A Challenge

[EvilPoet]

Originally posted by answers
I'm having trouble not to swear at you people right now, the only thing holding me back, is the fact that I know the devil is behind what you think, and I should hate the sin and not the sinner. I don't care how you reply to this, because the fact remains that true Christians do great work, and you hate them for it.

"Judge not, and ye shall not be judged: condemn not, and
ye shall not be condemned: forgive, and ye shall be forgiven:
Give, and it shall be given unto you; good measure, pressed
down, and shaken together, and running over, shall men give
into your bosom. For with the same measure that ye mete
withal it shall be measured to you again."
-Luke 6:37-38 (KJV)

 

[SnakeLord]

To be honest, I think you will learn more about God from your relationship with your child than from me or anybody here.

Well i'd actually disagree. When looking at a young child you notice the distinct lack of need for any god. They are just like the offspring of any species of animal. Unfortunately the young mind is extremely corruptible. Eventually the adults tell the child about the tooth fairy, santa claus, god, not walking under ladders, saying good morning to magpies, not breaking mirrors, throwing salt over their shoulders, hanging horse shoes above their doors, and a whole array of frankly rather pointless stuff.

My daughter came to see me the other day and spoke of fairies. She had seen them on a cartoon. She is also a tiny bit more uncomfortable with the dark because there might be monsters. When she was a young baby there was none of this. Being corrupted by society and adults, a childs mind grows up believing what we tell them. They have no reason to doubt us so when we say: "santa claus is real", they will just accept it.

But earlier in life it was all about self, all about their own survival. They had no need for god, big scary red beasts with horns or santa claus. They were in essence no different to any animal, any plant, any insect that all share that one same thing- pure survival of self. You can see at that stage- until it is forced onto them by adults- they have a distinct absence of god, the tooth fairy and the loch ness monster.

Us adults are intrigued by it, yes. We have some beliefs that are solely for the young: tooth fairy, santa claus but there are many that remain throughout adult life- and perhaps none more powerful to the mind than belief in god because of two reasons: A) You have to or you burn for eternity, and B) If you're good and nice you get another life after this one. Most people do not have it in them to completely remove something based on fear. Look how many people will act out a whole host of superstitions- because if they dont they get hurt/bad luck etc. It is the superstitions and beliefs based on fear that survive the longest and continue throughout adulthood.

Say hello to a magpie or you have a bad day: (mainly british superstition). How stupid does that sound, saying hello to a bird.. Yet people do it daily- i've even been guilty of it myself.

Dont walk under ladders: This one i guess is the most credible of them because the scientific assumption of there being a thing called gravity states anything that falls off a ladder would fall downwards and land on your head.

And for completely off-the-wall pathetic we could look at mans fear of numbers. 13, 666..... what a load of old bollocks- and something the christian religion also suffers from.

Even really simple things like covering the mouth when yawning.. Many would just see it as being polite but it's origins are religious: The religious behaviour of covering ones mouth was specifically to prevent the devil from rushinng into the body and taking up residence.

Furthermore we have star signs, reading of tea leaves, ouija, reading of the palm and on and on down the line of fantasy the humans travel.

It is pertinent to note beliefs like these work in all cultures to varying degrees, and the same goes for god.

Admittedly, a little bit of fantasy can be good for a day but you must control the fantasy- not have it control you, for to do so is to lose ones 'self'.

 

[SnakeLord]

I'm having trouble not to swear at you people right now, the only thing holding me back, is the fact that I know the devil is behind what you think, and I should hate the sin and not the sinner.

Too late. Wasn't it jesus who said even if you look at your brother in anger you have already sinned because you felt it in your heart? Thus i'm being told by a sinner that im a sinner. But more than that im being told the devil is behind my thoughts- well then i guess the big red guy with horns is behind both of us. Believing in something so unsubstantiated, so groundless is not very 'healthy'. As an example look at the Zambians. Sure- raping kids is extremely evil, (although god never said not to), but it is just like every other completely unfounded belief. Most modern day societies have developed to be slightly more peaceful but there's still plenty going on around the world. People flying planes into buildings because they know the americans have the devil behind them etc etc. Now these christians go to 'enlighten' everybody by removing their belief, (whether physically harmful or not), and replacing it with theirs. That is just as bad.

If we found a planet with alien beings the first people to land would be christians who would proceed to piss on an entire history of culture and replace it with their own.

I don't care how you reply to this, because the fact remains that true Christians do great work, and you hate them for it.

I don't specifically "hate" anyone. But this 'great work' is purely to remove someones belief and replace it with your own. There's now Africans believing in some guy called jesus. Did it ever occur to you how unfair it is to force what you 'know' upon someone else? Did anyone sit down and give a shit about these people and their beliefs, or just their own?

 

[New Life]

Originally posted by Jenyar

The passage which says they may abstain from sex for a period of prayer or fasting is in the New Testament:
1 Corinthians 7:5
Do not deprive each other except by mutual consent and for a time, so that you may devote yourselves to prayer. Then come together again so that Satan will not tempt you because of your lack of selfcontrol.

thank you, that is exactly the verse i was thinking of!

 

[answers]

AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

What is your problem with thinking we christians hate everyone in the world, that we don't care about them, that we just want to rip out their souls and kill them, what is your problem. Because that's what you make changing someones beliefs sound like. WHY do you think a persons belief is so important. Does the belief make the person, or the person the belief. Are they so dependant on each other that it should be an offence to remove the belief. If I belive something is false then I'll tell someone, I won't punch them in the head, drag them to church, and start stabbing them until they convert. What do you think christians are, nazi's or something. You say you don't hate christians, yet you also say they go around doing things which you describe as worse then murder (worse then raping 5 year old girls in fact). If I was in your shoes I'd either hate christians or love them, because to say you are not decided is to say your not sure whether someone who goes around doing things worse then rape is okay or not.

You either hate us, or love us. Don't give me a worthless hypocritical middle stance. And yes the Devil's desires are yours, you live a life away from God, that's Satan's desires, you have to be blind not to put that together. But I guess you are blind, considering you think converting someone to christianity is worse then raping 5 year old girls. Your beliefs disgust me.

By the way, I don't judge people, I judge sin, because the bible tells me what that is. And I despise sin, it disgusts me more then you could imagine, that is why I find it hard not to swear at the source of sin or those through whom sin comes.

I don't really care if you understand this or not. Right now you see no problem with sin. Right now you think Christians should go to hell. Right now you think a persons beliefs are more important then a persons life, even if the belief is rubbish. Yet you are hypocritical because you believe that a persons belief in christianity should be hidden. Right now you are darkness. I don't think God will ever make you light, and can anyone blame Him?

You think christians shouldn't change others beliefs. It's like looking at a person help a blind man from falling off a bridge, and then despising the helper, becaues the blind man believed that no fall was about to come.

At least 3/4 of everything you attack christians with, just makes our eyes roll. Because it is so simple for us to understand what God means, yet it is impossible for darkness like yourselves, to understand light.

You should repent, but I don't think you ever will.

All sinners deserve the fire of Hell, and Satan has prepared a place just for you. I hope you laugh at this, I really hope you enjoy yourself, because this is just temporary, you've still got an eternity to burn!

 

[answers]

...

and by the way snake.... yes christians do give a @##$ about these africans. From my church alone they've sent missionaries over to put plumming in to give a village water. And made a building to house 15 children. And taken 80 prositutes (mainly children) off the street and sent them to school and given them a place to stay at.

Aren't Christians just soooo evil!

 

[doom]

To be perfectly honest with you i think religion is like guns,drugs and alcohol.

Its not the product,its the person!

Take an alcoholic,now many people drink but they do not get in this state,
why?
well cant be the alcohol otherwise everyone would be like it,see!

Guns dont kill people,its the person who fires it,but not everyone who has a gun kills people for no reason,so again its not the gun.

Religion can be the same,we know not everyones religous,why?
well its all around to pick up so youd think everyone would take to it,NO
cos its the individual.

This is important for some of my personal research into a cure for religion,im really close to an idea,its based on de-programming.

But im not apt with the subject,although the basic idea is to realise in principle that the brain is like a computer and can on occasion get habitual to a particular thing cos it makes em feel better,basically,like alcohol,drugs etc.

Now religion is also (other than a habit) like a computer virus,essentially a computer virus works by machine code telling the computer what to do and it does exactly as its told,religion is
close,although its by words/upbringing that is the way its spread.

Spread word/upringing=spread virus X habitual behavior +possible differences in brain chemicals due to spreadword/upbring x habit=religion

SW/U=SV*HB+BC=religion

 

[EvilPoet]

Originally posted by doom
Now religion is also (other than a habit) like a computer virus,essentially a computer virus works by machine code telling the computer what to do and it does exactly as its told,religion is close,although its by words/upbringing that is the way its spread.

"Consider the idea of God. We do not know how it arose in the meme pool. Probably it originated many times by independent 'mutation'. In any case, it is very old indeed. How does it replicate itself? By the spoken and written word, aided by great music and great art. Why does it have such high survival value? Remember that 'survival value' here does not mean value for a gene in a gene pool, but value for a meme in a meme pool. The question really means: What is it about the idea of a god that gives it its stability and penetrance in the cultural environment? The survival value of the god meme in the meme pool results from its great psychological appeal. It provides a superficially plausible answer to deep and troubling questions about existence. It suggests that injustices in this world may be rectified in the next. The 'everlasting arms' hold out a cushion against our own inadequacies which, like a doctor's placebo, is none the less effective for being imaginary. These are some of the reasons why the idea of God is copied so readily by successive generations of individual brains. God exists, if only in the form of a meme with high survival value, or infective power, in the environment provided by human culture."

Source: the selfish gene by Richard Dawkins

 

[doom]

Basically psychology and the mind works in a far different way to the physical universe.

In physics it is much easier to destroy than to create.

For psychology the opposite is true,its much easier to create a problem than destroy it.

Example:might only take a few things in your life in a day to make you depressed for the next 6 months,it can take alot of work to reverse this process.

Look at how people steriotype:
very often the streiotype is based on upbringing and small amounts of experience,yet not experienced everything,this too is easier to create than destroy,
imagine over two consecutive days you get mugged by a few black people(your white),then the following week you get mugged again by a black person,this will develop a steriotype in your mind to be wary of black people,and it can be almost impossible to shift.

Religion is obviously the same,someone only stops being religous when it doesnt psychologically help them,if the mind decides its a hinderence it self reverses the process,it has happened so i know its possible.

The formula to flush religion away from anybody would be a combination of correct words,calmness,and hypnotism that convinces you that you dont need it to remove the habit.

A sequence of IQ tests could be established,then consistent logic puzzles over a period of a year,to get the mind away from it and into alternate thinking.

This could be followed by drugs to supress the feel good chemicals released during prayer which has shown to exist an alternate state,which could be switched off.

Im convinced that if the program is conducted correctly my theory could remove all religion from religous minds without imparing there ability to function.

A willing candidate would be someone who does not believe it possible and would be convinced they would come out of the tests no different.

 

[New Life]

I totally disagree with you! especially the part about doing logic problems and that to get the mind into an alternate thinking! I'm a 'hardcore' christian and yet i love to do logic puzzles and practice quite often, so how is doing logic problems going to change my thought pattern at all? it will just be more of the same!

 

[SnakeLord]

What is your problem with thinking we christians hate everyone in the world, that we don't care about them, that we just want to rip out their souls and kill them, what is your problem.

My problem? Let's see..

And yes the Devil's desires are yours, you live a life away from God

What is that? I do not believe in your god. I make my own choices but nooooooo now im with the devil etc etc. Can't you even see how self-righteous you are and how lacking you are when stepping all over someone elses beliefs and someone elses rights to be free from your damnation? If i don't accept your truth im with the devil. Frankly you make me sick.

that's Satan's desires, you have to be blind not to put that together. But I guess you are blind

Oh, so now im blind because i dont accept YOUR version of truth which has no more evidence to support it than does Lonny the Leprachaun. This is how it works: god/jesus/satan- They can all kiss my nuts. Now can YOU understand that? Don't give me any burning pit of hell shit, i hold no value to those pathetic threats.

considering you think converting someone to christianity is worse then raping 5 year old girls. Your beliefs disgust me.

Well they're going to hell, as is everyone but christians so what are you worrying about? Furthermore i didn't class it as worse- you'd know that if you'd go read it.

By the way, I don't judge people

Oh no? Don't make me laugh. A minute ago you were telling me im with the devil, im blind, etc etc etc. I belong to noone- not you, not god, not satan, not jesus, not the tooth fairy, nobody. I'm just me, yet you judge me because my beliefs differ from yours. That's the whole point. My beliefs do not state everyone who doesn't believe them burns for eternity, is acting with the devil or any other callous and frankly out of line remarks. You've separated yourselves as superior- everyone else burns. You then try and 'save' them so they can be as self-righteous and pompous as you.

I judge sin, because the bible tells me what that is. And I despise sin, it disgusts me more then you could imagine, that is why I find it hard not to swear at the source of sin or those through whom sin comes.

I too hate sin. NOT because a book tells me too but because i have morals. I do not need you, god. jesus or satan to tell me what morals are.

Right now you see no problem with sin.

What sin's that? Not believing in YOUR truth?

Right now you think Christians should go to hell.

Right now you think everyone except christians is going to hell.

Right now you think a persons beliefs are more important then a persons life

Ummm no, that's you.

even if the belief is rubbish

What gives you the right to say that?

Right now you are darkness. I don't think God will ever make you light, and can anyone blame Him?

There you go again.... telling me what you think i am. You don't judge people? Sure.

You think christians shouldn't change others beliefs. It's like looking at a person help a blind man from falling off a bridge, and then despising the helper, becaues the blind man believed that no fall was about to come.

Your own personal knowledge of what the truth is differs from the majority of people on this planet. You could very well be wrong but insist you are right above all others. You could in fact be pushing the blind guy off the bridge, instead of helping him. Your little analogy could be used for every religion, cult, ufo sighting etc.

yet it is impossible for darkness like yourselves, to understand light.

Here you go yet again judging me and claiming me to be darkness. Sick.

You should repent, but I don't think you ever will.

Don't tell me what i should do. Incase you missed it; I do NOT believe in your garbage and as such have no need to repent to a dead jew. Understand?

All sinners deserve the fire of Hell

Finally i get to see the loving side of christians....

and Satan has prepared a place just for you

Oh man, i never realised how nice, non-judgemental and caring you christians could be. Where do i sign up?

I hope you laugh at this, I really hope you enjoy yourself, because this is just temporary, you've still got an eternity to burn!

Well, thats according to your belief- there's 1,000,000 others that say something completely different.

All you've done here is show the repulsive attitude of many christians and shown further why we shouldn't sprout the shit to other people and defenceless children.

Agree with you or be doomed. Nice outlook.

 

[answers]

?

I'm not asking you to agree with me, that won't get you salvation, but the key to salvation is agreeing with God. Everything I say is pretty much just repeating the bible. That's why I said I don't judge, it's God's word that does the judging.

This post is ended anyway, I don't have time, I've got that much stuff to do at school that it's not funny.

CyA

 

[atheroy]

a perfect being wouldn't judge.

 

[Jenyar]

A perfect judge would.

 

[Balerion]

Hey Answers, you are FAR from repeating the Bible. Actually, you don't know a damn thing about that book. I would bet money you've never read past where the preist directs you. Am I wrong? No, I'm not, becuase if you did, you'd know that all men sin, so to say that all sinners belong in hell is friggin retarded. You're damning yourself with that statement.

JD

 

[EvilPoet]

"A perfect judge would."

"According to the seed that’s sown,
So is the fruit you reap there from,
Doer of good will gather good,
Doer of evil, evil reaps,
Down is the seed and thou shalt taste
The fruit thereof."
-Samyutta Nikaya