another reason why the Christian bible is false

E

EmptyForceOfChi

Banned
Banned
heaven and hell,




if there were a christian god as the bible describes "him", then he would not send people to hell, because he forgives all. so if god has forgiven you why would he send you to hell, he is all loving and all caring, so as biblical "logic" goes, a hell wouldent exist, the almighty would just let everyone into heaven because having someone suffering in an eternal fire pit of pain and hardship, isnt really the actions of an almighty loving god bieng is it now, if somebody were to eat to much cake or pizza he would sin with gloutony, therefore without repenting his sin, would be banished to the fires of hell, (just for eating some cake?) thats a little harsh for the all loving god right?.




peace.
 
EmptyForceOfChi said:
heaven and hell,




if there were a christian god as the bible describes "him", then he would not send people to hell, because he forgives all. so if god has forgiven you why would he send you to hell, he is all loving and all caring, so as biblical "logic" goes, a hell wouldent exist, the almighty would just let everyone into heaven because having someone suffering in an eternal fire pit of pain and hardship, isnt really the actions of an almighty loving god bieng is it now, if somebody were to eat to much cake or pizza he would sin with gloutony, therefore without repenting his sin, would be banished to the fires of hell, (just for eating some cake?) thats a little harsh for the all loving god right?.




peace.
Click to expand...

God's forgiveness is a gift offered to those who accept it. For one to seek and accept the forgiveness of God one must believe that one needs to be forgiven for something. If one believes they have nothing to be ashamed of, or if they think they have done no wrong and they where justified in doing all the things they have done to others in their lives then Gods forgiveness is an insult. They become indignant at the thought that they would need such a gift.

So Gods forgiveness is a gift but a gift cannot be had unless the one who the gift is intended for accepts it. The gift is on offer to all human beings But who will believe it? And who will reach out and take it?


All Praise The Ancient Of Days
 
Here's how it was explained to me years ago.

Your parents love you. You act up. You get punished. They still love you and will forgive your acting up. God loves you. You sin. You get punished. God still loves you and will forgive your sin.

It's kind of simplistic, but the nun was trying to explain things to a four-year old. What sort of parent/guardian/whatever would not punish bad behavior?

PS: I'm sure you understand that the seven deadly sins are man-made regulations, right? Just as the three virtues are?
 
cow is right... but WHAT matters is how you feel about it, after doing something bad..... will you do it again? do you care?

do you repent? have you learned?
do you feel any shame?

if not...

youll do it again... and again.. and again... and never feel bad.
never feel shame.. never repent.

and no parent accepts this... so we should not think GOD wil either.

-MT
 
Think of it this way, although this is simplistic. Just like there are natural laws governing our planet, there are spiritual laws governing humanity. In the natural if you jump from a tall building you will go splat. Even though God loves you, you will still go splat. At the same time, their are spiritual laws in place. God still loves you, but if you live your life outside of his spiritual laws, then hell/a place of seperation from all good or chance of redemption is your reward.
 
What sort of parent/guardian/whatever would not punish bad behavior?
Click to expand...

Well, I have never punished my daughter once in her entire life. True, she has also never been naughty. However, this is really not the same thing.

For analogy sake, let's say that you, (as a child), had never ever ever met your father. You had no idea who he is/was and all your searching yielded nothing. So your mother tells you he was the nicest most wonderful guy on the planet - but, being smart as you are, you realise the problem with your mother claims.. namely that if he was as nice and wonderful as she claims, he would never have left you, would never turn a blind eye when you need him most.

And so you go through life not believing in the stories concerning your father - who you've never met and never known. One day a man knocks on your door and says he's your father. Things might just seem to be getting clearer for you, but then another man knocks on your door and says he's your father and the first 'father' is a fraud. This continues until there are 100,000 men at your door all claiming to be your father.

A) None of these 'fathers' has any right whatsoever concerning your behaviour. Indeed in many instances your behaviour is directly related to your fathers absence.

B) Without evidence, how in the name of lenny the leprechaun would you know which, if any, was actually your father?

C) Would you not raise an eyebrow when this father you have never ever ever seen or met tells you he disagrees with something you did 70 years ago and as a result he is going to set you on fire - and make sure you burn forever and ever and ever amen?

What a fucking crock of shite.
 
Taking article B, here is where the issue of faith comes in. You don't necessarily have to believe that any of the 100,000 men are you father. He could still be out there, and for all you know he is the "nicest most wonderful guy on the planet". Why is he not here? You didn't answer that. Maybe he's setting up a place better, nicer, and far more comfortable than the shithole we're living in now, and you and your mother are going to live there when it's all ready.

As for turning a blind eye, when a child learns how to stand, walk, ride a bike, etc., there's a lot of time there when your parents aren't holding your hand. You have to learn to do it on your own. So you fall and maybe get hurt. To pull from Mosheh's post, did you learn anything from it? Like how to control yourself? If god seems to be turning a blind eye to the suffering of humanity, could it be that we need to learn how to ease it ourselves before calling on a diety to intervene? Why do we ask god to do something that we aren't willing to do ourselves?
 
EmptyForceOfChi said:
heaven and hell,




if there were a christian god as the bible describes "him", then he would not send people to hell, because he forgives all. so if god has forgiven you why would he send you to hell, he is all loving and all caring, so as biblical "logic" goes, a hell wouldent exist, the almighty would just let everyone into heaven because having someone suffering in an eternal fire pit of pain and hardship, isnt really the actions of an almighty loving god bieng is it now, if somebody were to eat to much cake or pizza he would sin with gloutony, therefore without repenting his sin, would be banished to the fires of hell, (just for eating some cake?) thats a little harsh for the all loving god right?.




peace.
Click to expand...



What? No, you cannot use this as proof the lord doesn't exist. This is purely speculation.

Listen to this carefully.

God set up morals for humans to live by. So that we could live in peace. He also setup a punishment for them so people would follow his word. For instance would he be an all loving god if he let someone like...lets say Hitler into heaven? Would this be just for the people who spent their lives following his word? I don't quite think you are thinking this through.

If you where God would you setup a moral standard for people to live by? If you say no that would be a very foolish thing to do.

If you did setup these morals what would you use to make people follow them?

Obviously you would have to setup some kind of punishment or scare tactic.

God is omniscient could you really judge his decisions? They would always be correct.

The very first line you stated is only somewhat of how he is described. He is also described as just, vengeful, and omniscient.

You are simply misunderstanding the meaning of hell. It's a punishment.

Lets take something else in example of this. Lets say you met the nicest police officer in the world. But still arrested criminals and sent them to prison. Would this affect him being nice?
 
Ricky Houy said:
What? No, you cannot use this as proof the lord doesn't exist. This is purely speculation.

Listen to this carefully.

God set up morals for humans to live by. So that we could live in peace. He also setup a punishment for them so people would follow his word. For instance would he be an all loving god if he let someone like...lets say Hitler into heaven? Would this be just for the people who spent their lives following his word? I don't quite think you are thinking this through.

If you where God would you setup a moral standard for people to live by? If you say no that would be a very foolish thing to do.

If you did setup these morals what would you use to make people follow them?

Obviously you would have to setup some kind of punishment or scare tactic.

God is omniscient could you really judge his decisions? They would always be correct.

The very first line you stated is only somewhat of how he is described. He is also described as just, vengeful, and omniscient.

You are simply misunderstanding the meaning of hell. It's a punishment.

Lets take something else in example of this. Lets say you met the nicest police officer in the world. But still arrested criminals and sent them to prison. Would this affect him being nice?
Click to expand...



i did not say that "god" dosnt exist, if you read the title of the thread it says "why the christia bible is false".


i dont know if god exists im not debating that here, im debating the logic of the bible scripts.

god did not write these laws, they are flawed, man wrote the book, man wrote the commandments, the laws of the bible are not from god. if "he" exists or not is anouther matter.

peace.
 
Oxygen said:
Here's how it was explained to me years ago.

Your parents love you. You act up. You get punished. They still love you and will forgive your acting up. God loves you. You sin. You get punished. God still loves you and will forgive your sin.

It's kind of simplistic, but the nun was trying to explain things to a four-year old. What sort of parent/guardian/whatever would not punish bad behavior?

PS: I'm sure you understand that the seven deadly sins are man-made regulations, right? Just as the three virtues are?
Click to expand...

also....my children would have to be EXTREMELY "naughty" in order for me to justify throwing them into a pit of fire for all eternity...and im not even "all loving" as the new testament describes G-d.

its social control by the early catholic church that is still used today.
that
is
all.
 
EmptyForceOfChi said:
i did not say that "god" dosnt exist, if you read the title of the thread it says "why the christia bible is false".


i dont know if god exists im not debating that here, im debating the logic of the bible scripts.

god did not write these laws, they are flawed, man wrote the book, man wrote the commandments, the laws of the bible are not from god. if "he" exists or not is anouther matter.

peace.
Click to expand...


The bible was based directly from the word of god.
 
You don't necessarily have to believe that any of the 100,000 men are you father.
Click to expand...

But each of them keeps telling you that if you don't believe they are your father, you're going to burn forever, (including the one that is your real father).

Why is he not here? You didn't answer that. Maybe he's setting up a place better, nicer, and far more comfortable than the shithole we're living in now, and you and your mother are going to live there when it's all ready.
Click to expand...

But your mother tells you that he always could have made a better, nicer, more comfortable environment but didn't because he wants to test you to see if you're worthy of his time first.

As for turning a blind eye, when a child learns how to stand, walk, ride a bike, etc., there's a lot of time there when your parents aren't holding your hand. You have to learn to do it on your own. So you fall and maybe get hurt. To pull from Mosheh's post, did you learn anything from it? Like how to control yourself? If god seems to be turning a blind eye to the suffering of humanity, could it be that we need to learn how to ease it ourselves before calling on a diety to intervene?
Click to expand...

But then why now? Judging from the bible, several eons ago god was readily present. He sat on mountaintops telling people what to do, walked around the middle east healing the blind and crippled until he got strung up, rescued people from slavery by using all kinds of powers at his disposal, killed children all because they called a man "baldy", and so on.

If someone was to insult me I should be able to say: "god, kill that person for me", and *wham* it's done. Some vicious man-eating hedgehogs should crawl out from their hiding place and tear the person to bits.

So why the sudden vacation?

Instead of playing an active role with his creation anymore, it seems the best he can muster is to create mince pies with the face of Mary on them.

You know, if he came down - sat on the top of Everest and said "hello", nothing would change in this respect. People could still turn away from him, or ignore his advice/rules etc - but then they at least would be making an informed decision.
 
SnakeLord said:
But each of them keeps telling you that if you don't believe they are your father, you're going to burn forever, (including the one that is your real father).
Click to expand...

Then they're all probably one and the same. You have to believe in all of them, which means you can't believe in any of them.

Atheists can't believe in God because they only believe in physical things. They call the father of their body the only father because they think they are a body. The body is a tool which the self uses. God is the father of our self.

So why the sudden vacation?
Click to expand...

People no longer know God. The Bible says Moses was the last person God talked to "face to face".

You know, if he came down - sat on the top of Everest and said "hello", nothing would change in this respect. People could still turn away from him, or ignore his advice/rules etc - but then they at least would be making an informed decision.
Click to expand...

The problem is that people couldn't be sure it was really God, right? Some might believe it was an alien for example.
 
Then they're all probably one and the same. You have to believe in all of them, which means you can't believe in any of them.
Click to expand...

You know, you talk so much blatant shit I would really you rather not respond to my posts. I know, I know.. I can add you to ignore etc etc, but I thought it worth asking first.

They call the father of their body the only father because they think they are a body.
Click to expand...

What are you drivelling on about?

People no longer know God.
Click to expand...

Uhh.. I leave a small paragraph talking about god no longer being present. You then say it's because people don't know god. Now, if we are to apply some noodle to all this, we'd come to the conclusion that "people no longer know god", because uhh... god isn't present anymore.

So, how about you stop being silly and just tell me, (in fact don't), why god is no longer around sitting on mountains like he used to.

The problem is that people couldn't be sure it was really God, right?
Click to expand...

Being an omnipotent being, I'm sure he could come up with a way to convince people. perhaps if he walked across water and healed blind people.. or something like that.

Some might believe it was an alien for example.
Click to expand...

By definition, god would be an alien.

I suppose people wouldn't know which, out of the thousands of possible gods, this specific god would be - but assuming he/she/it had the ability to talk - he/she/it could easily inform people. "My name is yhwh". Not such a big deal.
 
Snakelord- Hey, where can I get some of those hedgehogs? :)

The Deists never prayed to god for anything, believing that man had no right to dictate to god. If they wanted something bad enough, they worked for it. They offered prayers of thanks when things went right, such as a good harvest, but if things went wrong they blamed it on bad luck or their own shortcomings. Maybe that's why our prayers go unanswered. We have no right to dictate to god.

I can't imagine telling my dad "I want a Corvette" and having him hop up out of his chair and going and getting me one. More likely he'd mumble "Start saving up now. They're expensive."

For my part, I honestly don't believe in the concept Heaven or Hell. I understand how it fits into the Christian and Catholic scheme of things, but I see them as reward/punishment tools. I believe in an afterlife of sorts, but I believe it's what we make it. If you're genuinely cool with the way you lived your life, you get into what amounts to your own personal heaven. If you aren't cool with it or have some things you want to work out spiritually, you go back and try again (which some may argue is hell enough).
 
SnakeLord said:
So, how about you stop being silly and just tell me, (in fact don't), why god is no longer around sitting on mountains like he used to.
Click to expand...

God is still everywhere but people no longer recognize him with the word God. Some atheists have also seen him but without knowing it was what religions call "God". There are many people who call themselves atheists who follow God without knowing it, and there are many people who call themselves followers of God but they follow the devil.

Being an omnipotent being, I'm sure he could come up with a way to convince people. perhaps if he walked across water and healed blind people.. or something like that.
Click to expand...

All humans can walk on water and cure blind because God is within us.

By definition, god would be an alien.
Click to expand...

We're all parts of him, the body of Christ.

I suppose people wouldn't know which, out of the thousands of possible gods, this specific god would be - but assuming he/she/it had the ability to talk - he/she/it could easily inform people. "My name is yhwh". Not such a big deal.
Click to expand...

My name is YHWH.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top