U. S. Supreme Court: No Juvenile Execution

[Tiassa]

5-4, Court Says, "No," To Juvenile Executions
Kennedy: "... it would be misguided to equate the failings of a minor with those of an adult ..."

The United States Supreme Court has abolished the death penalty for minors. The 5-4 decision in Roper v. Simmons overturns a 1989 ruling that upheld the death penalty for 16 and 17 year-old offenders.

The score:

• Justice Kennedy (opinion), Stevens, Souter, Ginsburg, Breyer
• Justice Stevens (concurrence), Ginsburg
• Justice O'Connor (dissent)
• Justice Scalia (dissent), Rehnquist, Thomas​

Our determination that the death penalty is disproportionate punishment for offenders under 18 finds confirmation in the stark reality that the United States is the only country in the world that continues to give official sanction to the juvenile death penalty. This reality does not become controlling, for the task of interpreting the Eighth Amendment remains our responsibility. Yet at least from the time of the Court's decision in Trop, the Court has referred to the laws of other countries and to international authorities as instructive for its interpretation of the Eighth Amendment's prohibition of "cruel and unusual punishments" ....

.... As respondent and a number of amici emphasize, Article 37 of the United Nations Convention on the Rights of the Child, which every country in the world has ratified save for the United States and Somalia, contains an express prohibition on capital punishment for crimes committed
by juveniles under 18 ....

.... Respondent and his amici have submitted, and petitioner does not contest, that only seven countries other than the United States have executed juvenile offenders since 1990: Iran, Pakistan, Saudi Arabia, Yemen, Nigeria, the Democratic Republic of Congo, and China. Since then each of these countries has either abolished capital punishment for juveniles or made public disavowal of the practice ... In sum, it is fair to say that the United States now stands alone in a world that has turned its face against the juvenile death penalty ....

.... It is proper that we acknowledge the overwhelming weight of international opinion against the juvenile death penalty, resting in large part on the understanding that the instability and emotional imbalance of young people may often be a factor in the crime ... The opinion of the world community, while not controlling our outcome, does provide respected and significant confirmation for our own conclusions ....

.... The Eighth and Fourteenth Amendments forbid imposition of the death penalty on offenders who were under the age of 18 when their crimes were committed. The judgment of the Missouri Supreme Court setting aside the sentence of death imposed upon Christopher Simmons is affirmed.

It is so ordered.

Roper v. Simmons

I think one of the subtle benefits of this decision is that while we are no longer behind Iran, Saudi Arabia, DRC, &c., we do not so much catch up as we do stride ahead: these United States have the power, the will, and the obligation to follow through. This is no mere "public disavowal". This is the law of the land.

There is still pride to be found in "America".

Quite obviously, I am pleased by this decision.
____________________

Notes:

Washington Post, FindLaw. "Roper v. Simmons". WashingtonPost.com. See http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/scripts/getcase.pl?court=US&vol=000&invol=03-633&friend=washingtonpost​

 

[vslayer]

the death penalty all together should be abolished, with the corruption caused by use of torture in america, any possible benefits haev been overthrown by the ability to make someone confess through medievil interrogation techniques

 

[Tiassa]

Indeed. One step at a time, though. You know, the glaringly obvious that we just can't get away with, anymore. That sort of thing.

We're soon (within my lifetime) to go through a generation where there's no longer any pretense about whether or not the police are executioners. I feel badly for the future police officers and such who will be put in such a position, and hope for their best resistance. And yes, I feel badly for their children, but there will come a day when people will be justified in setting the police on fire.

I expect this phase of our society will correspond roughly with the United States' acknowledgment of humane standards in law enforcement and information gathering. People will simply get sick of it, and find a reason to gun down the suspects on the street or in an "escape". Isn't there an ongoing topic about prison escape?

 

[sargentlard]

I would like to read some good arguments against death penalty because as of now I see no good reason why some criminals should be allowed to live. At some point few of them become a burden on society and, not to completely make human life an economical affair, a waste of taxpayers money.

Why should "I" care about someone who cares about no one?

 

[Xerxes]

Because making the death penalty a common punishment turns the country into a bleak place where nobody cares about anybody.

If the legal system is tough but compassionate, potential criminals won't feel as criminally inclined..if that makes any sense

 

[§outh§tar]

Only cowards cower at the death penalty.

Come back and protest it when you have earned the right to live.

Morons.

 

[Tiassa]

Come back and protest it when you have earned the right to live.

Oh, yes. Open season. Yet you make the death penalty obsolete as such. Kill two birds with one shot, eh?

 

[Asguard]

because it costs less to throw away the key than to kill someone?

 

[sargentlard]

Because making the death penalty a common punishment turns the country into a bleak place where nobody cares about anybody.

But, it isn't a common punishment. It is rarely given and when given it can take up to years to follow through.

As far as compassionate legal systems go U.S legal system maybe the most compassionate I have seen so far (any others more sensible?).

People treat the death penalty as if it was some horrendous sin against man kind...why? Do they view as a concious murder by a willing society? or do they not like killing anybody at all?

Its ok for someone to kill 10 people and then have their sorry ass supported for the remainder of their life rather than just finishing them off. Given, letting someone rot in a cell is more penal, but then isn't that more heinous than letting someone go in peace instead of putting them away, alive with the thought that they have no chance....ever.

What is the point of giving 7 life sentences witn no parole?...just off the guy.

 

[Tiassa]

People treat the death penalty as if it was some horrendous sin against man kind...why? Do they view as a concious murder by a willing society? or do they not like killing anybody at all?

It doesn't lower the crime rate, demands greater resources of society, and in the end only serves as a ritual murder to appease bloodlust defined at the anthropological level. As such, it has the effect of "cheapening human life".

Were the death penalty to bear greater positive effects than merely quenching the thirst for revenge, people would have a reason to want it around that doesn't touch directly on bloodlust.

As to the rest, humans--especially Americans--have excessively high expectations pertaining to quality of life and the accompaniment conduct. We can abandon those expectations or attempt to achieve them. Revenge killings do not bring any progress toward achieving those expectations, and in fact constitute something of a surrender that hinders growth and refinement.

So killing someone on behalf of society when society profits none by the homicide just doesn't strike certain people as sensible. It strikes others as senseless. And it strikes others yet as something they want to do, anyway.

And it says a lot about a society if people get off on killing others. We know the murderous deviant and psycho criminals have dangerous problems. What's anyone else's excuse?

 

[Neildo]

It doesn't really matter whether they get rid of jevenile excecution or not. When was the last juvenile to be executed? Heck, when was the last PERSON, regardless of age or sex, to be executed -- and how many people are on death row? When one person every 4 years or so (at least in my state) gets executed, it doesn't really matter. Most will die in jail naturally before being touched by the state.

- N

 

[Asguard]

it doesnt matter?

one person a DECADE is to many. one person EVER is to many. Your talking about killing someone for zero reason. Hell if it takes so long to get around to killing them and they would have every incentive to escape but cant it just PROVES that the DP is unnessary

 

[Xerxes]

Sargentlard,

Tiassa basically said what I was aiming at:
As such, it has the effect of "cheapening human life".

If we consider human life to be 'sacred', what point is there in having more blood on our hands? Especially from such a low element of society..

The only time I'd consider the death penalty to be valid is when a person in authority supports or allows acts of atrocity (ie Stalin starving millions of Ukranians)

 

[Asguard]

xerxes NO!!!!!!!!!!

NEVER!!!!!!!!

you NEVER EVER take that first step because once you do you are on the slipery slope and it will fall forever till your exicuting people for stealing bread. Life with out is the ONLY punishment that we should concider for the worst crimes. For one thing nothing is as it seems and you cant give back life but you can apologise and releace a prisioner when they have life without if new advances in techology find that they were inocent. One inocent life is worth EVERYTHING

 

[Xev]

Right, that's why the US executes people for stealing bread.
Because of those hundreds of years we spent executing people.

 

[Asguard]

No xev, The death penelty is SLOWLY going out of fashion. If brought back in all its "glory" that IS the road it would take. Rather than less offences warenting the death penelty we would have more and yes altho it might never get that bad it might get quite close.

 

[Xev]

I see.
So although it was around for three hundred plus years in the US, and never really 'went out of fashion' here (for long!), and the US has not in the past 160 years executed for any crime less serious than rape/kidnapping, the existence of the death penalty in a country automatically leads to it being used as punishment for petty crimes?

Fuck empiricism!

 

[Asguard]

ok xev you start with it only being used for say genocide. Then you decide that whoever torchers there victoms and kills them is just as bad so you change the law to include them. then you say "hang on, any murder is bad" so its given to straight murderes. Then people say that rape is worse than murder so you give it to serial rapists. Then to normal rapists, then to pedifiles because they are 1000 times worse than normal rapists. And in there somewhere you add ANYONE who kills someon including manslaughter and cupable driving

So my question for you is where do you draw the line and whats to stop the next generation drawing it a step below you?

if there is nothing then why do you think that my exstream seario is so wrong? who is to say that theft ISNT where it will end up AGAIN!! because rember that the death penelty IS on its way out around the world. I would guess that more countrys abhore it than surport it, but when it was at the hight of fashion (ie the middle ages) it WAS acceptable to hang someone for stealing. My post wasnt about how things are NOW but how things COULD be if it became MORE fashionable to use the DP rather than following the current trend of its slow demise

 

[§outh§tar]

ok xev you start with it only being used for say genocide. Then you decide that whoever torchers there victoms and kills them is just as bad so you change the law to include them. then you say "hang on, any murder is bad" so its given to straight murderes. Then people say that rape is worse than murder so you give it to serial rapists. Then to normal rapists, then to pedifiles because they are 1000 times worse than normal rapists. And in there somewhere you add ANYONE who kills someon including manslaughter and cupable driving

So my question for you is where do you draw the line and whats to stop the next generation drawing it a step below you?

if there is nothing then why do you think that my exstream seario is so wrong? who is to say that theft ISNT where it will end up AGAIN!! because rember that the death penelty IS on its way out around the world. I would guess that more countrys abhore it than surport it, but when it was at the hight of fashion (ie the middle ages) it WAS acceptable to hang someone for stealing. My post wasnt about how things are NOW but how things COULD be if it became MORE fashionable to use the DP rather than following the current trend of its slow demise

I do believe the same argument can be made against morality.

But then again, morality, like laws, is for cowards.

 

[§outh§tar]

Oh, yes. Open season. Yet you make the death penalty obsolete as such. Kill two birds with one shot, eh?

Call me the last in Emma Goldman's bloodline.