invert_nexus said:
I didn't come to this forums for the religion part.
But since I am here...
:m:
Allah is NOT a god
- Thread starter Sufi
- Start date
I didn't come to this forums for the religion part.
But since I am here...
:m:
I meant no offense, Bruce. I just thought it was funny that he went from language to theory in the other thread and in here hasn't been refuted so he keeps going. I'm disappointed that you're not a natural arabic speaker though (in other thread). Where's Proud Muslim when you need him? Wish he could be as cool as you are.
And :m: They let you do that in Islam? Wouldn't that be part of the proscription on alcohol and the like?
And :m: They let you do that in Islam? Wouldn't that be part of the proscription on alcohol and the like?
invert_nexus said:
I am a native speaker and although the other languages have taken their toll, I am working on my arabic again (12th century literature).
As for the :m: I don't think that typing :m: inhibits my mind. It is less work than writing: "may peace be upon you". So It's kind of a manifestation of my lazyness.
May peace be upon you.
Pardon. Must have misunderstood in the other thread. Apologies.
No problem.
:m:
:m:
W
WildBlueYonder
Guest
allah is limited by his creator, Mohammad revised the crescent-moon god; making a distant, false godSufi said:
'allah' is 'the god' in arabic, the title for the crescent-moon god of Mecca. as a Christian, I believe that you need to know that Jesus is your "Savior", that He died for your sins, that He rose again & that He will come again to judge us.
our misconseptions lead us to error, "allah" is a pagan crescent-moon god, that Mohammad took, shed the wife & daughters & re-introduced him as a 'universal' god.
Sorry, there is only one Universal God, & he speaks more than just arabic, He speaks in a love supreme, I know that I am weak, but I still hope for & look forward to the day that muslims submit to Jesus, the One that expressed True Love
W
WildBlueYonder
Guest
why thanks, it's my honor to make you look foolish, but so that we don't bore the others with our lovefest, lets stick to the topic in each post, if you need to start a tangent, why start a new thread, its that easyMedicine Woman said:
Somehow saying "limitless" and "one" together seems to be a contradiction of sorts. How can you describe something that has no boundaries as a "one"?
Once again religion boils down to just a play on words. A play on words that somehow appeals to our emotions. What is so special about being limitless anyway? How is that superior to a "condensed" god? This "limitless one" seems to focus itself whenever it wants to when it wants to communicate to prospective prophets like mohammed.
If there are no constrictions to allah then why are there rules? Rules of behaviour? Rules of obedience? There seems to be definite "do's and don'ts" to this limitness.
And if we are all part of this limitlessness then are we not as "important" as the whole? Are we not an "equal" part of this neverending allah? And if you really think of it, if we are a creation of allah and he wants us to serve him then isn't that like allah serving himself? He creates us from "him" to serve himself. Isn't that a little weird?
Once again religion boils down to just a play on words. A play on words that somehow appeals to our emotions. What is so special about being limitless anyway? How is that superior to a "condensed" god? This "limitless one" seems to focus itself whenever it wants to when it wants to communicate to prospective prophets like mohammed.
If there are no constrictions to allah then why are there rules? Rules of behaviour? Rules of obedience? There seems to be definite "do's and don'ts" to this limitness.
And if we are all part of this limitlessness then are we not as "important" as the whole? Are we not an "equal" part of this neverending allah? And if you really think of it, if we are a creation of allah and he wants us to serve him then isn't that like allah serving himself? He creates us from "him" to serve himself. Isn't that a little weird?
We are limited in being able only to sense with our specific interpretative organs. Allah is one because we are part, we may think of ourselves as one whole organism, but we all share the same existence(or non.) Jesus was a prophet sent by Allah as well.
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The "Deen" did not come to establish sovereignty over the earth but to establish sovereignty over life beyond death. Or as Hazrat ISA (Jesus) put it, "to reach the Kingdom of Heavens." This is only possible for a person if he comes to enter within his own reality.
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Where you see rules, you are merely seeing your own reasoning. The most important thing to remember is there is no god judging you for your actions, you get what you give. It is a message to live responsibly, control yourself... do not let yourself get lost in this sea of deception. Our bodies WILL rot away when we die, and that peice of matter will be forgotten with time. We are images of knowing in the sight of Allah existing by the knowledge of.
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In short, "abdiyat" (servitude) is to carry out the behavior pertaining to the reason for which one exists. However, "worshipping" is the attribution of praises to a god that the worshipper assumes is there, by dedicating a period of his time for him at his own convenience and "at his own free will," with the hope of getting something from him in return.
As a final word we shall state that, "worshipping" relates to a "god" and "god" is worshipped," but "ALLAH" is served.
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The "Deen" did not come to establish sovereignty over the earth but to establish sovereignty over life beyond death. Or as Hazrat ISA (Jesus) put it, "to reach the Kingdom of Heavens." This is only possible for a person if he comes to enter within his own reality.
---------------------
Where you see rules, you are merely seeing your own reasoning. The most important thing to remember is there is no god judging you for your actions, you get what you give. It is a message to live responsibly, control yourself... do not let yourself get lost in this sea of deception. Our bodies WILL rot away when we die, and that peice of matter will be forgotten with time. We are images of knowing in the sight of Allah existing by the knowledge of.
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In short, "abdiyat" (servitude) is to carry out the behavior pertaining to the reason for which one exists. However, "worshipping" is the attribution of praises to a god that the worshipper assumes is there, by dedicating a period of his time for him at his own convenience and "at his own free will," with the hope of getting something from him in return.
As a final word we shall state that, "worshipping" relates to a "god" and "god" is worshipped," but "ALLAH" is served.
mario said:
"Oneness" is in the sense that there are not "two" separated existences. That is, there is not a duality of a god or whatever out there and people down on earth.....
The rules are not for obeying a god out there or pleasing the hearts desire of a separate god. Rules are offerings for us to fulfill in order that we may know what is referred to as "Allah". If we obey them we get their benefit for oursleves, if we ignore them we suffer the loss.....
We are not parts of something limitless. Limitless One is unseparated, unfragmented, and so is whole. Separations are illusions, a cocoon spun by our conditionings that we should be aware of to break free......
Notice, you are labelling the preconception of god in your mind that you have been conditioned to believe or question, as "Allah" without knowing what is referred to as Allah by Mohammed (pbuh). It is not a matter of naming, the meaning behind the name "Allah" is far beyond any version of god.
We need to quit our preconception of God that thinks/acts the same way as a man to come to the point of understanding what is referred to as "Allah" as explained in the Koran.
Here where you can find further info about this point www.ahmedbaki.com
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It still sounds like you are enticed by a "oneness" instead of a singularity. What does it really matter? How is a oneness more spiritual than a separate entity? Both can be equal in power.
And this oneness DOES seem to have human characteristics. How else can allah communicate to his human prophets? He must have used a language or imagery that mohammed or jesus could understand and make other humans understand. Otherwise we would be like insects to allah...with no ability to understand this oneness.
So if we don't want to be part of this oneness we will not reap the benefits. Are we also "outside" of this oneness if we reject it? Like a piece of a puzzle that is away from the whole puzzle? Are we living in a different dimension or space if we are not part of this whole? And what are the non-benefits of not believing in allah? Sure we may not have eternal life somewhere out there in the heaven of this oneness (where is heaven anyway in relation to the oneness?) but if we are sent to a hell to suffer terribly then the "rules" of allah have been carefuly thought out. Almost like a "person" would think. It would also be a form of vengeance...almost like a "person" would feel.
Again all you have to go on is words. Words written by someone else. Human words that cannot be proven. Truth can only be shown by allah itself...without the use of just words passed from one human to another.
And this oneness DOES seem to have human characteristics. How else can allah communicate to his human prophets? He must have used a language or imagery that mohammed or jesus could understand and make other humans understand. Otherwise we would be like insects to allah...with no ability to understand this oneness.
So if we don't want to be part of this oneness we will not reap the benefits. Are we also "outside" of this oneness if we reject it? Like a piece of a puzzle that is away from the whole puzzle? Are we living in a different dimension or space if we are not part of this whole? And what are the non-benefits of not believing in allah? Sure we may not have eternal life somewhere out there in the heaven of this oneness (where is heaven anyway in relation to the oneness?) but if we are sent to a hell to suffer terribly then the "rules" of allah have been carefuly thought out. Almost like a "person" would think. It would also be a form of vengeance...almost like a "person" would feel.
Again all you have to go on is words. Words written by someone else. Human words that cannot be proven. Truth can only be shown by allah itself...without the use of just words passed from one human to another.
mario said:
You are still labelling the preconception of god in your mind as "Allah" without learning what is referred to as Allah by Mohammed (pbuh).
"Parts" of oneness!!! parts of the unseparated whole!!!
maybe... wasting life upon an illusion of god and person duality (shirk) and by expecting favor from that god remaining blind to the powers within your true self forever. We need to try to get whatever power we need in the afterlife the same way as we do try our best to get something in this world. We will not be given anything by a god from above.
it is where it is now.
Understanding and accepting oneness will not destroy the System and Order that is already operating and that we are all subjected to. It will only destroy our imagination of god and clarify our minds of a separated ego who expects favor from a god in return for worships it performs.
The Universal Mysteries is a very enlightening book.
so all is allah? all of the universe? and i am a part of this oneness as much as mario is a part of this oneness? yet i feel i am not one with mario. we do not share the same thoughts. nor the same feels. how, then, can all be one? and why would allah have to be revealed to mohammed? would not all of humanity know of allah? how's this thing work? :bugeye:
antifreeze said:
The waves in west-african coast and waves in east-american coast are distinct but they are part of one big ocean.
"We are all waves in one big ocean, that is Allah" - Hazrat Ali ibn Abi-Talib, father of sufism & 4th Caliph.
The difference is an illusion and once it is realised that both of you are parts of oneness the illusion of multiplicity vanishes; you, mario and the unchanging oneness are one and same. in other words, upon realisation of truth, your illusionary self (view) vanishes and the true oneness remains. so, at that stage, there is no question of equating non-existing individual self(s) with only the true one.
The irony is this type of knowldege is available in all parts of the world. The semantics make them fight for their own version of god.
Sufi
The concept of God is necessary to realise His/Its ultimate nature. Allah is still considered with one with attributes like in "Bismillah-ar-Rehman-ar-Rahim" (sp?). The real oneness has to comedown to a little comprehensible level to lift us up.
The concept of God is necessary to realise His/Its ultimate nature. Allah is still considered with one with attributes like in "Bismillah-ar-Rehman-ar-Rahim" (sp?). The real oneness has to comedown to a little comprehensible level to lift us up.
What a play on words. LOL Ok how about this. Does allah think? Does it have a consciousness? Is it aware of it's existence? Is it aware of you and me? Or is it just a mindless energy force that flows thru everything like gravity? If you says it thinks and is aware then it must have an ego. Thusly separating itself from us and everything else in the universe.
Leo Volont
Registered Senior Member
mario said:But if you claim that you are one with allah, and allah is one with you then you should know the answers to these questions.
Perhaps Allah doesn't have the exact words to express it either.