Accepting Defeat
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We all have to go sometime.
Enmos
Valued Senior Member
True. So in which camp are you ?
Enmos
Valued Senior Member
Synonyms: These verbs mean to triumph over an adversary.
Defeat is the most general: "Whether we defeat the enemy in one battle, or by degrees, the consequences will be the same" (Thomas Paine).
Conquer suggests decisive and often wide-scale victory: "The Franks . . . having conquered the Gauls, established the kingdom which has taken its name from them" (Alexander Hamilton).
Vanquish emphasizes total mastery: Napoleon's forces were vanquished at Waterloo.
Beat is similar to defeat, though less formal and often more emphatic: "To win battles . . . you beat the soul . . . of the enemy man" (George S. Patton).
Rout implies complete victory followed by the disorderly flight of the defeated force: The enemy was routed in the first battle.
Subdue suggests mastery and control achieved by overpowering: "It cost [the Romans] two great wars, and three great battles, to subdue that little kingdom [Macedonia]" (Adam Smith).
Subjugate more strongly implies reducing an opponent to submission: "The last foreigner to subjugate England was a Norman duke in the Middle Ages named William" (Stanley Meisler).
To overcome is to prevail over, often by persevering: He overcame his injury after months of physical therapy.
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/defeat
Defeat is the most general: "Whether we defeat the enemy in one battle, or by degrees, the consequences will be the same" (Thomas Paine).
Conquer suggests decisive and often wide-scale victory: "The Franks . . . having conquered the Gauls, established the kingdom which has taken its name from them" (Alexander Hamilton).
Vanquish emphasizes total mastery: Napoleon's forces were vanquished at Waterloo.
Beat is similar to defeat, though less formal and often more emphatic: "To win battles . . . you beat the soul . . . of the enemy man" (George S. Patton).
Rout implies complete victory followed by the disorderly flight of the defeated force: The enemy was routed in the first battle.
Subdue suggests mastery and control achieved by overpowering: "It cost [the Romans] two great wars, and three great battles, to subdue that little kingdom [Macedonia]" (Adam Smith).
Subjugate more strongly implies reducing an opponent to submission: "The last foreigner to subjugate England was a Norman duke in the Middle Ages named William" (Stanley Meisler).
To overcome is to prevail over, often by persevering: He overcame his injury after months of physical therapy.
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/defeat
Enmos
Valued Senior Member
And that would be me. It might look like I have condeded, but I have just backed off to regroup and come up with plan B. I might surrender, but I never give up.
A scientist would have to be able to accept defeat when faced with indisputable evidence. Theists on the other hand.......well.....
Fraggle Rocker
Staff member
I wasn't following this thread but I got your PM. I don't see any need for a linguist. The word "defeat" is not very precise. It can mean anything from the overthrow of a government to the loss of a game of chess to the frustration of someone's yearning for one more piece of chocolate by grabbing the last piece yourself. You folks are arguing over psychology and philosophy, which is probably why the thread didn't pique my interest.
I'm sure you can all find your way to dictionary.com, especially now that you have the URL.
While you're all there, look up the proper spelling of Carthaginian. They were the citizens of the empire that formed in the region of Carthage, an ancient city near modern Tunis. It was destroyed twice so we don't have good records of its history but it may have been founded by the great seafaring Phoenicians. It was one of the strongest civilizations in the Mediterranean region from around 800BCE to 150BCE, rivaling (and nearly defeating) Rome. Carthage was one of the largest cities of the ancient world and its walls were never breached. Nonetheless, the Romans eventually overran the city and enslaved its inhabitants, bringing Carthaginian culture to an end. As a Roman city it was subsequently overrun by the Vandals and under their rule once again became one of the most important cities in Western civilization, continuing under Byzantine rule. Then after the rise of Islam it was destroyed again by the Arabs.
If you want to talk about "defeat" in the worst possible way, Carthage would be a good example.
The word defeat is precise & simple enough if only people would use it correctly without absurdly attempting to add psychology and philosophy to the definition. It does not mean anything from the overthrow of a government to the loss of a game of chess to the frustration of someone's yearning for one more piece of chocolate by grabbing the last piece yourself. It can be used in describing those events.
Enmos
Valued Senior Member
I wasn't following this thread but I got your PM. I don't see any need for a linguist. The word "defeat" is not very precise. It can mean anything from the overthrow of a government to the loss of a game of chess to the frustration of someone's yearning for one more piece of chocolate by grabbing the last piece yourself. You folks are arguing over psychology and philosophy, which is probably why the thread didn't pique my interest.
I'm sure you can all find your way to dictionary.com, especially now that you have the URL.
While you're all there, look up the proper spelling of Carthaginian. They were the citizens of the empire that formed in the region of Carthage, an ancient city near modern Tunis. It was destroyed twice so we don't have good records of its history but it may have been founded by the great seafaring Phoenicians. It was one of the strongest civilizations in the Mediterranean region from around 800BCE to 150BCE, rivaling (and nearly defeating) Rome. Carthage was one of the largest cities of the ancient world and its walls were never breached. Nonetheless, the Romans eventually overran the city and enslaved its inhabitants, bringing Carthaginian culture to an end. As a Roman city it was subsequently overrun by the Vandals and under their rule once again became one of the most important cities in Western civilization, continuing under Byzantine rule. Then after the rise of Islam it was destroyed again by the Arabs.
If you want to talk about "defeat" in the worst possible way, Carthage would be a good example.
Thanks Fraggle.
The problem is that SAM (for instance) is only taking the most extreme meaning of 'defeat' and ignores all the others:
If you go in with the mindset that "winning this match is the only way to go" it will not prepare you for defeat, from psychological standpoint. I believe such a mindset to be quite often short term in reward even if you do win. Going into battle with an open and accepting mind will prepare you for the rough road ahead in life.
Playing sports definately grants you the opprotunity to learn the concepts of defeat and victory correctly, but you need to go into the battle with right attitude, because even if you do lose, you end up winning by learning something from it. Unless of course you die, then you learn nothing
If you go in with the mindset that "winning this match is the only way to go" it will not prepare you for defeat, from psychological standpoint. I believe such a mindset to be quite often short term in reward even if you do win. Going into battle with an open and accepting mind will prepare you for the rough road ahead in life.
Playing sports definately grants you the opprotunity to learn the concepts of defeat and victory correctly, but you need to go into the battle with right attitude, because even if you do lose, you end up winning by learning something from it. Unless of course you die, then you learn nothing
Fraggle Rocker
Staff member
That's the problem with the philosophy boards. It's hard to enforce the scientific method. You can challenge any assertion anywhere on SciForums so long as your challenge is in good faith and you have a legitimate objection. But resolving a challenge here will be difficult. When someone starts a discussion based on a word with a slippery definition, it's not going to go well.
It's not a matter of a slippery definition. It's slippery thinking.
Philosophy has no place in the definition of defeat. Philosophy is involved in the topic of accepting defeat.
Philosophy has no place in the definition of defeat. Philosophy is involved in the topic of accepting defeat.
Without an agreed definition of key terms it is not possible to proceed with a philosophical discussion. Of course some of the people don't seem to actually be looking to have a discussion, but starting with agreeable definitions is a cornerstone.
Of course without a neutral ref the likelihood of arriving at a definate conclusion is minimal too. But such is life.
Of course without a neutral ref the likelihood of arriving at a definate conclusion is minimal too. But such is life.