholic school curriculum.
 
Rhaedas said:
Just as with the origin of the universe, it's okay to admit that you don't know the answer to a question. But if you must use one liners...whatever.
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If science doesn't know what created the universe, then it must have the Christian God of the Holy Bible. That means that the Christians are correct.

Unless you can think of another explanation.
 
Mazulu said:
If science doesn't know what created the universe, then it must have the Christian God of the Holy Bible. That means that the Christians are correct.

Unless you can think of another explanation.
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Non sequitur. Does not logically follow ...
 
Rhaedas said:
Forget science. You sure left out a lot of religions there.

False Dichotomy

But yeah, there's a number of scientific theories as well.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cosmogony#Theoretical_scenarios
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Correct answer is number 2, "reconciling the conservation laws ("something from nothing");"

You need to explain:
1. where the energy of the big bang came from.
2. where space-time continuum came from.
3. where the physics constants came from.

And you have to show physical proof by creating a new universe, with designer constants, from scratch. Do this, or convert to Christianity.
 
Mazulu said:
I'm just being playful. I'm just an innocent little fluff-ball...with powers beyond your comprehension.
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Try me. :)

Can't help but notice you have made no attempt to respond (rationally or otherwise) to my posts on indoctrination.

Is the curriculum of the Catholic schools beyond your comprehension?

Or are you just avoiding the issue?
 
Mazulu said:
Correct answer is number 2, "reconciling the conservation laws ("something from nothing");"

You need to explain:
1. where the energy of the big bang came from.
2. where space-time continuum came from.
3. where the physics constants came from.
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You're right.

God did it just moves the goalposts. Whereas the second link I gave, this is exactly the point of those theories, to find out what this nothing actually is that something came from. See, that nothing may indeed be something else, just appearing as nothing to us now.
 
pywakit said:
Try me. :)

Can't help but notice you have made no attempt to respond (rationally or otherwise) to my posts on indoctrination.

Is the curriculum of the Catholic schools beyond your comprehension?

Or are you just avoiding the issue?
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Re-read post #96. I am a little fluffball with an agenda.
 
Mazulu said:
Gibberish. I can see through your deception. I can see into your soul.
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Maz, I said your statements did not logically follow. Clearly you are having some trouble grasping this. You are laboring under the misconception that if science has not solved these questions, then the answer defaults to your particular beliefs.
 
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