Who is Shaitan? uh oh.

Mosheh Thezion said:
The thing satan wants most...

is to turn you away from GOD... and towards him...

thats the story anyway...

-MT
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Fantasy characters don't really have wants or desires. 'God' ultimately has the most influence as it tends to be (in the words of Wes -nerd overloard)-... MEME SUPREME.
 
Medicine Woman said:
*************
M*W: Satan was a variation of the name Lucifer, the Morningstar, (which I believe is another name for the Sun, and not Venus), also found in the Constellation Serapens (the Serpent). Lucifer and his dominion of angels (stars, meteors, comets) fell from Heaven, so the story goes. Some may have landed on Earth, but who knows. What we do know is that we have craters of all sizes on Earth. Maybe Lucifer created the impact of one of them!

As far as Satan/Lucifer causing sin, well the darkness of night (ruled by Satan/Lucifer) was considered evil as compared to the light of day (ruled by Helios/Sol/Sun/God). Jesus actually tried to tell people the he (the Sun/Son/God) was the light of the world, but no one understands it like it was meant. Actually, Jesus didn't exist, so he couldn't have said it, but the believers in astrology (i.e. the Roman Empire and other pagans) did, and it's suspiciously evident that a patsy named "Paul" wrote about Jesus on the orders of the Roman Emperor. I don't believe there was any "Paul/Saul/Sol/Sun" who wrote it. It was a pseudonym of the Emperor's scribes.

No God. No Lucifer. No Sin. No Heaven. No Hell. No Salvation. No Redemption. Just Baloney.
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lucifer means light bearer or light bringer. odd name for someone who rules over darkness. christians eventually just used the names of all gods they believed to be pagan or false as intechangeable with satan. its pretty stupid.
i agree with your last line there though.
 
Mosheh Thezion said:
The thing satan wants most...

is to turn you away from GOD... and towards him...

thats the story anyway...

-MT
Click to expand...

*************
M*W: Well, let's see here... The astro-theological take on this is that the sun was considered by ancient man to be god, creator of the universe, ("god from god, light from light, true god from true god"). Lucifer, the "Morningstar" and "Light Bearer" formed part of the Constellation Serpens. So if an ignorant ancient human were to look up at the daytime skies, he would know the sun (his god) was there, but he could not look directly in its face. He feared and awed his god, of course, but he loved his god since his god brought him good things like crops and warmth from the bitter cold. Lucifer and Serpens didn't exist in the "realm" of god (the daytime), so ancient man assumed Lucifer and his band of angels must have "fallen," since they were not visible in the face of god.

When the sun went down, ancient man's god left him to survive the evil darkness. He feared abandonment by his god, and assumed he was fodder for Lucifer and his dominions who ruled the night. His god became a dying and rising again savior. He anthropomorphized his gods, believing they had human characteristics and emotions like he did. (Modern man still does, but these ancient assumptions are fortunately dying worldwide).

So if ancient man looked into the skies and saw his "god," Lucifer wasn't there. But in the night-time, when ancient man looked into the skies and saw Lucifer (Serpens), his god of light was nowhere in sight.

My long lost point was to create an analogy between light:dark, day:night, god:satan, Sol:Serpens, man:nature, and so on. When viewing the night sky, the ancients' focus was on the 'evil one.' When viewing the day sky, the ancient's focus was on their 'god.'

Ancient human perception became folklore. Folklore became myth. Myth became legend. Legend became religion. Religion became modern man's way of explaining ancient man's folklore. Some things simply never change.
 
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MW, the morning star is venus. it is called the morning star because it can be seen in the morning before sunrise. although it is actually a planet not a sun/star it is called the bringer of light because it preceds the sun, the sun follows it. it brings the sun/light.
 
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we are right.
so dont worry you little head, there's nothing under the bed.
no big nasty monsters to get you.


MT ar'nt you a sock puppet of "the devil inside"
 
ellion said:
MW, the morning star is venus. it is called the morning star because it can be seen in the morning before sunrise. although it is actually a planet not a sun/star it is called the bringer of light because it preceds the sun, the sun follows it. it brings the sun/light.
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*************
M*W: Yes, I am aware that this is the common belief, but I also think it is not held to that belief. Interestingly, though, Venus was considered to be 'female' and, therefore, evil in the mind of ancient humans.
 
female in the sense of positive/negative. she is female in that she is receptive. she is also associated with emotion and intuition.
 
geeser said:
we are right.
so dont worry you little head, there's nothing under the bed.
no big nasty monsters to get you.


MT ar'nt you a sock puppet of "the devil inside"
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unless you have evidence to back this up, i expect an apology, geeser. it is rude in the extreme, and childish to boot.

generally, i disagree with mt. why would you think that unless you cant read?
idiot.
 
the best defence is offence, has'nt anybody else notice that they both insist they dont worship, and both jewish, it could be they have that in common, but they do tend to say the same things, and they never seem to be online at the same time.

devil/MT your get an apology, if I'm wrong, but I 've yet to be convinced.

how is it rude, if it's not true whats the problem, and how is it childish, I'm just make an observation.
 
im not jewish.... i hate old geesers who make assumptions and accuse people of things for the sake of his own entertainment.

-MT
 
well MT/devil, you could have fooled me, you've only to look over your posts.
you've made a lot of pro-jewish statements, you may just know a lot about jewish culture, but it does seem odd.

The Devil Inside said:
i dont know what G-d is, other than infinite in every way..
therefore, i do not worship ANYTHING..
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Mosheh Thezion said:
i DO NOT WORSHIP JESUS.. as i do not worship anything..
worship and prayer are for the self..
the commands of GOD, AND JESUS.. are to obey..
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there seems to be a lot of similaritys.
 
an explanation is in order:
being that i believe G-d to be infinite, and without a tangible form.... the very idea of visualization gives G-d a form. i am a noahide jew, which means i follow seven laws. not all of the talmudic law.

#1. thou shalt put no other gods before me.

once you visualize G-d, you put a form to something that has no form. that, to me, is idolatry.
thats why i say i do not worship anything.
im not exactly sure why you think mt and i are the same person. like i said, i usually disagree with the particulars of what he says.

also, i am against the current state of israel. i believe them to be a bunch of warmongering bullies.

convinced yet?
 
as a side note:
i live in belgium, and so that may be the reason mt and i are never online at the same time. i am six hours ahead of eastern standard time.
 
ok I'm not going to push it, however I shall hold fire on the apology just for now.
 
lol not pushing it is good enough for me.
we are not the same.
could a moderator please post the general geographic regions of our isp?
im sure the site logs that for bannings and such.
 
you fool witnessjudgejury!! you named the dark one.

may you shelter in the palm of the creator's hand

ps: wheel of time is awesome
 
Mosheh Thezion said:
im not jewish.... i hate old geesers who make assumptions and accuse people of things for the sake of his own entertainment.

-MT
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Then why the "The Zion" part of you're name? Even if that isn't a reference to zionism, your user name sounds a lot like an ethnic Israeli name.
 
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