After/If Jesus returns what purpose will we have?

[nds1]

The belief of Christianity is that Jesus will return to the earth eventually as King and rule the earth. Satan and every other sinner will be cast out (but not destroyed I think) and everyone else will live with the Lord on the "new" earth.

My question is what will "we" or "angels" do in this new world? What will our purpose be? Currently, it seems the purpose of angels is to direct humans of the material earth to the path of God. However, after Jesus returns, there will be no more earth or humans to direct and be "guardian" angels to. What purpose will angels, and "we" if we become angels, have?

 

[heliocentric]

Prehaps a better question (or one just as interesting) would be what purpose he have?
We're gotten pretty good at contructing our own value systems via the advancedment of philosophy and other disciplines, we actually now have a far more complex sense of right and wrong than when Jesus was alive.
What would the man himself make a vegetarians or vegans i wonder, or even euthenasia?
I think hed be utterally lost.

 

[Medicine*Woman]

nds1;1226935]The belief of Christianity is that Jesus will return to the earth eventually as King and rule the earth.

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M*W: Welcome to sciforums. You are correct. This is the belief of Christianity, but statistically speaking, the believers of this include only about 25% of the world's population. What about the other 75% who don't share this belief?

Satan and every other sinner will be cast out (but not destroyed I think) and everyone else will live with the Lord on the "new" earth.

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M*W: Please explain the connection between the character of Satan and "every other sinner." Isn't that like comparing apples and oranges? Isn't the belief in Satan something like a demigod, whereas "sinners" are human beings? I don't see the comparison.

My question is what will "we" or "angels" do in this new world? What will our purpose be? Currently, it seems the purpose of angels is to direct humans of the material earth to the path of God.

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M*W: You are comparing humans to angels. Please explain your belief in this regard.

However, after Jesus returns, there will be no more earth or humans to direct and be "guardian" angels to. What purpose will angels, and "we" if we become angels, have?

*************
M*W: You are quick to say that Jesus will return when his first existence cannot be proven. How do you explain this contradiction?

Humans becoming angels is a fantasy. Believing in someone or something that never existed is delusional. I have a couple of questions for you, though. Can you prove Jesus existed? Can you prove god existed? BTW, the bible is not an historical source since most of its contents also cannot be proven either.

 

[VitalOne]

According to the Bible he will come to judge and condemn others, and wage righteous war. After he kills all the unworthy people he will start the heaven on Earth, which will last 1000 years. There will be no old age, sickness, death, etc...during this time period.

 

[spidergoat]

Don't you worry you self about it. He'll tell us what to do.

 

[nds1]

Thank you for the responses, and let me clarify some of the more vague things I pointed out.

I just want to state first that I was born into Christianity, so all of my comments and questions will probably be related to Chrisitian beliefs. However, as of late, I've seen enough hypocrisy and corruption in my own Christian church (grand larceny, people murdering their parents, etc.) to know that churches and religious institutions are by no means the answer to everything. Even though I go to church because I have to (social reasons), I don't consider myself part of any religious institution, nor do I want to be because most/all of them are corrupt or misleading. I am currently not an Atheist, Thiest, or Monotheist. You could say I am "neutral" right now.

I think my thread topic doesn't apply to just Christians, but anyone who believes in a "heaven" or after-life. Take Jesus out of the equation. What is anyone's purpose in the afterlife? Some may say: "Our purpose is to serve God/Alla/Some other supreme being." My response to that is, HOW can we serve this supreme being. On earth we can serve by giving up earthly things. In heaven there would be nothing to give up, so there is no way to serve. This means we have no purpose as beings in the afterlife. There is nothing more to accomplish. I hope we can play texas hold'em or watch TV in heaven becuase otherwise it's going to be one boring eternity.

When I mentioned Satan and "other sinners," I was talking about how in Revelations chapter 21 it says that Satan, all human souls who have physically died and went to hell, and all current sinners on the earth at the time when Jesus returns will be thrown into a "lake of fire" where they "shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever." According the Bible, after this point in time, that's the end (In fact it is the end of the book of Revelations and the bible as well). From that point on, apparently life will be the same for eternity for everyone, whether that life be on the new "heaven/earth" or in the "lake of fire."

The angel/human comparision issue is very interesting. According to the Christianity belief I was brought up in, humans physcially die and turn into angels (if God lets them), or they go to hell. I've always divided angels into two categories:
1) Angels created as angels and which were never human on Earth. These angels include the pre-satan lucifer, all the angels which he convinced to go against god and were cast out, and all the other angels which didn't side with satan
2) Angels which turned into angels from human beings


Can I prove the existence of Jesus? Nope. Do I believe he existed as the "Son of God"? I would like to believe that, but I really don't know at this point.

 

[Cris]

nds1,

Hi and welcome to sciforums. Good thread.

 

[Cris]

VitalOne,

According to the Bible he will come to judge and condemn others, and wage righteous war. After he kills all the unworthy people he will start the heaven on Earth, which will last 1000 years. There will be no old age, sickness, death, etc...during this time period.

Yup OK, and so, then what? There is an eternity to follow of - well what exactly?

 

[swivel]

VitalOne,

Yup OK, and so, then what? There is an eternity to follow of - well what exactly?

Their fantasies don't go that far.

Best not to think on them anyway, they are slippier to hold than a dream in the waking hours of the morn'.

 

[Kendall]

nds1: Do I believe he existed as the "Son of God"? It seems to me that God is the father(the creator of everything) so we would all be the son of god or the daughter! That is just what I think. Christians I think believe Jesus was the only (begotten) son of god, im not really positive what (begotten) means though.

 

[Medicine*Woman]

nds1;1227079]Thank you for the responses, and let me clarify some of the more vague things I pointed out.

I just to state I was born into Christianity, so all of my comments and questions will probably be related to Chrisitian beliefs. However, as of late, I've seen enough hypocrisy and corruption in my own Christian church (grand larceny, people murdering their parents, etc.) to know that churches and religious institutions are by no means the answer to everything. Even though I go to church because I have to (social reasons), I don't consider myself part of any religious institution, nor do I want to be because most/all of them are corrupt or misleading. I am currently not an Atheist, Thiest, or Monotheist. You could say I am "neutral" right now.

*************
M*W: I think you have an edge on your lifelong programming, and that is healthy! You were born into Christianity, but now, you are observing the realitites of it. I think you are more aware of your beliefs and more aware of the evils that you see. I am so, so proud of you! You are at an advantage than most Christians I know!

I think my thread topic doesn't apply to just Christians, but anyone who believes in a "heaven" or after-life. Take Jesus out of the equation. What is anyone's purpose in the afterlife? Some may say: "Our purpose is to serve God/Alla/Some other supreme being." My response to that is, HOW can we serve this supreme being. On earth we can serve by giving up earthly things. In heaven there would be nothing to give up, so there is no way to serve. This means we have no purpose as beings in the afterlife. There is nothing more to accomplish. I hope we can play texas hold'em or watch TV in heaven becuase otherwise it's going to be one boring eternity.

*************
M*W: My belief is that no one can serve a "supreme being." It's just not possible.

The place of heaven is very ambiguous. It's not a real place, and no one goes there. "Heaven" resides only in one's mind. In "heaven," we accept it as a place of peace. In "heaven," we provide a place of anointment. The coming of godliness begins with 'anointment.' So, how many of us have already been anointed? I would think most of us have been!

When I mentioned Satan and "other sinners," I was talking about how in Revelations chapter 21 it says that Satan, all human souls who have physically died and went to hell, and all current sinners on the earth at the time when Jesus returns will be thrown into a "lake of fire" where they "shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever." According the Bible, after this point in time, that's the end (In fact it is the end of the book of Revelations and the bible as well). From that point on, apparently life will be the same for eternity for everyone, whether that life be on the new "heaven/earth" or in the "lake of fire."

M*W: First, let me say that there is no "lake of fire." That is only literary alliteration!

Secondly, your use of biblical references is a lost cause. The bible in no way professes the the truth.

The angel/human comparision issue is very interesting. According to Christianity belief I was brought up in, humans physcially die and turn into angels (if God lets them), or they go to hell. I've always divided angels into two categories:

1) Angels created as angels and which were never human on Earth. These angels include the pre-satan lucifer, all the angels which he convinced to go against god and were cast out, and all the other angels which didn't side with satan

2) Angels which turned into angels from human beings

M*W: I have never read where angels turn into human beings or human beings turn into angels. Can you explain this event further?

Can I prove the existence of Jesus? Nope. Do I believe he existed as the "Son of God"? I would like to believe that, but I really don't know at this point.

*************
M*W: Sure, no one knows at this point, but science tells us that no god exists. If a god did exist, why would we even need a Jesus? It makes no sense to me.

Can you prove a god?

Can you prove a Jesus?

 

[Medicine*Woman]

nds1;1227079]Thank you for the responses, and let me clarify some of the more vague things I pointed out.

I just to state I was born into Christianity, so all of my comments and questions will probably be related to Chrisitian beliefs. However, as of late, I've seen enough hypocrisy and corruption in my own Christian church (grand larceny, people murdering their parents, etc.) to know that churches and religious institutions are by no means the answer to everything. Even though I go to church because I have to (social reasons), I don't consider myself part of any religious institution, nor do I want to be because most/all of them are corrupt or misleading. I am currently not an Atheist, Thiest, or Monotheist. You could say I am "neutral" right now.

*************
M*W: Well, good nds, you are questioning, and that means you are salvagable from pseudo-Christian beliefs.

I think my thread topic doesn't apply to just Christians, but anyone who believes in a "heaven" or after-life. Take Jesus out of the equation.

M*W: "Heaven" or an "afterlife" doesn't really exist. It's a metaphor for eternal peace, but it is truly not a place.

What is anyone's purpose in the afterlife? Some may say: "Our purpose is to serve God/Alla/Some other supreme being." My response to that is, HOW can we serve this supreme being. On earth we can serve by giving up earthly things. In heaven there would be nothing to give up, so there is no way to serve. This means we have no purpose as beings in the afterlife. There is nothing more to accomplish. I hope we can play texas hold'em or watch TV in heaven becuase otherwise it's going to be one boring eternity.

M*W: There is no "purpose" to an afterlife. It simply doesn't exist. All we have is our lifetime. There is nothing following that. Heaven does not exist, therefore, it does not have a "purpose."

When I mentioned Satan and "other sinners," I was talking about how in Revelations chapter 21 it says that Satan, all human souls who have physically died and went to hell, and all current sinners on the earth at the time when Jesus returns will be thrown into a "lake of fire" where they "shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever." According the Bible, after this point in time, that's the end (In fact it is the end of the book of Revelations and the bible as well). From that point on, apparently life will be the same for eternity for everyone, whether that life be on the new "heaven/earth" or in the "lake of fire."

M*W: Surely, you don't believe anything that is stated in the bible as truth! The bible is a dramatic work, and should not be considered to be truthful!

The angel/human comparision issue is very interesting. According to the Christianity belief I was brought up in, humans physcially die and turn into angels (if God lets them), or they go to hell. I've always divided angels into two categories:

1) Angels created as angels and which were never human on Earth. These angels include the pre-satan lucifer, all the angels which he convinced to go against god and were cast out, and all the other angels which didn't side with satan
2) Angels which turned into angels from human beings

M*W: All fantasy. I'm shocked and appauled that anyone could believe in this fantasy!

Can I prove the existence of Jesus? Nope. Do I believe he existed as the "Son of God"? I would like to believe that, but I really don't know at this point.

M*W: Yes, we all would like to believe in certain things. The reality of it is that belief in Jesus and god is a delusion. Believing in ourselves is a reality. That's all we have. We create our own miracles. That's the extent of it.

 

[Nickelodeon]

What purpose do we have now?

 

[nds1]

Thank you Cris and all for your welcomes and replies. This is an excellent forums site and I'm happy to be a part of it.

 

[VitalOne]

VitalOne,

Yup OK, and so, then what? There is an eternity to follow of - well what exactly?

According to The Bible, then Satan will be allowed back on Earth, and the lower beings will be allowed back. After that, The Bible doesn't say really what happens. I guess things just go on as they have before.

 

[nds1]

Vital One you stated that:

According to The Bible, then Satan will be allowed back on Earth, and the lower beings will be allowed back. After that, The Bible doesn't say really what happens. I guess things just go on as they have before.
___________________________________________________________

True, the Bible does say in Revelations that Satan will be allowed back on earth after being thrown in a pit for 1000 years. Then he will be allowed back for a short time to do his thing. However, Revelations goes on to say that after he returns, God will eventually throw him in a "lake of fire" along with every other "sinner" where they will be tortured permanently. And while they are in "time-out" for eternity being tortured, everyone else and God will be living it up on the "new earth" for eternity. The end.

So what now? Satan and his boys are being tortured for all eternity, and everyone else is just enjoying themselves on the the new heaven/earth type deal. What left if there to do for both God and Us? Do we all just stand around in a state of bliss for eternity? Are we slaves to God and do we have an eternity of "busy work" since there is no real work to do? There is no war anymore so angels in this world can't be soldiers. There is no "old earth" anymore so the angels can't be "guardian angels" and look after or influence earthly humans. The "guardian angels" and "soldiers" of heaven in effect become unemployed. What's left? There's no way to serve God. There's nothing to do. There is no hope, since there is nothing to look forward to.
I suppose we could always head over to the Lake of Fire and make fun of Satan and all the sinners who are being tortured. That would be fun, right?

Oh, I just figured it out. Eventually a high ranking angel will challenge God out of either anger or pure bordeom and will become the second Satan. Hence the sick, twisted cycle begins over and over and over.........

 

[c7ityi_]

what we do in heaven doesn't really matter now.
the important thing on earth is to try get to heaven.

when you drive somewhere with your car.
don't think too much about what you will do when you get there.
concentrate on the driving or you might have an accident.

Can you prove a god?

can you prove that i exist as a human instead of just some words on this computer screen?
you can just assume. believe.

M*W: There is no "purpose" to an afterlife. It simply doesn't exist. All we have is our lifetime.

non-existence doesn't exist either, so why do you think you will become non-existent?

 

[Cris]

c7,

what we do in heaven doesn't really matter now.
the important thing on earth is to try get to heaven.

Why?

 

[KennyJC]

According to the Bible he will come to judge and condemn others, and wage righteous war. After he kills all the unworthy people he will start the heaven on Earth, which will last 1000 years. There will be no old age, sickness, death, etc...during this time period.

HAHAHAHAhahahahahahahaha....

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!

...

Hehe.

 

[geeser]

T I hope we can play texas hold'em or watch TV in heaven becuase otherwise it's going to be one boring eternity.

well you could go where, we're aledgedly going, here.

If there is a special Hell for atheists and other nonbelievers, I shall never fear for my comfort. The musings of Epicurus will entertain my mind and Voltaire will tickle my wit. While Paine harries the Devil, Franklin will write us a constitution. Cicero, Madison and Frederick the Great can in turn conspire a government that Marx will quickly deride.

Goethe and Poe will tell delightfully chilling tales by the eternal lake-of-fire-side. Mrs. Cady Stanton and Mrs. B. Anthony will preserve our equality and Darwin will write our history. Messieurs Robert Ingersoll and Bertrand Russell will entertain our ears in the theatre built by Carnegie and designed by Frank Lloyd Wright, and they'll speak through the sound system invented by Thomas Edison.

Twain will make us laugh with his satire of old split-foot and criticism of the almighty, and Clarence Darrow will win his right to do so. Nietzsche will philosophize and Freud will analyze. Wells and Roddenberry will give us fantasy, Frost will give us poetry, Shaw will write us a play and Hepburn will be the queen of the stage.

Virginia Wolff will biographize our very own Margaret Sanger, a choice we'll all applaud. Rubinstein will play us a tune and Berlin will pen the words. Charlie Chaplin will adapt for film a comedic tale of H.P. Lovecraft and Earnest Hemmingway that will star W.C. Fields. Howard Hughes will fund the disastrous project.

Pearle Buck and Ayn Rand will make us think and give Skinner thoughts to study. Snoopy will once again have daily installment in our paper, with Schultz returning to the drafting table. All in all I will be quite entertained.

My social calendar will be full to busting, and I'll have many calls to make. The Huxleys (Aldus, Thomas, and Sir Julian Sorell) will be worth a talk on biology and authorship. Perhaps I myself can compose the great novel of the underworld with the help of Lawrence, Orwell, Joyce and Asimov.

I am in good company in my disbelief.

Nevyn O'Kane

http://www.sciforums.com/showthread.php?t=39484