911 Investigation

[ellion]

in relation to the thread then, knowledge is knowledge, power is power. how that power and knowledge is ustilised is what scares people. the illuminati have power the freemasons have knowledge. woooh scarey.

no! it is all natural phenomena and the knowledge of its use.

so i have a little fire and the knowledge of its power, do i bring people light and warmth or do i burn their houses. make war machines or some such thing.

if your going down the route of all things are natural and their is no "good v evil" then what is your problem with the illuminate and the NWO? they are the natural consequence of our social evolution. as we evolve socially they will be destroyed as a consequence of our devlopment.

 

[duendy]

in relation to the thread then, knowledge is knowledge, power is power. how that power and knowledge is ustilised is what scares people. the illuminati have power the freemasons have knowledge. woooh scarey.

no! it is all natural phenomena and the knowledge of its use.

so i have a little fire and the knowledge of its power, do i bring people light and warmth or do i burn their houses. make war machines or some such thing.

if your going down the route of all things are natural and their is no "good v evil" then what is your problem with the illuminate and the NWO? they are the natural consequence of our social evolution. as we evolve socially they will be destroyed as a consequence of our devlopment.

but the way things are going they will make life inliveable. apoisonous prison planet. where one get's asked the question: 'are you living? and tragic answer is 'yes...BUT!'
i see the situation quite clearly. that the Luciferian philosophy, and Kabbla beliefs, ae coming from same patriarchal root as is the Abrahamic reeligions, and as also is mechanistic science. ALL caught up in the false duel between 'good and evil'. yes i a saying there IS good and there is evil. i m not trying to wish them away. but naivity is toimagine you can do away wit one xtreme. such naiveity comes form patriarchal branches of belief, because theyt are not EARTHED. they really fear Nature. the patriarchal 'hero' fears Nature. sees it as a trap and wants 'power' to escape from it. 'it' usualy being seen as female!
thus in many patriarchal myths we havete 'hero' slaying or killing etc a 'Dragon and/or Serpent' which symbolizes the Old Religion of the Goddess.
The Illuminati for instance are solar oriented as werete first invadering hordes pof earth-centred indigenous peoples.
They feared the 'dark' and demonized it. even dark-coloured skin!

 

[ellion]

but the way things are going they will make life inliveable. apoisonous prison planet. where one get's asked the question: 'are you living? and tragic answer is 'yes...BUT!'

okay so know this is the evil that you must conquer. this is the dragon you must slay. can i show you the power of symbols as it really should be because from the things you say you have been spoon fed a corruption of symbolism.

a dragon could mean many things there is no one way to interpret symbolism symbols are fluid and ever changing, for example my lake of fire that i talked of above where people share the warmth and light until the world is bruning lake of heart and passion. the same symbol can and is used in christianity as a place top be feared, the lake of fire burns with brimstone and those who work sorcery and witcvh craft shall be cast into the lake of fire. do you se e what imean about the fluidity of symbols. i hear you so many times mention the literalists who have rigid interpretation. yet you do the same, you have arigid interpretion of symbols. you would say the dragon means is the famale, or the serpent is nature. or the fruit is a mushroom. but this is literalist symbol interpretation you only give the symbols one fixed meaning that is not how symbols work.

suppose for you in your mission we look at the dragon and the knight. suppose you are the knight and the illuminate is the dragon. your sword is you knowledge of their secrets and the slaying of the dragon is the exposing of their lies. it is the fight of good and evil the hero and villain, the mythical quest for truth and for the freedom of the world from the dangers. the damsel in this story would be nature which you get to court and romance having rescued the godess.

any way you are right in that the majority of society is not earthed and not has no spiritual identity, they stuckin the machine. their interpretaion of the symbols is going to reflect this mechanistic mindset, this will be the case till humanity returns to its true identity. this mechanistic mindset is also a natural consequence of social evolution are you aware of that? you always get very imapassioned about showing people the problems of their mechanistic thinking, but that is their nature, as your is the embracing of the earth, and mine is the atonement with spirit, theirs is the controlling of the machine.

 

[shaman_]

what IS wrong wit the story in your opinion?

I remember thinking the passport thing was wierd.

me)))))you just saying that doesn't do anythig. its just an empty paragraph with no ...meat!

Well the thermite thory has been discussed plenty in this thread. I don't need to go over it again. A rational person will see that it has been debunked.

me))))))it's not mant to. it is deception. a truamtic mindfuck of massive proportions

No I am saying that if they wanted to do this for the sake of deception or "mindfuck" there is not necessarily any need to put explosives in a building that is going to be hit by a jet airliner. It makes the story all the more unlikey. You can explain away any unlikely facet of the story by just saying "its not meant to make sense".

me)))))jessuz. how many soddin clues d'ya neeeed dude. i've been FIREIN clues at yus!

I can only assume that these type of mathematical calculations seem more convincing to you because you do not have a very good education. I don't mean to be condescending but I cannot see why any reasonable person could be convinced by adding and subracting dates to try and make 11s.

me))))))of what. not sure i understand yu in tis context. if you man generally. they believe that doing such things by numerology, and symbols, that plans will work.

No you are not seeing my point. The "they" that you refer to had no control over how many people were going to be on the planes and buses. Those numbers are not part of any plan, so why are we looking at them? Because people are desperately trying to find significance in any number possible related to the event. When they don't have the numbers they want they then start adding, subtracting, multiplying and dividing to reach one of the many Illuminati numbers! It's just maths.

this shit is more than coincidence shaman_!

Adding and subtracting numbers and dates to make other ones is not proof of any secret (but not secret) organisation. You are seeing what you want to see. It is part of human nature to try and find patterns and significance out of chaos.


Here are some other calculations of the numbers loosely connected to 9/11.
"
Carroll's List of Meaningless Coincidences

the planes hit a little before and a little after 9 am
there were 4 flights that crashed with 266 people in them; 2+6+6= 14
one plane was a 767 (7+6+7 = 20)
the other a 757 (7+5+7 = 19)
the 767 has 20,000-gal fuel capacity
the 757 has a 124-foot wingspan (1+2+4 = 7)
a 767 has a 156-foot wingspan; 1+5+6 = 12
one tower was 1,362 feet high; 1+3+6+2 = 12
the other was 1,368; 1+3+6+8 = 18
the supports are 39 inches apart; 3+9 = 12
the buildings were leased for 3.25 billion; 3+2+5 = 10
the other flights were AA 77 (7+7 = 14) and UA 93 (9+3= 12) and UA 175 (1+7+5= 13)
flight 11 had 81 passengers (8+1 = 9)
flight 77 had 58 passengers (8+5 = 13), 4 crew members and 2 pilots (total=64)
Boston has 6 letters
Massachusetts has 13 letters
Pennsylvania has 12 letters
Washington D.C. has 12 letters
Los Angeles has 10 letters
The number of hijackers was 19 (9+1=10)
Names and words that don't have eleven letters in them: Osama bin Laden, Khalid Al-Midhar, Majed Moqed, Nawaq Alhamzi, Salem Alhamzi, Satam Al Suqami, Waleed M. Alshehri, Wail Alshehri, Abdulaziz Alomari, Dick Cheney, Laura Bush, Iraq, Iran, Pakistan, Muslim, Islam, Pentagon, World Trade Center, terrorism, jihad, Taliban, Koran, United States, anti-American, murder, fire, hell, stupid. "
Taken from www.skepdic.com

None of these have anything to do with Illuminati numbers but you can just discard those and concentrate on the ones that are supposedly amazing coincidences.

 

[duendy]

I remember thinking the passport thing was wierd.

me))))yeahhhhhhh. yer damn RIGHT!...work on it kid. aint JUS that!

Well the thermite thory has been discussed plenty in this thread. I don't need to go over it again. A rational person will see that it has been debunked.

me))))ithasn't been debunked. jeeesus you people are So keen to put a lid on things. you'll intrigue me a bit. you seem to have/be able to maintain BLINKERED vision.hmmmm strange. what we are exploring is that thermite which can cut through steel could have been PART of explosive devices

No I am saying that if they wanted to do this for the sake of deception or "mindfuck" there is not necessarily any need to put explosives in a building that is going to be hit by a jet airliner. It makes the story all the more unlikey. You can explain away any unlikely facet of the story by just saying "its not meant to make sense".

me)))))))try and git into their heads. they wanted the buidlings DOWN. could JUS planes demolish them as they did?that i doubt. but it was the specktacle that was wantd....also looka here what i recently found 'scientific evidence offical 9/11 story is a lie http://www.ditrianum.org/Artikelen/artikel33en.htm


I can only assume that these type of mathematical calculations seem more convincing to you because you do not have a very good education. I don't mean to be condescending but I cannot see why any reasonable person could be convinced by adding and subracting dates to try and make 11s.

me)))))'i dontmean to be condescending'---oh that's alright you thick shit

No you are not seeing my point. The "they" that you refer to had no control over how many people were going to be on the planes and buses. Those numbers are not part of any plan, so why are we looking at them? Because people are desperately trying to find significance in any number possible related to the event. When they don't have the numbers they want they then start adding, subtracting, multiplying and dividing to reach one of the many Illuminati numbers! It's just maths.

me)))nothin sinks in with you does it? so why should i make an effort? what even ATTRACTS you to tis subject if you aren't interested? trying to 'save' others...?


Adding and subtracting numbers and dates to make other ones is not proof of any secret (but not secret) organisation. You are seeing what you want to see. It is part of human nature to try and find patterns and significance out of chaos.

me)))))orrrrr itis huma nature for some to collect into secret schools that then USE patterns to communicate with. jeeeez yur thick dude....seriously. its an uphil struggle wid ya


Here are some other calculations of the numbers loosely connected to 9/11.
"
Carroll's List of Meaningless Coincidences

the planes hit a little before and a little after 9 am
there were 4 flights that crashed with 266 people in them; 2+6+6= 14
one plane was a 767 (7+6+7 = 20)
the other a 757 (7+5+7 = 19)
the 767 has 20,000-gal fuel capacity
the 757 has a 124-foot wingspan (1+2+4 = 7)
a 767 has a 156-foot wingspan; 1+5+6 = 12
one tower was 1,362 feet high; 1+3+6+2 = 12
the other was 1,368; 1+3+6+8 = 18
the supports are 39 inches apart; 3+9 = 12
the buildings were leased for 3.25 billion; 3+2+5 = 10
the other flights were AA 77 (7+7 = 14) and UA 93 (9+3= 12) and UA 175 (1+7+5= 13)
flight 11 had 81 passengers (8+1 = 9)
flight 77 had 58 passengers (8+5 = 13), 4 crew members and 2 pilots (total=64)
Boston has 6 letters
Massachusetts has 13 letters
Pennsylvania has 12 letters
Washington D.C. has 12 letters
Los Angeles has 10 letters
The number of hijackers was 19 (9+1=10)
Names and words that don't have eleven letters in them: Osama bin Laden, Khalid Al-Midhar, Majed Moqed, Nawaq Alhamzi, Salem Alhamzi, Satam Al Suqami, Waleed M. Alshehri, Wail Alshehri, Abdulaziz Alomari, Dick Cheney, Laura Bush, Iraq, Iran, Pakistan, Muslim, Islam, Pentagon, World Trade Center, terrorism, jihad, Taliban, Koran, United States, anti-American, murder, fire, hell, stupid. "
Taken from www.skepdic.com

None of these have anything to do with Illuminati numbers but you can just discard those and concentrate on the ones that are supposedly amazing coincidences.

meaningless drivel trying to be smaaaart.
listen up. enuf already. believe what yo want. OK. discussin wit you is like wit a brick wall. i have thrown clues at ya. you cant see em. so go and do someting else. video games maybe?

 

[ellion]

originally posted by duendy

"try and git into their heads. they wanted the buidlings DOWN. could JUS planes demolish them as they did?that i doubt. but it was the specktacle that was wantd....also looka here what i recently found 'scientific evidence offical 9/11 story is a lie"

http://www.ditrianum.org/Artikelen/artikel33en.htm

just make the link easier to find and click

 

[duendy]

okay so know this is the evil that you must conquer. this is the dragon you must slay. can i show you the power of symbols as it really should be because from the things you say you have been spoon fed a corruption of symbolism.

me)))))have i indeed. go on.....

a dragon could mean many things there is no one way to interpret symbolism symbols are fluid and ever changing, for example my lake of fire that i talked of above where people share the warmth and light until the world is bruning lake of heart and passion. the same symbol can and is used in christianity as a place top be feared, the lake of fire burns with brimstone and those who work sorcery and witcvh craft shall be cast into the lake of fire. do you se e what imean about the fluidity of symbols. i hear you so many times mention the literalists who have rigid interpretation. yet you do the same, you have arigid interpretion of symbols. you would say the dragon means is the famale, or the serpent is nature. or the fruit is a mushroom. but this is literalist symbol interpretation you only give the symbols one fixed meaning that is not how symbols work.

me))))))listen. i am aware of all you say, but you deeply misunderstand what i MEAN. of COURSEi am qawareof the fluidity, and associative natureof symbols. what i am very much pointing at though is the APPROPRIATIO of prepatriarchal fluid symbolism. yes??
for example, Dragon/Serpent al had different mythicpoetic meanings for indigenous peoples. serpent could mean , symbol of cycles of life and death/immortality (prepatriarchal meanin), where serpent sloughsoff skin so as to contually renew istelf. tu a metaphor for renewal of cycles of life and death. also--symbol of Goddess, and her son/lover, and the magic mushroom fruit, tc etc. Dragon , commensurate wit Serpent rpresents all ofthat and Earth energies, as does Serpent, and spine,and actual ecstasy. what patriarchy does is creates the 'hero' who slays it, subjugates it. so as to become the upstart 'god' ruling OVER Natuere.

suppose for you in your mission we look at the dragon and the knight. suppose you are the knight and the illuminate is the dragon. your sword is you knowledge of their secrets and the slaying of the dragon is the exposing of their lies. it is the fight of good and evil the hero and villain, the mythical quest for truth and for the freedom of the world from the dangers. the damsel in this story would be nature which you get to court and romance having rescued the godess.

me)))))no i wouldn't use that , because twas THE who ripped it off te Ol Religion. what THEY are--th patriarchs is divided . they divide up Nature from 'spirit'/'reason'. they are confused. i am not going to slay them. do war on them. that's there bag. i am to spaking out about it. for as said. teir modus oprandi is 'mystery'. the symbol for that term is a finger to the lips. meaning 'keep quiet'. so WE expose it. that is all

any way you are right in that the majority of society is not earthed and not has no spiritual identity, they stuckin the machine. their interpretaion of the symbols is going to reflect this mechanistic mindset, this will be the case till humanity returns to its true identity. this mechanistic mindset is also a natural consequence of social evolution are you aware of that? you always get very imapassioned about showing people the problems of their mechanistic thinking, but that is their nature, as your is the embracing of the earth, and mine is the atonement with spirit, theirs is the controlling of the machine.

ypu make it sound a little too cozy. in actuality their mechanistic mindset has and contines to totally contaminate Nature, for othe species and us. so its not about 'it's natural'. read agin tis 'Luciferianism: The Religion o Apotheosis' http://www.conspiracyarchive.com/Commentary/Luciferianism.htm

where you'll see the whole 'evolution Darwinist premise fules this mystical ideal of becoming 'gods'. it needs totally exposing. the problem is hardly NOT urgent

we cant just say 'ahhhbless em. thy're jest doin their thing'...the situation is D I R E and aint gettin any better!

 

[ellion]

we cant just say 'ahhhbless em.

i can.

thy're jest doin their thing'

but they are.

...the situation is D I R E and aint gettin any better!

then we will all die.

 

[ellion]

okay just reading about building 7. now i never heard of it before. apparently it was part of the WTC complex and it just collapsed without being hit by any plane, it just fell down. FEMA said that it collapsed due to a fire on the 5th & 7th floors, these fires apparently where started in the other two towers, and there report was inconclusive. huh? what is that about? anybody know any more?

 

[duendy]

i can.

but they are.

then we will all die.

well i aint gonna just lie DOWN and...

 

[ellion]

you scared?

i found evidence of foreknowledge! a ha!

The 1933 Double Eagle was temporarily stored in the US Secret Service Vaults at 7 WTC. It was relocated to Fort Knox months before September 11th, before its record-breaking sale in New York for $7.59 Million in 2002.
from wik:¬Pedia

 

[duendy]

okay just reading about building 7. now i never heard of it before. apparently it was part of the WTC complex and it just collapsed without being hit by any plane, it just fell down. FEMA said that it collapsed due to a fire on the 5th & 7th floors, these fires apparently where started in the other two towers, and there report was inconclusive. huh? what is that about? anybody know any more?

yes. there is a link in the early pages of tis thread. it is an interview with te owner of WTC7 Larry Silverstein--who made BILLIONS in insurance from the WTC demolition job!....also that link you gave, has several efecnes about WTC7 ie., page 12 about how building kept lots of very sensitive records that te people wouldn't haveminded being incinerated ...Enron..?. also interesting. according to tis poster--'invertedamerican' the part of the Pentagon which was destroyed also had the records for te $3.2 trillion which was missing from the DoD budget--WTC7 was also home to SS, IRS, and CIA......

 

[Alejandro]

who made BILLIONS in insurance from the WTC demolition job!

i think thats how insurance works. plus he would make more from them standing.

 

[duendy]

i think thats how insurance works. plus he would make more from them standing.

so...you've picked this and believe you've solved the crime..? and how come he'd make moreofthem standing?i am nt up on insurance scam shit. educate me

 

[shaman_]

me))))ithasn't been debunked. jeeesus you people are So keen to put a lid on things.

You will not let go of something after it has been debunked.

you'll intrigue me a bit. you seem to have/be able to maintain BLINKERED vision.hmmmm strange. what we are exploring is that thermite which can cut through steel could have been PART of explosive devices

So the the thermite thing has been shot down and you are trying to work explosives into the theory. Is their any evidence of added exlposives? No. What we have are conspiracy theorists making the claim that buildings shouldn't collapse like that. It's not like we have a point of reference when it comes to jet planes crashing into skyscrapers so I understand that perhaps what they are saying could seem possible.

me)))))))try and git into their heads. they wanted the buidlings DOWN. could JUS planes demolish them as they did?

Yes they could. Jet planes with about 20 000 thousand gallons of jet fuel smash into 2 buildings. Jet fuel burns at 800° to 1500°F, Steel loses about 50 percent of its strength at 1100°F and at 1800° it is probably at less than 10 percent. NIST reports that pockets of fire hit 1832°F. When the steel loses it's strength the building collapses. Why is it so hard to accept?

These figures were taken from the article mentioned below.

that i doubt. but it was the specktacle that was wantd....also looka here what i recently found 'scientific evidence offical 9/11 story is a lie http://www.ditrianum.org/Artikelen/artikel33en.htm

And this link debunks some of the nonsense in that one.
http://www.popularmechanics.com/science/defense/1227842.html?page=1&c=y

me)))))'i dontmean to be condescending'---oh that's alright you thick shit

Am I right in guessing that you have not done a lot of maths duendy?

me)))nothin sinks in with you does it? so why should i make an effort? what even ATTRACTS you to tis subject if you aren't interested? trying to 'save' others...?

I am argumentative. Do you see my point regarding the passengers duendy?

me)))))orrrrr itis huma nature for some to collect into secret schools that then USE patterns to communicate with.

Not the way you have been describing, no.

jeeeez yur thick dude....seriously. its an uphil struggle wid ya

When you meet any resistance to your ideas you become immature and abusive. You are a hypocrite. Respond to my points and forget the ad hominem.

meaningless drivel trying to be smaaaart.

Yes it is meaningless, just like the ones you have provided links for. What is the difference? Clearly you have missed the point here.

listen up. enuf already. believe what yo want.
OK. discussin wit you is like wit a brick wall. i have thrown clues at ya. you cant see em. so go and do someting else. video games maybe?

Is playing computer games any more a waste of time than browsing conspiracy sites and posting barely readable rants in forums? Nope.

You tend to become childish as soon as I bring up points that you do not like.

 

[duendy]

Ellion...please remind me thepage of tis thread you forewarded that occult link.....and here is ANOTHER angle about this slippery issue. as said. you gotta be flexible and keep on yur toes

OK, i was reading this article here www.propgandamatrix.com where tey are ravin about this soon to be released film A Scanner Darkly which they say will expose te dirty doings and prisonplanet future the Globalists gotplanned for us. then i noticed the release date for the film is 7th July 2006 which is exactly the anniversary of the LOndon Bombings. also noticed its being released by Warner Brothers

so, i did a search and found tis 'The Mystery Behind The Storm http://www.pointlesswasteoftime.com/film/storm3.html where i learn that GEORGE CLooney, star of the film The Perfect Storm is, allegedly, a 33degree freemson, and that New World Order references are dropped into the script and includes freemasonic symbols...! i also found out that Warner Bros are Illiminati

Now i recalled havig read tis essay, which actualy is also somewheres in tis thread--back ther some in th woods of textual investigations, and abuse. please read it carefully :
Sci-FI Predictive Programming: The Semiotic Decepion of 9-11 http://www.conspiracyarchive.com/Commentary/Semiotic_Deception.htm

so we have this situation of th actual Globalaists putting out a film supposing to 'warn us' whilst really wanting what tey 'warn' about, and propagandamatrix --not seeing this? i've emaled them about it. will wait nd see
what a miiindfrig

 

[Alejandro]

and how come he'd make moreofthem standing?i am nt up on insurance scam shit. educate me

well i dont have any insurance (no car, no medical) but i believe on pays monthly fee, then if house, business gets destroyed ins. pays out to rebuild.

how come he'd make moreofthem standing?

well now he may be paying taxes on building not producing an income, the tenants pay monthly fees for occupancy only now their all gone.

 

[ellion]

http://www.occultforums.com/

 

[Alejandro]

http://www.occultforums.com/

lets all go there and raise hell.

 

[ellion]

you may find Hell is there waiting for you