4 legged ducks, 6 legged pigs.. a question.

[spuriousmonkey]

*************
M*W: True. The ones I've seen (and I've seen a lot of them in females) look more like a freckle or a small nevi than an actual nipple. Its location gives it away, though. I've never pointed this out to the newborn's parents, and not surprisingly, they don't ask what it is. I don't recall ever seeing more than one extra rudimentary nipple on any child.

I was referring to all the baby boys being born with nipples.

 

[Cyperium]

Did Hitler have the truth?
http://www.somareview.com/mostfamouschristian.cfm

How about David Koresh?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Koresh

Or Rev. Jim Jones?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jim_Jones

What I've realized is that most people who claim to have the "truth within" turn out to be some murderous assholes!! Perhaps you will realize someday, that you are set right up to be taken advantage by someone who you may deem as enlightened and "having the truth" with in, or perhaps you yourself will claim prophetic virtue.

Nothing more than delusional people can fall for these charlatans, and you are poised to do so as well, cause you believe that such a thing exists!

It is not delusional to believe in God. What you don't realise is that alot of people commit murders for whatever reasons and that the belief in God is not a reason to commit murder. Hitler was a maniac who didn't virtue life which could be said of the other two too. It's sad that you don't think so much of other people.

What you fail to understand is that you don't know me! Personally you can't judge me by a mere few posts, you don't know what I've experienced, nor what I do know or do not know. I was once like you, and so have many others here on this very forum, but at some point some of us grow out of religious rhetoric fantasies and truly start seeking for our own truths, and truth is most of us who have sought to think outside the circle, have noticed religious rhetoric is for the illusion of being safe, watch after, by some entity whose very existence is questionable.

Well, of course I can't know you, or know what has been going on in your life, but I have to answer through the experiances of my life, if those experiances are different than yours then there is really not much to do, I don't make things up you know...

The bible is a human made up manuscript and so is every damn ancient text claiming to be word of god, this is nothing more than texts written by delusional ancient people, most of their so called prophesies came via dreams or trance induced by some drugs. What is sad though is that so many people still believe in such bull shit and give up their lives, for this crap!

You have to be inside a room to really know what is in there, you stand outside and judge those that are therein. It's not the right way and who are you to tell anyone what is false and true to believe in, it is a belief after all and there is not anything in that belief that is truly corrupting moral.

Was the bible a book claimed to have dropped from the heavens? Then it didn't come to us, it was written by desert nomads who where slaves. The bible is a corollary of many ancient myths is not all original written by the Hebrews, so many people claim the bible inerrant, but it's quite the opposite. And this has been shown here on this very forum time and time again, the bible is PROVEN to be full of inconsistencies, contradictions, and fallible in it's teaching of moral behavior, unless you deem stoning to death your own son for misbehaving and working on the sabbath moral! do you? Would you follow the laws according to the old testament? Today you would be in jail, for an amoral act, if you did!

Yes, we should follow the law of the world, but not forsake one for the other. However we should follow the New Testament where the rules were refined.

The reason why is because we are further civilized and much more moral today than the days ancient texts where written, this is why your so called perfect moral bible has failed to be a moral guide, it clearly is not, according to our laws of today. You only see stoning to death in Islam till today, that goes on, these acts are considered barbaric, but yet it's also written in the bible that this is the way to take care off some who don't follow the laws of god!

It hasn't failed since the message is still true, even though those ancient laws about how to handle slaves and so on is outdated.

And some are willing to put it back in our society today! will you stand against or with such nut psychos? Be careful of how you answer, you don't know yet who's advocating to bring back theocratic law.
http://www.yuricareport.com/Dominionism/PublicStoningNotJustForTaliban_Sugg.html

Since our God is a living God we have to respect the laws given to us today, since God is behind them also. As the world changes some laws become outdated, that doesn't matter since the laws applying to the happenings of yesterday cannot be applied to things that don't exist today anyway.

 

[Cyperium]

My apologies. As you'll know, it's impossible to cater for everyones sensitivities and fragilities. I would have written it different if I was aware you were so sensitive.

Sure you would, but now it doesn't matter since I compensated for it.

Not really. As I said, be it ass or head it doesn't change the question or the nature of it. It just so happened the first picture I found had a pig with legs growing out of the bum area.. I can find one with some extra limbs growing out of a different place if you think it will change anything.

As before, I compensated for it so that it didn't matter anymore.

Special occasions? There were like 7 different offerings to be done at frequent times, not just special occasions. Everytime you sinned, everytime a woman was on her period etc etc.

Didn't they have a priest that sacrifised for the whole village? They wouldn't have even survived if they had to sacrifise one animal for one sin. Well, if there were enough animals they would of course...but then the question at hand becomes irrelevant anyway.

Even if a god had ordered them to?

Well, I don't think that God had ordered them when there were so few animals.

Be honest for a second, is it religiously irrelevant or is it something that causes major issues with religious beliefs and thus is ignored - even though it is very relevant?

It may cause issues to the individual but generally it is religiously irrelevant, at least I feel it is. I think the issues comes because some may fail to understand that there really is a natural order of the world and that some things can be hard to understand for us, especially things belonging to that natural order. However, it is known in the Bible that God can interfer with that natural order, but in the case in the Bible it was to put a branch of the bad tree on the good tree in order to save that branch (symbolically a human).

 

[SnakeLord]

Didn't they have a priest that sacrifised for the whole village? They wouldn't have even survived if they had to sacrifise one animal for one sin. Well, if there were enough animals they would of course...but then the question at hand becomes irrelevant anyway.

Exodus and Leviticus go into some length about sacrifices - the point of which was generally to please god's nostrils, (he mentions his love for the smell of burning meat some 26 times in leviticus alone and when it comes down to his punishment threats "I will no longer like the smell of burning meat" comes well after having your kids ravaged by wild animals, plagues and so on). Exodus shows that these sacrifices were daily, but regardless to how many animals there were, (and yes killing all the perfect ones will always be detrimental), I have still yet to figure out the point of all that death just to please him and his nostrils.

Well, I don't think that God had ordered them when there were so few animals

You would be wrong. god told noah to take 2 of each animal onto the ark and 7 of each clean animal. You'd think 7 is quite a nice number, (certainly better than two), with which to repopulate a species but no.. that was not what they were there for. 5 of those 7 were to be summarily slaughtered for god. If that is not over excessive I don't know what is.

Add up the total amount of clean animals, times that by 5 and that is the amount of animals that had to be slaughtered by one family to please this being for saving them from drowning. There was nobody else to sacrifice the animals, god had annihilated them all.

Well, I don't think that God had ordered them when there were so few animals

So you would disagree that the issue is only considered irrelevant because religion can't explain it and all it really serves to do is make god either look incompetent or plain nasty?

 

[Godless]

A delusion is commonly defined as a fixed false belief and is used in everyday language to describe a belief that is either false, fanciful or derived from deception. Wiki...

It is not delusional to believe in God.

Read above!

. What you don't realise is that alot of people commit murders for whatever reasons and that the belief in God is not a reason to commit murder.

"And that prophet, or that dreamer of dreams, shall be put to death; because he hath spoken to turn you away from the LORD your God..." (Deuteronomy 13: 5)

"Thou shalt not consent unto him, nor hearken unto him; neither shall thine eye pity him, neither shalt thou spare, neither shalt thou conceal him: But thou shalt surely kill him; thine hand shall be first upon him to put him to death, and afterwards the hand of all the people." (Deuteronomy 13:8-9)

"Every one that is found shall be thrust through; and every one that is joined unto them shall fall by the sword. Their children also shall be dashed to pieces before their eyes; their houses shall be spoiled, and their wives ravished." (Isaiah 13:15-16)

With this kind of lessons from the good book how do you expect them not to be murderers?

Well, of course I can't know you, or know what has been going on in your life, but I have to answer through the experiances of my life, if those experiances are different than yours then there is really not much to do, I don't make things up you know...

Neither do I nor SnakeLord nor any atheist here make things up, it's by our experience that we have come to a conclusion that differs yours, while you accept to be deceived, we see through the deception that is Christianity and every other religion!

You have to be inside a room to really know what is in there, you stand outside and judge those that are therein.

I love metaphor, I was inside the room, I was a choir singer for a Catholic church in my youth, but lo! and behold as I grew up I grew out of fairy tale living, and into objective reality!

Yes, we should follow the law of the world, but not forsake one for the other. However we should follow the New Testament where the rules were refined.

Where they?

*When I cite these Biblical passages, do you know what these modern day immoral pseudo-Christians have the audacity to say? "Jesus took all that away." That is utter blasphemy, my friends! The very idea that the words of the Son somehow trump the words of his Father is nonsensical on its face. Do you think a Father who had spent so much time talking about killing disobedient children would allow His own upstart Son to tell folks to ignore everything His Daddy had ever said? I don't think so. If Jesus had even tried to do this, God would have yanked Him back to Heaven and given Him a good whupping with a rod. Jesus, Himself, admitted that he is subordinate to the Father who rules over Him (1 Corinthians 11:3). Jesus told the apostles that He had not come to destroy the law of the prophets of old, rather, He had come to fulfill that law (Matthew 5:17). Jesus approved of his Father's command that children who curse their parents are to be put to death (Matthew 15:3-4). Jesus chastised the Pharisees for failing to kill those children who defied their parents' commands (Mark 7:9-13). Jesus told us we are to live our lives in fear of God for God has the power not only to kill us, but to torture us forever in Hell (Luke 12:5). Jesus never contradicted his Father's word, and anyone who suggests otherwise is going straight to Hell.*
http://www.landoverbaptist.org/sermons/nosissy.html

 

[Cyperium]

A delusion is commonly defined as a fixed false belief and is used in everyday language to describe a belief that is either false, fanciful or derived from deception. Wiki...



Read above!

So what is a false belief? If a belief itself is defined as something we don't know, would every belief then be false? If I have reasons for my belief, then it wouldn't in my view be a false belief. Delusional in my view is a belief that is without foundation, or has drifted from that foundation.

"And that prophet, or that dreamer of dreams, shall be put to death; because he hath spoken to turn you away from the LORD your God..." (Deuteronomy 13: 5)

"Thou shalt not consent unto him, nor hearken unto him; neither shall thine eye pity him, neither shalt thou spare, neither shalt thou conceal him: But thou shalt surely kill him; thine hand shall be first upon him to put him to death, and afterwards the hand of all the people." (Deuteronomy 13:8-9)

Deuteronomy is a repetition of the laws they had, I don't think it is applicable today but I agree that knowingly misleading people should be punished, I don't like death penalty but at that time when death penalty was common for crimes then I wouldn't expect less. We only see bodily crimes nowadays, but spiritual crimes can be as dangerous to a man.

With this kind of lessons from the good book how do you expect them not to be murderers?

I wouldn't expect them to be murderers, since these were laws that the government had, and it wasn't expected of every man to kill anyone he saw that commited crimes (since for the first part he wouldn't have evidence, and the killing of a man according to law would have been controlled at some part by the government, we have the ten commandmends to follow for ourselves).

Neither do I nor SnakeLord nor any atheist here make things up, it's by our experience that we have come to a conclusion that differs yours, while you accept to be deceived, we see through the deception that is Christianity and every other religion!

Well, if it is your belief that you are being deceived into murdering people, no wonder you aren't inside.

Where they?

*When I cite these Biblical passages, do you know what these modern day immoral pseudo-Christians have the audacity to say? "Jesus took all that away." That is utter blasphemy, my friends! The very idea that the words of the Son somehow trump the words of his Father is nonsensical on its face. Do you think a Father who had spent so much time talking about killing disobedient children would allow His own upstart Son to tell folks to ignore everything His Daddy had ever said? I don't think so. If Jesus had even tried to do this, God would have yanked Him back to Heaven and given Him a good whupping with a rod. Jesus, Himself, admitted that he is subordinate to the Father who rules over Him (1 Corinthians 11:3). Jesus told the apostles that He had not come to destroy the law of the prophets of old, rather, He had come to fulfill that law (Matthew 5:17). Jesus approved of his Father's command that children who curse their parents are to be put to death (Matthew 15:3-4). Jesus chastised the Pharisees for failing to kill those children who defied their parents' commands (Mark 7:9-13). Jesus told us we are to live our lives in fear of God for God has the power not only to kill us, but to torture us forever in Hell (Luke 12:5). Jesus never contradicted his Father's word, and anyone who suggests otherwise is going straight to Hell.*
http://www.landoverbaptist.org/sermons/nosissy.html

You are right, Jesus never contradicted God, but refined the laws so that they became more exact, and refined also the laws that had been carried out wrongly.

 

[Cyperium]

Exodus and Leviticus go into some length about sacrifices - the point of which was generally to please god's nostrils, (he mentions his love for the smell of burning meat some 26 times in leviticus alone and when it comes down to his punishment threats "I will no longer like the smell of burning meat" comes well after having your kids ravaged by wild animals, plagues and so on). Exodus shows that these sacrifices were daily, but regardless to how many animals there were, (and yes killing all the perfect ones will always be detrimental), I have still yet to figure out the point of all that death just to please him and his nostrils.

I don't know either, really, for my part I believe that it is symbolical to sacrifice (the sacrifice may smell good because it was for a good cause), the sacrifice is ofcourse that we give away something that is of value to us, and thus showing that we can give away even our food to God. Hence we could see the sacrificial ritual as another way of giving away earthly belongings, but set in a way that strengthens the bond with God. It can also be statement that we realise that we are sinners and that sins lead to death, which we symbolically show by the sacrifice. However, now that Jesus died for our sins, that is no longer necessary.

You would be wrong. god told noah to take 2 of each animal onto the ark and 7 of each clean animal. You'd think 7 is quite a nice number, (certainly better than two), with which to repopulate a species but no.. that was not what they were there for. 5 of those 7 were to be summarily slaughtered for god. If that is not over excessive I don't know what is.

Well, over excessive is in the eye of the beholder, and depends on the situation that the beholder is in.

Add up the total amount of clean animals, times that by 5 and that is the amount of animals that had to be slaughtered by one family to please this being for saving them from drowning. There was nobody else to sacrifice the animals, god had annihilated them all.

I don't know the total amount of clean animals, and I don't know the period that they had to be killed within (if there even was a time limit).

So you would disagree that the issue is only considered irrelevant because religion can't explain it and all it really serves to do is make god either look incompetent or plain nasty?

There isn't anything that religion should explain in this matter, and I don't see why God would look incompetent or nasty. We know that neither we or the animals are perfect and that it is a matter of natural order.



Do you think that perfect can be defined by us as something that perfectly fits a equation?

If so, do you think that the world is so perfect that the perfect equation would fit?

Now, I know that we can't go that way since we don't know if a equation is true before it fits reality, but if it were the other way around, do you think it is even possible for a equation to fully fit reality? Would you, if not, think that it would prove that the world is not perfect?

I don't think that the equation would match perfectly, not because the world isn't perfect but because it is incomprehendable in the end. I don't know, I'm just curious about your oppinion.