Why can't Creationism and evolutionism perhaps be the same thing?

Ophiolite said:
Time to take the gloves off iam.

I don't give a rat's arse, or a flying ****, what your egocentric, warped little mind thinks, based as it is upon your pathetically limited world experience, and agenda driven, neurotically blinkered, near catatonic espousal of blatant nonsense.

Tell me, do you have a ruler in your near vicinity? A graduated measuring stick of some kind? If so, could you report back to us soon as possible, informing us of how far up your arse your head is buried.
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You're the f*ckin idiot here. I have traveled the world and studied many religions. As a matter of fact, I'm extremely traveled. I've lived in and traveled both asia and europe. You do not know me. I've read the bible more thoroughly than most christians. My stepfather was a minister. I don't give a shit what your opinion is, I'm entitled to mine. Give me names of people and orthodox churches that espouse and believe in evolution. EVOLUTION not their warped views on evolution. That humans evolved from lower primates, even single-celled organisms? You can't. It goes against the core dogma of christianity. As a matter of fact, do a statistical survey of the churches in your local area. Ask the priests, ministers, preachers if they agree to the possibility that humans evolved from apes. Get back to me
 
I too have heard of flying fish, so fish must have evolved into birds.
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Yeah, why not? Does it make more sense for fish fins to grow bigger to use the wind to it's advantage? Or for fish to grow legs? For what reason? Suppose it's to catch insects. What is more reasonable? A fish to dive out of the water just like a flying fish does to catch insects or a fish to feed on land-based or insects near the shore and hop in and off land risking beaching? And why would a land dwelling animal evolve wings or how for that matter? The one with the highest hop just somehow evolves because it can hop higher so it's arms get bigger, lighter, and more feathery because it can perhaps reach fruit others can't? Seems to me they'd just evolve more like giraffes and just grow taller and longer necked. I don't dispute other theories but just giving food for thought.
 
iam said:
Give me names of people and orthodox churches that espouse and believe in evolution. EVOLUTION not their warped views on evolution. That humans evolved from lower primates, even single-celled organisms? You can't. It goes against the core dogma of christianity. As a matter of fact, do a statistical survey of the churches in your local area. Ask the priests, ministers, preachers if they agree to the possibility that humans evolved from apes.
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"To show religion and science are not at odds, more than 400 churches of many denominations — most of them in the United States — have agreed to participate in "Evolution Sunday" by giving a sermon, holding classes or sponsoring discussions."
CRUD! I closed the link... if you want it i'll search for it again. It's a MSNBC article about darwinday.
"His central claim is that both the origin of life from a primordial goo of nonliving chemicals, and the evolution of species according to the processes of random mutation and natural selection, are ''fully compatible with the available scientific evidence and also contemporary religious beliefs.'' In addition, he says, referring to Christian conservatives, "Denying science makes us look stupid.''
http://atheism.about.com/b/a/136886.htm
"On 12 February 2006 hundreds of Christian churches from all portions of the country and a host of denominations will come together to discuss the compatibility of religion and science. For far too long, strident voices, in the name of Christianity, have been claiming that people must choose between religion and modern science. More than 10,000 Christian clergy have already signed The Clergy Letter demonstrating that this is a false dichotomy. Now, on the 197th anniversary of the birth of Charles Darwin, many of these leaders will bring this message to their congregations through sermons and/or discussion groups. Together, participating religious leaders will be making the statement that religion and science are not adversaries. And, together, they will be elevating the quality of the national debate on this topic."
http://www.godweb.org/darwinday.htm
godweb... roflmao.
 
iam, can you please show me where in Catholic (not Christian alone, Catholic) Doctrine it states that evolution is impossible?
 
They say they believe to save face and to keep the church from dying. They don't really believe it. I have a catholic friend who is a church secretary. Though she is tolerant of my views on evolution, she herself does not believe that we evolved from lower primates and no christian orthodox church I know is a true proponent of it. The core dogma of religion is that humans have a soul, animals do not. Christianity believes adam and eve were the first humans. That is not evolution but their own revised take to uphold their religion.
 
Agaim i ask you, show me an OFFICIAL STATEMENT claiming that Catholics are not to believe in evolution. After all, if we are not required to believe Adam and Even existed, then why should we be required to believe in rigid literal Creationism? I know many Crhistians and Catholics who believe in Creationism. That does not mean all do. I dont, and many of my friends dont. I do not believe the Adam and Eve Creation Story to be fact, so there is no need for me to believe in Creationism. I dont believe in creationism. I beleive in evolution. I believe in God, and Jesus Christ. I believe in the validity of the Bible contextually. On all technicality, by believing in God and Jesus alone, i am a christian. So, also believing in Evolution, you could consider me your first case of a Christian Evolutionist. I dont say i believe in evolution for anyone else. Religion and beliefs is personal to me. What anyone else thinks of my belief is their buisness, i try my best not to offend, but i will NEVER lie or change my belief for another's acceptance. You cannot say someone claims to believe something but believes something the complete opposite unless you read minds or they told you. Even so, one person, even 100,000 people, does not account for an entire church. And even outside churches, say one church of Christianity believes in Creationism, that does not automatically make Christians Creationists. Quite the contrary, I again state, I am a Christian, Catholic Evolutionist. So all of this talk about how all Christians are Creationists is false, for i am the example of your false claim.
 
usp8riot said:
Ok, I won't use the word believe. I'll use the word know. I will be as cocky and self secure as a lot of others on the forum. But those that are always sure of themselves are themselves sure to always be liars. To say "i know" is pretty strong words to an educator, and I am not. The more you know the more you know you don't know. I notice the most intelligent people are the most wise in knowing they've been through enough in their life to know no one is always right and you will be fooled in the least likely times when you think you're right. So as you must always secure your trust to not be fooled, you should secure your words so as to not be a liar. I am not innocent of it myself so I say it to also remind myself.
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The idea isn't to substitue the word. Saying 'I know God exists' means that you have evidence. Saying 'I believe God exists' (using the religious belief definition) means I accept it as truth that 'God' exists without considering evidence.

The idea is to adjust the way we think. Have an idea? Have an itch that something might be true? State the hypothesis and suspend truth acceptance until evidence exists.
 
They don't really believe it. I have a catholic friend who is a church secretary. Though she is tolerant of my views on evolution, she herself does not believe that we evolved from lower primates and no christian orthodox church I know is a true proponent of it.
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Evolution isn't really a thing to "believe" in. It's not a faith based thing. Just because lots of people "don't believe in it" doesn't mean they know anything about it.
 
You can believe in anything. Belief isn't limited to Religion. I believe that Evolution is fact. Evolution is not claimed as fact, or else it wouldnt be a theory. I believe that we can from apes, and so on and so forth.

We cannot KNOW God exists and we cannot KNOW God doesnt exist. It is impossible. You can only believe.
 
Provita said:
Agaim i ask you, show me an OFFICIAL STATEMENT claiming that Catholics are not to believe in evolution. After all, if we are not required to believe Adam and Even existed, then why should we be required to believe in rigid literal Creationism? I know many Crhistians and Catholics who believe in Creationism. That does not mean all do. I dont, and many of my friends dont. I do not believe the Adam and Eve Creation Story to be fact, so there is no need for me to believe in Creationism. I dont believe in creationism. I beleive in evolution. I believe in God, and Jesus Christ. I believe in the validity of the Bible contextually. On all technicality, by believing in God and Jesus alone, i am a christian. So, also believing in Evolution, you could consider me your first case of a Christian Evolutionist. I dont say i believe in evolution for anyone else. Religion and beliefs is personal to me. What anyone else thinks of my belief is their buisness, i try my best not to offend, but i will NEVER lie or change my belief for another's acceptance. You cannot say someone claims to believe something but believes something the complete opposite unless you read minds or they told you. Even so, one person, even 100,000 people, does not account for an entire church. And even outside churches, say one church of Christianity believes in Creationism, that does not automatically make Christians Creationists. Quite the contrary, I again state, I am a Christian, Catholic Evolutionist. So all of this talk about how all Christians are Creationists is false, for i am the example of your false claim.
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You are not the example of anything to me except how christianity constantly bends its own rules, not to accept facts on its own merit but because of overwhelming resistance. I don't take christians or evolutionist christians seriously. Their beliefs are based on their god and their bible.
 
You dont take me seriously because i believe a certain something that you do not? That makes absolutely no sense. Einstein was Jewish, for me to refute all of his theories and calling him an idiot because he's Jewish would be stupid and ignorant. (By the way, i dont look down upon jews one bit, infact, i support them and admire them)
 
I don't take your beliefs seriously. But you will be in perfect company with many like-minded as yourself. Birds of a feather flock together. I need to go to a sharper forum. bye bye
 
Well this has nothing to do with my beliefs being valid or serious. You have your views, and I have mine. This is about how was the world created, and for some odd reason, you morphed it into "you cannot believe in evolution and be christian" ... next time, read the thread name and you may understand the question. If you want to arise your own, make a topic yourself.
 
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