Why isn’t God more obvious?

N

Nasor

Valued Senior Member
This is pretty much just directed at Christians, since if you have a different view of God it doesn’t really apply.

God presumably wants us to love/worship him and live according to his instructions, since he loves us and we risk hell if we don’t behave/believe properly. If that’s the case, then why doesn’t God make it a point to get noticed? God seems to have created a world in which a reasonable person can look around, think for a while, and conclude that it isn’t necessarily true that God exists. And even if you do believe in a God, it isn’t at all clear which religion is the correct one.

If God were to provide unambiguous evidence that he exists – like, say, writing a page from the Bible every night in the sky in 10 mile high flaming letters – there would probably be zero atheists. So why doesn’t he do something to let us know he’s around?
 
God wants us to come back to him by our own will, not his... If he himself made miracles in the sky, we would not be free anymore, everyone would believe - that is not freedom.

Then we would all come to the Paradise, but how long could we stay there when we have not learned God's law? We would instantly sin again if we were free. Then again, God could take care of us like he does with the animals. But this would be pointless and irrational.
 
what768 said:
God wants us to come back to him by our own will, not his... If he himself made miracles in the sky, we would not be free anymore, everyone would believe - that is not freedom.

Then we would all come to the Paradise, but how long could we stay there when we have not learned God's law? We would instantly sin again if we were free. Then again, God could take care of us like he does with the animals. But this would be pointless and irrational.
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I prayed to god for most of my life and never got a response... instead my life was depressing and sucked ass. Now that i have found another path, my life has never been better. Things are so great.

We would not instantly sin again... if we were to have that proven faith, then why would we even WANT to go against that great of power? Why would we want to cause chaos in paradise? In paradise, everyone loves it and there is nothing to complain about. Why the hell would we want to ruin that and cause it to go corrupt? Oh... yah... because we are ignorant humans, right?
 
"God presumably wants us to love/worship him and live according to his instructions, since he loves us and we risk hell if we don’t behave/believe properly. If that’s the case, then why doesn’t God make it a point to get noticed? God seems to have created a world in which a reasonable person can look around, think for a while, and conclude that it isn’t necessarily true that God exists. And even if you do believe in a God, it isn’t at all clear which religion is the correct one.

If God were to provide unambiguous evidence that he exists – like, say, writing a page from the Bible every night in the sky in 10 mile high flaming letters – there would probably be zero atheists. So why doesn’t he do something to let us know he’s around?"


Ok I am not going to just say Faith i am going to explain it to you. I presume you are not a Theist and definitely not a Christian so how can you possibly answer this question all you can do is ask just like every REASONABLE person who doesn't believe in God would ask. So here you go. There is something supernatural He did that you realize just don`t believe to be true like when you said "God seems to have created a world" WOW is that not supernatural to create a world oh and the reasonable people in it. OK this is where Faith comes in! :D Theism and Atheism requires faith. Why would you need God to write the Bible in the sky just to prove He exist because first to do that He would have to have a world right so He being God ALmighty would have to create it.Why don`t you just look around and see what He did. I don`t know how you believe the world came into existence but it requires Faith. And is it so rediculous to have Faith in something greater than you and beyond Human perspective? I think thats Reasonable. :D And one more thing I really wish you would just try even thinking about there being a God. Its obvious to a reasonable person. I can give you some reasons for what I believe. Hey, I hope what I have said will make you think and ask more questions about the Hope that I have.
 
Warrior61 said:
"God presumably wants us to love/worship him and live according to his instructions, since he loves us and we risk hell if we don’t behave/believe properly. If that’s the case, then why doesn’t God make it a point to get noticed? God seems to have created a world in which a reasonable person can look around, think for a while, and conclude that it isn’t necessarily true that God exists. And even if you do believe in a God, it isn’t at all clear which religion is the correct one.

If God were to provide unambiguous evidence that he exists – like, say, writing a page from the Bible every night in the sky in 10 mile high flaming letters – there would probably be zero atheists. So why doesn’t he do something to let us know he’s around?"


Ok I am not going to just say Faith i am going to explain it to you. I presume you are not a Theist and definitely not a Christian so how can you possibly answer this question all you can do is ask just like every REASONABLE person who doesn't believe in God would ask. So here you go. There is something supernatural He did that you realize just don`t believe to be true like when you said "God seems to have created a world" WOW is that not supernatural to create a world oh and the reasonable people in it. OK this is where Faith comes in! :D Theism and Atheism requires faith. Why would you need God to write the Bible in the sky just to prove He exist because first to do that He would have to have a world right so He being God ALmighty would have to create it.Why don`t you just look around and see what He did. I don`t know how you believe the world came into existence but it requires Faith. And is it so rediculous to have Faith in something greater than you and beyond Human perspective? I think thats Reasonable. :D And one more thing I really wish you would just try even thinking about there being a God. Its obvious to a reasonable person. I can give you some reasons for what I believe. Hey, I hope what I have said will make you think and ask more questions about the Hope that I have.
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I would think : try reading the Bible and going to church ,
I am sure most of your Questions will be answered...after all that is the place to go to find out more than you know... :cool:
 
God has displayed many miracles provided one wants to believe and uses them to believe, and I can give examples of many miracles that have enough evidence to Believe. But if the sign of the Bible text was written in the air, some would claim that the sign was aliens or it was was yet an unknown law of nature, and maybe, then, some who would claim that it was God. But in all cases, the sign itself is not enough to come to belief in God unless if the person wants to believe in God. And yet rejecting the popular reasons against belief in God, searching deeper for not just the existence of God but the joy of God, the believer may yet hope for God's grace.

But the sign may also be damaging. If someone rejects the sign, is he or she not doing a more wicked deed than if the sign was not displayed? And what would happen if someone understood the sign to be an endorsement that each and every Biblical passage literarily?
 
Come on, okinrus...
Don't you think that in God's infinite power and wisom he could come up with a way to make all people 100% sure of his existence?
Not to mention his intentions, wishes, rules and goals for humankind.

If he himself made miracles in the sky, we would not be free anymore, everyone would believe - that is not freedom.
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That's just absurd!
If we did not know that fire burns our bodies and hurts a whole lot, would that mean we were not free?
Since when is knowledge a restriction of freedom?
He could very well let us know he exists, and allow us to choose to follow him or not.
Knowledge of his existence would not impede out free will in any way, it would simply empower us with knowledge and enable us to make a more informed responsible decision.
 
one_raven said:
Since when is knowledge a restriction of freedom?
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Since forever.
If you know something, you cannot do as if it weren't there.

If I know that, for example, a have a cavity in my tooth, I cannot go on as if there wouldn't be one -- in the end, the pains will be so excrutiating that I won't be able to deny that something isn't right. I will have to go to the dentist (even though it is something I hate and fear).

Having knowledge restricts me in my actions.
Normally, I would not go anywhere near a dentist -- but knowing of a cavity, I better go there, and eventually will have to go there.


Similar goes for other knowledge. It is just that it doesn't seem as pressing, and even threatening as knowing of a cavity in your tooth.
 
No.
You are free to not go to the dentist if you choose not to.
However, the full knowledge of the repurcussions of you going on as if you did not have a cavity empowers you to make an informed decision.
If you do not know, then your tooth will rot off, and you will end up in excruciating pain.
That decision is beyond your capabilities to make since you do not know any better.
You will end up suffering because you DID NOT have knowledge, and there was nothing you could do about it.
If you DO know, you can avoid that pain if you so choose.
 
RosaMagika said:
Since forever.
If you know something, you cannot do as if it weren't there.

If I know that, for example, a have a cavity in my tooth, I cannot go on as if there wouldn't be one -- in the end, the pains will be so excrutiating that I won't be able to deny that something isn't right. I will have to go to the dentist (even though it is something I hate and fear).

Having knowledge restricts me in my actions.
Normally, I would not go anywhere near a dentist -- but knowing of a cavity, I better go there, and eventually will have to go there.


Similar goes for other knowledge. It is just that it doesn't seem as pressing, and even threatening as knowing of a cavity in your tooth.
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Oh how true you are ,!!!
you know what would be even worse ???
not knowing you had a cavity , untill the pain hit, then still not knowing
that a cavity in your tooth was the real cause of the pain ,
even worse yet, ---> that you did not believe that dentist even existed!!!
then even worse ---> people try to tell you to go to the dentist to
get it fixed, but you refuse, because you don't believe in dentist, or
that they can help you, but you say nope it is useless, even if a dentist
did exist it would only make matters worse, and do no good, besides dentist
are for the faint hearted....AND THE PRICE TO PAY IS TO GREAT......
 
Chazman: good example.

I want to ask: Is the practice of baptising infants against freedom?

Dividing people into chosen people (Jews) and gentiles is against freedom. You simply cannot choose to become his chosen people even if you want to; and vice vesa.
 
Edit: Originally posted by caffeine_fubar

I prayed to god for most of my life and never got a response... instead my life was depressing and sucked ass. Now that i have found another path, my life has never been better. Things are so great.
Click to expand...

I'm glad you've found the right way. God does not love those who walk the wrong path. Believe in your strengths, believe... hohoho!

We would not instantly sin again... if we were to have that proven faith, then why would we even WANT to go against that great of power? Why would we want to cause chaos in paradise? In paradise, everyone loves it and there is nothing to complain about. Why the hell would we want to ruin that and cause it to go corrupt? Oh... yah... because we are ignorant humans, right?
Click to expand...

Humans would still want to be free, (in paradise we only do God's will, "by our own will") and we would sin again, like we did when we got our free will. Only when we find God by ourselves, we will do his will, by our own will. If-you-know-what-i'm-sayyyyyying.
 
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Science proves God. Simply put but very hard to take in. First of all God didnt make the bible,humans did, it was just a way to represent what he has told his chosen people. Reading the Bible and going to church are fine but I feel you truly need to look into your self and see if you truly believe in God. I have been a Christian for about 3 years now and sice I started opening my thoughts to him he has aswered many prayers. God will not just come down and say here this is what you wanted.He allows time between pray for you to realize what has happened and say wow it actually happen.As you grow more and more close to him your faith grows stronger and you will see that there is nothing wrong with looking to the divine for help. this world was not an accident no matter what people think. From the very beggining man has been too stubborn to realize his creater and in this modern culture it is almost non existant. Realize His power in your heart and you will see what will become of you life, it will change for the better. This will not happen over night but you will definately feel it when you realize.
 
melodicbard said:
Chazman: good example.

I want to ask: Is the practice of baptising infants against freedom?

Dividing people into chosen people (Jews) and gentiles is against freedom. You simply cannot choose to become his chosen people even if you want to; and vice vesa.
Click to expand...

I do not know of any infaint freedom laws.. I would venture to say,
the parents have express freedom rights for a child ,that doesn't even know that is has
any thing called freedom, let alone know what freedom means.

well I could ask ,-->> is feeding that same infaint against his/her freedom?

OK.. maybe a tad extreme, say maybe ,, potty training against freedom.
realy think about it,, absurd as it may seem.????

I beg to differ with your last quote:
however this will take some doing to explain..
back in B.C. you would be correct , and are correct..
now in A.D. JEWS --> has nothing to with where you were born or color of your skin etc...(jews) are the true born again believers, and have salvation in Christ.
now in A.D. gentiles are those who choose to follow there own path, and
do there own thing.
that's another reason why Jesus came, so that gentiles could,,, if they so
choose,, to become jews.... Gods chosen few.
does this help any ?
 
what768 said:
Chazman



I'm glad you've found the right way. God does not love those who walk the wrong path. Believe in your strengths, believe... hohoho!



Humans would still want to be free, (in paradise we only do God's will, "by our own will") and we would sin again, like we did when we got our free will. Only when we find God by ourselves, we will do his will, by our own will. If-you-know-what-i'm-sayyyyyying.
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sorry dude ,, you got me for the wrong Quote , :confused:
look closer I was repling to someone elses quote. :mad:
 
Nasor said:
This is pretty much just directed at Christians, since if you have a different view of God it doesn’t really apply.

God presumably wants us to love/worship him and live according to his instructions, since he loves us and we risk hell if we don’t behave/believe properly. If that’s the case, then why doesn’t God make it a point to get noticed? God seems to have created a world in which a reasonable person can look around, think for a while, and conclude that it isn’t necessarily true that God exists. And even if you do believe in a God, it isn’t at all clear which religion is the correct one.

If God were to provide unambiguous evidence that he exists – like, say, writing a page from the Bible every night in the sky in 10 mile high flaming letters – there would probably be zero atheists. So why doesn’t he do something to let us know he’s around?
Click to expand...
He did. He rose Jesus from the dead, which is a historical event. No other explanation and no other historical event directly shows God's action, and be noticed by the world, then through the resurrection of Jesus.
If you are willing to do an honest investigation of the evidence surrounding this event you should come to the same conclusion.
 
Yo SRVP,

Quote SRVP:
"He did. He rose Jesus from the dead, which is a historical event."

There is no evidence whatsoever for this event.

Quote SRVP:
" If you are willing to do an honest investigation of the evidence surrounding this event you should come to the same conclusion."

If, one moves beyond blind faith and indoctrination, and then with open mind and honest eye, one investigates this event, it would be near impossible to come to a positive conclusion.

Allcare.
 
stretched said:
Yo SRVP,

Quote SRVP:
"He did. He rose Jesus from the dead, which is a historical event."

There is no evidence whatsoever for this event.

Quote SRVP:
" If you are willing to do an honest investigation of the evidence surrounding this event you should come to the same conclusion."

If, one moves beyond blind faith and indoctrination, and then with open mind and honest eye, one investigates this event, it would be near impossible to come to a positive conclusion.

Allcare.
Click to expand...

Dear stretched.
I am starting to see that you have nothing more to do than to
sit here at this forum , and try to toy with people, and there minds.
 
Nasor said:
This is pretty much just directed at Christians, since if you have a different view of God it doesn’t really apply.

God presumably wants us to love/worship him and live according to his instructions, since he loves us and we risk hell if we don’t behave/believe properly. If that’s the case, then why doesn’t God make it a point to get noticed? God seems to have created a world in which a reasonable person can look around, think for a while, and conclude that it isn’t necessarily true that God exists. And even if you do believe in a God, it isn’t at all clear which religion is the correct one.

If God were to provide unambiguous evidence that he exists – like, say, writing a page from the Bible every night in the sky in 10 mile high flaming letters – there would probably be zero atheists. So why doesn’t he do something to let us know he’s around?
Click to expand...
I think that it is that obvious.

When the truth is revealed, it will be like "oh... why didn't I think of that?".

We have to believe, this life is probably the only chance for us to do that, after we die we will know.
 
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