a simple question

Yorda said:
True self, like the dog in your avatar :p
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getting personal are we, poor show, Yorda.
Yorda said:
False hope can make you happy. But afterlife is not false hope, it's a reality that the ancient people discovered.
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have you some evidence for this assertion, thanks.
this is off topic, put it in another thread.

and also off topic, talking about Theresa
everneo said:
Church was initially hesitating to canonize her as there was a lack of miracles (!) performed by her.
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there were no miracles performed by her.
unless you have evidence of some, post them up.
put this in another thread too.

so far all we had that religion brought about solely on it's own, is the two things Bertrand Russell stated the calendar, and eclipses, but wasn't these down to the scientists of the time, appeasing their God king.
 
audible said:
there were no miracles performed by her.
unless you have evidence of some, post them up.
put this in another thread too.
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Where did I say she performed miracles ?!

You are yet to name some, who did her feat but without faith in god.
 
everneo said:
Where did I say she performed miracles ?!

You are yet to name some, who did her feat but without faith in god.
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you intimated it in you statement, here "a lack of miracles (!) performed by her" you didn't say no miracles, you only stated a lack of miracles suggesting, she had performed some.

And I dont need to name some, but heres a non-faith organization, that gives and does just as much as Mother Theresa, a huge group of unsung heroes, Medecins sans frontieres : http://www.doctorswithoutborders.org/ whilst theresa stayed in one place they go all over the world.

and again this is off topic, start a new thread, if you want to talk about Theresa.
 
What about nurses, paramedics etc they all do the same as mother theresa, all heroes.
my Doctor, Dr slater ( a humanist/atheist, I might add) died just recently he devoted his life to healing the sick, but no sainthood for him.
but he was equally as caring as mother theresa, if not better, he did it because he wanted too, not to appease some god thing.
there are people all over the world who are not religious, that are morally more caring than any religious person.

now we need to get back on topic
 
the point I was trying to make is that you dont have to subscribe to religion if you dont believe in it, in fact you really dont need religion at all.
 
Crunchy Cat said:
I'm not sure how any of that is relevant. The thread asked a simple question I provided an answer that is well supported by observing human behavior. I am not sure what you are contesting beyond that.
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you said that it was easier for people to adorn their lives with their imaginations using religion than with other things, and i disagree. i agree that people use religion to do this, but they also use a variety of other things as well. i brought up capitalism, and the lies people believe in order to justify their greed and a system of glorified slavery. how about our governments? just another institution that attempt to control people with lies. and it works! what about drugs? people tell themselves all kinds of lies to rationalize drug use and abuse. how about sex and relationships? talk about some messed up sh*t! people adorn their lives with imaginations in more ways than one.
 
shichimenshyo said:
the point I was trying to make is that you dont have to subscribe to religion if you dont believe in it, in fact you really dont need religion at all.
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i concur. saying that people "believe in religion" is like saying that people "believe in government". it's an institution. it's not god himself.
 
audible said:
you intimated it in you statement, here "a lack of miracles (!) performed by her" you didn't say no miracles, you only stated a lack of miracles suggesting, she had performed some.
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It was the view of church, not mine.

And I dont need to name some, but heres a non-faith organization, that gives and does just as much as Mother Theresa, a huge group of unsung heroes, Medecins sans frontieres : http://www.doctorswithoutborders.org/ whilst theresa stayed in one place they go all over the world.
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A lot of NGOs do such work in the fields of health, education and welfare. Are you suggesting individual members of these organizations have no faith ?


and again this is off topic, start a new thread, if you want to talk about Theresa.
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You asked for it, but don't like it, so don't want to hear it.
 
everneo said:
It was the view of church, not mine.
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but you posted it, so it's yours, if you had posted a link to the church then it would have been theirs.
everneo said:
A lot of NGOs do such work in the fields of health, education and welfare. Are you suggesting individual members of these organizations have no faith ?
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no of course not, however humanistic organizations, do tend to be secular.
everneo said:
You asked for it, but don't like it, so don't want to hear it.
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I don't mind in the least talking about her, but it should be in another thread.
This thread about the good that religion, has solely brought about, not only Mother Theresa.
 
shichimenshyo said:
Everyone has a choice.
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well shichi, it's like this...after what's happened to me, it can't be a choice. i could deny it, but i would have to be demented, and dementia isn't a choice, or i could not deny it, but in light of it, choose to reject him, but that's still a validation of a belief in him. because of what i have experienced he is real to me. to me, he is not a religion or a theory or a doctrine or an opinion. he IS.

it would be like me telling you that you have a choice as to whether or not to believe in your mother or father. i mean, you may not trust them, or may not like them, and that's a choice you make. but whether they exist is not. see?
 
but whether they exist is not. see?
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Indeed. Trying to believe in the existence of a certain god is like trying to force yourself into believing in leprechauns or mermaids. It isn't a 'choice'. My only quarrel is that all these good folk are going to burn for eternity because of something they have no choice in. Oh well, easy come easy go.
 
SnakeLord said:
Indeed. Trying to believe in the existence of a certain god is like trying to force yourself into believing in leprechauns or mermaids. It isn't a 'choice'. My only quarrel is that all these good folk are going to burn for eternity because of something they have no choice in. Oh well, easy come easy go.
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snakelord, first of all you gotta know that i love you, and i believe we have come a long way over the years. i preface this because i posed this same reply to greenberg in another thread and now he's stalking me with hate. ok, so it is my belief, based upon my own personal life experience, and confirmed by scripture, that the only thing between you and the knowledge of god is you. from my experience, the knowledge of him is EXTREMELY consequential, and since he knows EVERYTHING (about you), he takes your intentions into consideration. my question to anyone is, "would you really want it and why?"

if you do, and to this world, let me tell ya, you gotta be outta your fing mind.
 
Lori_7 said:
you said that it was easier for people to adorn their lives with their imaginations using religion than with other things, and i disagree.
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I see. Well, lets take a look at some objective evidence so disagreement is no longer an option:

1) Religion is the oldest, most robust, and most well established exercise of the human imagination.

2) Religion reinforces its persistence by meeting human psychological needs and appealing to human emotion and anthropmoprhic understanding.

3) Religion provides an easy entrance (low expenditure of energy) for newcomers and actively seeks to recruit new members.

4) Creativity is not easy for most people.

5) Humans are more likely to choose the highest gain for the least amount of energy expended rather than the lowest gain for the most amount of energy expended.

6) 85%-90% of the worlds population indulges in religion.

This strongly supports that religion is the easist method to adorn oneself with the human imagination as it provides a well established fantasy that is easily accessible to all.

Lori_7 said:
i agree that people use religion to do this, but they also use a variety of other things as well.
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I agree.

Lori_7 said:
i brought up capitalism, and the lies people believe in order to justify their greed and a system of glorified slavery.
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A slave is a person who is the property of and wholly subject to another; a bond servant. You are welcome to show how captalism results in this. As for what lies you are speaking of, I have no idea so my judgement on the assertion is suspended.

Lori_7 said:
how about our governments? just another institution that attempt to control people with lies. and it works!
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Correct. Lying is a great way to control people; however, not all assertions by a government are lies nor do I know what lies in particular you don't like.

Lori_7 said:
what about drugs? people tell themselves all kinds of lies to rationalize drug use and abuse.
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Correct.

Lori_7 said:
how about sex and relationships? talk about some messed up sh*t! people adorn their lives with imaginations in more ways than one.
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Correct and I agree.
 
audible said:
but you posted it, so it's yours, if you had posted a link to the church then it would have been theirs.
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wtf? better you read that post again to have some clue.

I don't mind in the least talking about her, but it should be in another thread.
This thread about the good that religion, has solely brought about, not only Mother Theresa.
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Religion does not have hands and legs.
 
One thing religion does for people is help them overcome the Tragedy of the Commons. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tragedy_of_the_commons

This would be especially important for agricultural or pastoral people, who must defer gratification, moderate greed, and render mutual aid to the point of serious hardship sometimes if they are to survive in the long run.

And we find religion much more prominently featured and important in the daily lives of agricultural and pastoral people.
 
if nothing else religion is a good way to get out of just about anything.. work, sex, a shot, a blood transfusion, marriage, school, this list is endless:)
 
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