Tolerance in Islam .

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Proud_Syrian

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Tolerance in Islam

by M. Rafiqul-Haqq and P. Newton

"There is no compulsion in religion." (The Qur'an 2:256)
This Qur'anic verse is used by Muslims to defend themselves against the charge that Islam is an intolerant religion. The charge of intolerance has been haunting Muslims everywhere since the beginning of Islam. Is this charge well founded or is it a false one?

http://debate.domini.org/newton/tolerance.html
 
"O you who believe! Fight those of the unbelievers (non-Muslims) who are near to you and let them find in you hardness; and know that Allah is with those who guard (against evil)."
(Koran 9:123)

"O you who believe! Do not take the Jews and the Christians for friends; they are friends of each other; and whoever amongst you takes them for a friend, then surely he is one of them; surely Allah does not guide the unjust people."
(Koran 5:51)

"But when the forbidden months are past, then fight and slay the Pagans wherever ye find them, and seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every stratagem (of war); but if they repent, and establish regular prayers (become Muslims) and practise regular charity, then open the way for them: for Allah is Oft-forgiving, Most Merciful."
(Koran 9:5)

"O ye who believe! Take not for friends Unbelievers (non-Muslims) rather than believers: Do ye wish to offer Allah an open proof against yourselves?"
(Koran 4:144)

"Thou seest many of them turning in friendship to the Unbelievers (non-Muslims). Evil indeed are (the works) which their souls have sent forward before them (with the result), that Allah's wrath is on them, and in torment will they abide."
(Koran 5:80)

"Fight those who do not believe in Allah, nor in the latter day, nor do they prohibit what Allah and His Apostle have prohibited, nor follow the religion of truth, out of those who have been given the Book (Christians and Jews), until they pay the tax in acknowledgment of superiority and they are in a state of subjection."
(Koran 9:29)



Comment: In Islam, "the people of the Book (i.e. the Bible)" means Jews and Christians. Above we see that Muhammedanism tells its followers to fight the Christians and Jews until they are a powerless group that gives money to their Muhammedan masters! Throughout history, this is how the Christian and Jewish groups were treated by Muhammedan rulers. For example, when the Arab-Muhammedan armies conquered the lands of the Christian Assyrians, the Assyrians were forced to pay 80% tax, or more, to the Muhammedans. Because of this oppression, most Assyrians had to convert to Muhammedanism. Even in the Caliphate of Cordoba (Spain), which Muhammedans often mention as an example of "Islamic tolerance", where the majority were Christians, they had to pay for not being Muhammedans.


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Tolerance? Oh my, what humor you have, Ahmed.
 
Originally posted by DJSupreme23

taking verses out of their historical context showes only your sheer ignorance of Islam and the noble Quran:

Strongest among men in enmity to the believers (Muslims) wilt thou find the Jews and Pagans; and nearest among them in love to the believers wilt thou find those who say, 'We are Christians': because amongst these are men devoted to learning and men who have renounced the world, and they are not arrogant. (The Noble Quran, 5:82)"

"Say: 'O People of the Book (i.e., Jews and Christians)! Come to common terms as between us and you: That we worship none but Allah; that we associate no partners with Him; that we erect not, from among ourselves, Lords and patrons other than Allah.' If then they turn back, say ye: 'Bear witness that we (at least) are Muslims (bowing to Allah's Will).' (The Noble Quran, 3:64)"


Allah Almighty commanded the Muslims to be kind and just with non-Muslims: "Allah forbids you not, With regard to those who Fight you not for (your) Faith Nor drive you out Of your homes, From dealing kindly and justly With them: For Allah loveth Those who are just. (The Noble Quran, 60:8)"

Just because a person might be a non-Muslim it doesn't automatically make him an enemy to the Muslims. Peace-loving and innocent non-Muslims are to be treated with justice and kindness, otherwise the Muslims would be committing a sin and violating Allah Almighty's Holy Commands, "For Allah loveth Those who are just".

"This day are (all) things good and pure made lawful unto you. The food of the People of the Book is lawful unto you and yours is lawful unto them. (Lawful unto you in marriage) are (not only) chaste women who are believers, but chaste women among the People of the Book, revealed before your time,- when ye give them their due dowers, and desire chastity, not lewdness, nor secret intrigues if any one rejects faith, fruitless is his work, and in the Hereafter he will be in the ranks of those who have lost (all spiritual good). (The Noble Quran, 5:5)"

Allah Almighty made lawful for Muslim men to marry Jewish and Christian women. How is this supposed to agree with the theory that Islam prohibits Muslims from making Jewish and Christian personal friends?
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If Islam is so tolerant...

..then why is the UK (particularly) and many other countries, swamped with immigrants from Islamic countries?
 
Originally posted by Proud_Syrian

Allah Almighty made lawful for Muslim men to marry Jewish and Christian women. How is this supposed to agree with the theory that Islam prohibits Muslims from making Jewish and Christian personal friends?
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But your quotes seem to directly contradict those made by DJSupreme23.

Eg.

"O you who believe! Do not take the Jews and the Christians for friends; they are friends of each other; and whoever amongst you takes them for a friend, then surely he is one of them; surely Allah does not guide the unjust people."
(Koran 5:51)

How can you explain this quote?
 
Easy

Originally posted by croper
But your quotes seem to directly contradict those made by DJSupreme23.

Eg.

"O you who believe! Do not take the Jews and the Christians for friends; they are friends of each other; and whoever amongst you takes them for a friend, then surely he is one of them; surely Allah does not guide the unjust people."
(Koran 5:51)

How can you explain this quote?
Click to expand...

Because Mr DJSupreme23 took his quotes out of Sura 9 that was written in a time of war and intended as direct instructions to the Prophet in war time when he was opressed and with noone to trust. God told the prophet not to take the jews and the christians for friends in this war because they would let him down, just like the christians and jews let Jesus down and plotted with the Romans for his murder. Sura 9 doesn't start with the Name of God most mercifull like every Sura in the Quran and is not intended for our daily application, it's a mere history recitation.

The tolerant Suras all over the Quran toward muslims and christians are a proof that this specific Suras that you quote are out of context and abused. Also, please stop interpreting unbeliever as (non muslims). unbelievers are Atheists.
 
Re: If Islam is so tolerant...

Originally posted by croper
..then why is the UK (particularly) and many other countries, swamped with immigrants from Islamic countries?
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I dunno, when you find out why christian Mexicans and Buhda Chinease are called wet backs from swimming through shark infested waters to come to the US, then you'll have the answer to your question. Could it possibly be economics Mr. Smarty pants????
 
Re: Re: If Islam is so tolerant...

Originally posted by Flores
I dunno, when you find out why christian Mexicans and Buhda Chinease are called wet backs from swimming through shark infested waters to come to the US, then you'll have the answer to your question. Could it possibly be economics Mr. Smarty pants????
Click to expand...

To be honest, I regretted that post as soon as I made it, it was a bit flippant and uninformed. My apologies.

As for the misquotes, thanks for your explanation... misquoting is a poweful tool to prove anything it seems :D
 
We can explain how the Koran contradicts itself the same way Christians explain contradictions in the Bible; which there really are. (which means as a buddhist I have no idea, I"ll let a muslim explain it)

Unless I'm mistaken, there are no countries which Christianity occupies a sole all powerful role in government the way most Islamic countries do making comparisons betwen Muslim and Christian countries not very fair.

Does this mean a country based on fundamentalist Islam is crap? How fundmental do you go? Especially when charismatic adherents don't know how to take qoutes from the Koran from a historical perspective. This plagues other religions too where truth is very very changable according to intepretation.
 
The answer my friend is total separation of Religion and Government.......Religion is like laundry (could be clean or dirty), it's not to be hung over public forums....Somethings are just better kept in that precious chest drawer.

PS... If Islam has failed in governments, then Christianity will abslotely flunk, because Islam is must more consistent, coherent, unified, and regular than Christianity.......To implement Christianity in government is to cause chaos and confusion and encourage secular wars.
 
True, which is why to champion the cause of Christianity, i DO NOT recommend making comparisons between Islamic countries and America. Most Islamic countries do not seperate religion from state.
 
Originally posted by Drakkon
True, which is why to champion the cause of Christianity, i DO NOT recommend making comparisons between Islamic countries and America. Most Islamic countries do not seperate religion from state.
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Don't worry, I don't think the Christians will ever make that mistake again of connecting religion to government, noone want to go back to the dark midevil ages of opression when the church was in control.
 
Re: Easy

Originally posted by Flores
Because Mr DJSupreme23 took his quotes out of Sura 9 that was written in a time of war and intended as direct instructions to the Prophet in war time when he was opressed and with noone to trust. God told the prophet not to take the jews and the christians for friends in this war because they would let him down, just like the christians and jews let Jesus down and plotted with the Romans for his murder. Sura 9 doesn't start with the Name of God most mercifull like every Sura in the Quran and is not intended for our daily application, it's a mere history recitation.

The tolerant Suras all over the Quran toward muslims and christians are a proof that this specific Suras that you quote are out of context and abused. Also, please stop interpreting unbeliever as (non muslims). unbelievers are Atheists.
Click to expand...

"Unbeliever" indicates any person who does not believe in the religion of the person who uses the word.
 
Originally posted by Flores
Don't worry, I don't think the Christians will ever make that mistake again of connecting religion to government, noone want to go back to the dark midevil ages of opression when the church was in control.
Click to expand...

Zero regrets that in the 21st century, Muslim countries are making the mistake that the church already learned from centuries ago :rolleyes: He also bids Flores good day.
 
Originally posted by Zero
Zero regrets that in the 21st century, Muslim countries are making the mistake that the church already learned from centuries ago :rolleyes: He also bids Flores good day.
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Good day Zero, and I share your regrets. One day soon, Muslims will learn how to keep religion private and out of the State abuse. In the meanwhile, live in fear and don't travel, because you are the ace of spades on the terrorists card games.
 
Just as Christianity needed time to evolve and grow out of its heretic killing stage shouldn't Islam be judged that way too considering it is a much younger religion than Christianity?
 
Originally posted by Drakkon
Just as Christianity needed time to evolve and grow out of its heretic killing stage shouldn't Islam be judged that way too considering it is a much younger religion than Christianity?
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You may think they are different religions, but I view them as the same religion. Afterall, there is one religion, the religion of god the creator, just many prophets to remind different people and generations of the same message.
 
Originally posted by Flores
Good day Zero, and I share your regrets. One day soon, Muslims will learn how to keep religion private and out of the State abuse. In the meanwhile, live in fear and don't travel, because you are the ace of spades on the terrorists card games.
Click to expand...

*shrinks in horror*

Zero feels that he must run away to a remote, scorpion-filled desert island to protect himself. He asks Flores if she knows a capable travel agent who will find one for him.
 
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