true faith and reasons for each persons belief?

[EmptyForceOfChi]

religion is based on faith, (believing in a feeling that you have no real proof of, but you can just feel its right inside of you?)

then there is blind faith where you beleive something out of fear of the alternatives,


so to all the people who have true faith, not blind faith, can i ask you this question please,


what makes you truley believe it is true? this question is to anyone of any religion,


why do you believe?




thanks for the replies,



peace

 

[(Q)]

religion is based on faith, (believing in a feeling that you have no real proof of, but you can just feel its right inside of you?)

then there is blind faith where you beleive something out of fear of the alternatives

They are one and the same 'faith.'

 

[EmptyForceOfChi]

religion is based on faith, (believing in a feeling that you have no real proof of, but you can just feel its right inside of you?)

then there is blind faith where you beleive something out of fear of the alternatives

They are one and the same 'faith.'

wich would be the one faith, the blind faith, or true faith?



peace.

 

[(Q)]

Faith, when it comes to the supernatural, is all blind.

 

[geeser]

religion is based on faith, (believing in a feeling that you have no real proof of, but you can just feel its right inside of you?)

then there is blind faith

all religious faith, is blind faith, without no proof it can not be anything else.
Faith(blind faith)
Faith defined

 

[superluminal]

If faith is not blind (requiring no evidence or proof), then by definition, it is no longer faith, right? It becomes a supported hypothesis with some degree of likelyhood based on the evidence, proof, experimental data, etc.

 

[Crunchy Cat]

religion is based on faith, (believing in a feeling that you have no real proof of, but you can just feel its right inside of you?)

then there is blind faith where you beleive something out of fear of the alternatives,


so to all the people who have true faith, not blind faith, can i ask you this question please,


what makes you truley believe it is true? this question is to anyone of any religion,


why do you believe?




thanks for the replies,



peace

The terminology isn't quite correct. Faith is unconditional trust in <something>... 'God' in this case. 'Belief' (religious believe specifically) is acceptance that an assertion is true without consideration to supportive / contradictive evidence.

 

[EmptyForceOfChi]

yes you all have some points,


but nobody has actually said what they believe in or if they have faith in anything atall.


i have faith in the thing that i am unsure about,


peace.

 

[superluminal]

Oh, ok.

I am a complete atheist. Meaning simply that I am without religion. It is meaningless to me. I have faith (by the standard definition) in nothing. "What!?" you say. "You don't have faith in your wife's love for you???". Of course not. She provides ample evidence of it every day. It is testable, repeatable, and verifiable. Why would any sane person accept something, anything, with no supporting evidence whatsoever, as true? It's beyond me.

 

[The Devil Inside]

i am jewish.
i came to judaism on a loooong route. i toured many other religions, looking for what would touch my soul.

in 1995, i learned about the Kabbala. at this point in my life, i was a southern baptist. now, one of the main tenets of a true Kabbalist's beliefs is that to worship G-d in any form, is idolatry.

i thought on this for a few years. i studied. i pored over manuscripts. i read history books comparing my religion to judaism.

at the end, i realized that it is completely possible to have religion, without an old man in a throne lording over me. i contacted the nearest synagogue, and learned from the rabbi there what contemporary judaism was all about. after questioning several of the teachings, i was expelled from the temple before being confirmed.

i began to research on my own the idea of Ein Sof. the infinity of G-d cannot be explained at all, according to Kabbalist belief. i have faith in the infinite. i have no faith in any "god" that i can even begin to fathom.

as i have stated many times before, "a man cannot begin the sentence 'G-d is' and end that sentence having said anything meaningful."

that being said, i suppose i travel more toward the label "agnostic", but i believe that what is written in the Torah is truth. my life goal is to be able to understand what is being communicated therein.
so far, i have failed miserably due to my meat brains.

does that answer your question?
:m:

 

[Crunchy Cat]

yes you all have some points,


but nobody has actually said what they believe in or if they have faith in anything atall.


i have faith in the thing that i am unsure about,


peace.

By the definitions I asserted, I try very hard not to hold beliefs. I have faith that the universe executes flawlessly.

 

[The Devil Inside]

it sure does, crunchy cat.

 

[EmptyForceOfChi]

Oh, ok.

I am a complete atheist. Meaning simply that I am without religion. It is meaningless to me. I have faith (by the standard definition) in nothing. "What!?" you say. "You don't have faith in your wife's love for you???". Of course not. She provides ample evidence of it every day. It is testable, repeatable, and verifiable. Why would any sane person accept something, anything, with no supporting evidence whatsoever, as true? It's beyond me.

well about 90% of science starts with speculation and theory, you still accept the big bang as a possibility also black holes and other things within the scientific community,



i personally am not religious and never will be i have no need for organised religion, but i do not rule out the possibility of a god existing maybe,


peace

 

[Crunchy Cat]

it sure does, crunchy cat.

nice cube... is it 4d? hard to tell... its tiny.

 

[The Devil Inside]

"metatron's cube"
geometric figure created using the hebrew alphabet.
got it off a *chuckle* crystallinks page.

 

[The Devil Inside]

crunchy cat..check your private messages.

 

[Cris]

Empty…,

well about 90% of science starts with speculation and theory, you still accept the big bang as a possibility also black holes and other things within the scientific community,

Well yes, but these are not assertions of certain truth, these are attempts at explanations of unknown phenomena based on what can be observed. Faith OTOH makes assertions of truth specifically without a factual base or observation.

i personally am not religious and never will be i have no need for organised religion, but i do not rule out the possibility of a god existing maybe,

That is a healthy atheist perspective. But now take it to the next step – why even consider the possibility of a god? What is the difference here to saying I don’t know why things are the way they are so magic happens? Remember that the concept of gods were conceived in times of incredible ignorance of how the universe functioned and where indeed many things did appear like magic. We no longer need to harbor those ill-conceived ideas. Just what is the credibility of supposing a god might exist? There is none.

Please also do not confuse the two distinct meanings of faith. One is often used where the word trust should be used, while the other is simple belief without evidence. Having faith in your doctor, for example, is usually born out of the evidence that he is adequately qualified. Having faith that a god exists has no precedent or evidence. We can further distinguish the two forms by calling them evidential faith and non-evidential faith. The religionist usually claims their form is valid by quoting examples of evidential faith. This is either because they do not understand the difference or they are simply dishonest.

But non-evidential faith, that you are trying to break down further into true faith and blind faith, is most often the result of an emotional perspective. What you call “a feeling that something is just right” is no difference to the feelings of fear. Both are subjective and irrational. Facts and evidence are often hard to discover and need not be obvious or pleasant. Our often overwhelming desire to have an explanation no matter what leads many people to reach premature conclusions about what is true or not. This rush is a sure sign of irrational thinking and an absence of critical thought and logic.

There is never a need to use non-evidential faith under any circumstances. If one does not have an answer one can simply withhold belief until evidence is available.

 

[The Devil Inside]

i whole-heartedly agree, cris.

 

[EmptyForceOfChi]

Empty…,

Well yes, but these are not assertions of certain truth, these are attempts at explanations of unknown phenomena based on what can be observed. Faith OTOH makes assertions of truth specifically without a factual base or observation.

That is a healthy atheist perspective. But now take it to the next step – why even consider the possibility of a god? What is the difference here to saying I don’t know why things are the way they are so magic happens? Remember that the concept of gods were conceived in times of incredible ignorance of how the universe functioned and where indeed many things did appear like magic. We no longer need to harbor those ill-conceived ideas. Just what is the credibility of supposing a god might exist? There is none.

Please also do not confuse the two distinct meanings of faith. One is often used where the word trust should be used, while the other is simple belief without evidence. Having faith in your doctor, for example, is usually born out of the evidence that he is adequately qualified. Having faith that a god exists has no precedent or evidence. We can further distinguish the two forms by calling them evidential faith and non-evidential faith. The religionist usually claims their form is valid by quoting examples of evidential faith. This is either because they do not understand the difference or they are simply dishonest.

But non-evidential faith, that you are trying to break down further into true faith and blind faith, is most often the result of an emotional perspective. What you call “a feeling that something is just right” is no difference to the feelings of fear. Both are subjective and irrational. Facts and evidence are often hard to discover and need not be obvious or pleasant. Our often overwhelming desire to have an explanation no matter what leads many people to reach premature conclusions about what is true or not. This rush is a sure sign of irrational thinking and an absence of critical thought and logic.

There is never a need to use non-evidential faith under any circumstances. If one does not have an answer one can simply withhold belief until evidence is available.

yes thats all understood cris,


but the notion of a god existing dosent lie with the holy books and times of old, with stories and many gods grreks norse egyptions babylonians azteckz etc,


the philosophy and notion/idea of a god for me boils down to a logical possibility and explanation of how the universe came to be,
to beleive there is nothing after death is the same to believe there is something after death, correct? they are both assumptions of something you have no experience in, therefore both as possible as the other.


and fear is not subjective and irrational just as faith is not, fear is very rationable and it saves your life in the game of natural survival in the wild if you are a prey item,


fear has its reasons,

peace

 

[Cris]

Empty…,

but the notion of a god existing dosent lie with the holy books and times of old, with stories and many gods grreks norse egyptions babylonians azteckz etc,

But mainly it does since these cultures did not have our modern knowledge so magical answers seemed to make most sense to them.

the philosophy and notion/idea of a god for me boils down to a logical possibility and explanation of how the universe came to be,

I.e. magic happens. Without some substance to the idea it has no credibility and is simply a wild fantasy.

to beleive there is nothing after death is the same to believe there is something after death, correct? they are both assumptions of something you have no experience in, therefore both as possible as the other.

No I strongly disagree, they are not qualitatively or quantitatively similar. For example; of the countless billions who have died there is no record of anyone returning. Additionally our knowledge of how the brain operates removes the ancient ideas that thoughts, emotions, and mind were the result of an eternal soul. In this light there is nothing that points to anything that can survive death. Why then would anyone persist is proposing something that has no merit?

and fear is not subjective and irrational just as faith is not,

Belief without evidence is technically illogical since logic requires evidence as its basis, i.e. illogical = irrational. And I was referring to the concept of fear you used in your opening post – i.e. believing in a fantasy for fear of punishment.

fear is very rationable and it saves your life in the game of natural survival in the wild if you are a prey item,

fear has its reasons,

I agree but that is not within the context of your thread.