To Christians: How did you come to terms with God's apparent immorality? / Revisited
- Thread starter wynn
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well to think of it , on a moral point of view its really kinda moral , how great our god is he creates us then he gives us the free choice weather or not to worship him, the way he cares for us , that he give us his only son to die by our hands , but he does not die in vain because he dies for our sins, but we as humans dare stand up against the one who creates us and say that hes not moral , i say no we are the unmoral ones,
the way you sound when you ask such a question is that you believe in god but you are looking for an excuse just 2 continue sinning coz you cant sacrifice some habits that are not pleasing to god
the way you sound when you ask such a question is that you believe in god but you are looking for an excuse just 2 continue sinning coz you cant sacrifice some habits that are not pleasing to god
Notice how you conveniently forgot about the lake of fire for those who don't wish to worship and obey your god? And, you say that's moral?
If we applied that logic to people, Hitler, Stalin and Mussolini were gods to be worshiped.
That's why gods are immoral and teach their followers to be immoral, to lie, to fabricate and to be as dishonest as possible as long as it supports their beliefs.
Wow, lying for Jesus to support lying for Jesus. Well done, Lori!
Well in a way I did by saying that morality isn't relevant or applicable to god.
I came to understand that through experience.
Beyond that, when I look at what people find offensive about god, particularly in the OT, and then look around in the world today, those things are indeed going on. So it seems realistic to me.
The hell thing...if one chooses to reject god, and wants nothing to do with it, then they go to a place that is void of his spirit. They're getting what they want. Here on earth you can have your cake and eat it to, but there it sounds to me like things are different. There's no fence to sit on. No luxury of enjoying the benefit of something while at the same time denying it. Seems fair to me.
So, the fact that Christians lie for Jesus and that Jesus will send me to a lake of fire for an eternity because he loves me, my criticism of that is "hate rhetoric". Lori is here to tell us all of what reality comprises, that everyone who doesn't lie of Jesus is hateful towards the beliefs of the same people who will gleefully shout for joy as their gods toss us into a lake of fire, lovingly.
Hipparchia
Registered Senior Member
(Q) I've read many of your posts in many threads. I think the reason Lori calls it hate rhetoric is that to any one with a smidgeon of a brain it is pretty clear that you are consumed with hate about anyone foolish enough to have anything positive to say about religion. This offends, frustrates and angers you, and eventually this combination of emotions has turned to hate.
I am not saying this is a good thing, or a bad thing, but it is certainyl a thing. Deny it as much as you like, you will only be fooling yourself.
And I'm not speaking as a Christian leaping to the aid of a fellow Christian. I suppose if I thought about it I would describe myself as an atheist. It's just that I never really think about it. I'm a forum member pointing out the accuracy of a personal characterisation.
here's what i envision Q. you with all your hate, and religious people with all their hate, will be there hating on each other. and you will all think you died and went to heaven. either that or you'll know where you are, and you just won't care, cause you'll be having too much fun.
do you get the point i'm trying to make? if you do, then don't respond. lol.
do you get the point i'm trying to make? if you do, then don't respond. lol.
Yes, I do, it's called lying for Jesus and you do it so badly.
There's something positive to say about Christianity?
Hilarious. Christians are free to spread their hatred on others, to cause as much conflict as they can and then claim others are full of hatred because they don't wish to accept the hatred spread by Christians.
Do Christians always chase their own tails?
I'm certainly not being fooled by you or Lori.
Lori_7 said:
First of all, The Bible paints Hell as a place that nobody would choose. It tells of really bad things that happen to people in hell. It is nothing but torture for eternity. Who in their right mind would honestly choose that?
You claim people choose that because they do not choose the Biblical God. That's like no choice. Its a threat. You don't do it the Biblical God's way he will send you to a place to be tortured forever. That's just so retarded man. So it's not that the Biblical God is just sending people to a place that is void of him and they can live their life happily ever after without him. No, how he designed it to be is grade school mentality crapola (If you don't do this then you can't be in our club) with pure violence as a consequence. But somehow you think that's ok?
Why? If God told you to torture a child, would you do it? I have never found the Abraham story - where the issue was murder rather than torture - convincing. I would hope that God wanted him to disobey. I can see no reason not to question God's morality, just as I would anyone in a position of authority who seems to be doing something immoral.
In a sense this is respect.
If a boss found out that much of what he or she was doing was seen as inethical by his or her employees, a mature one would be disappointed in the employees for not calling him on this stuff.
Can you explain?
Sure, there are events that match events in the OT, but the question is are these acts of God moral ones.
Do as I say and not as I do is pretty offensive.
This would be in the version of Christianity where good people of other religions do not go to Hell. Muslims - who do believe in God and want to be close to God, for example - would not be sent to hell for not being Christian. Is this what you believe?
My problem isn't in whether God is moral or immoral - but in how a person can have a clear picture of God and accept Him for whatever He is, along with accepting themselves and their position.
How did they come to terms with diametrically opposed scriptural statements about God. How do they reconcile on the one hand, God being loving, and on the other, damning the majority of His beloved children to eternal damnation because they didn't become convinced by just someone who claimed to know the truth about God or who didn't give in to their fears and panic.
Because the mainstream Christian reasoning seems to be based on an idea like "I am small, worthless, insignificant, therefore, I have to believe everything anyone (including my fears and panic) says about God." "God can do whatever He wants to, I accept it, I cannot understand it, I am too stupid and too evil."
This way, an enormous faith is required in anyone who claims to know about God, as well as enormous faith in one's own fears and panic. (Acting on such faith only makes the fears worse, though.)
This is what fideism is, and I am finding difficult to argue against it.
How did they come to terms with diametrically opposed scriptural statements about God. How do they reconcile on the one hand, God being loving, and on the other, damning the majority of His beloved children to eternal damnation because they didn't become convinced by just someone who claimed to know the truth about God or who didn't give in to their fears and panic.
Because the mainstream Christian reasoning seems to be based on an idea like "I am small, worthless, insignificant, therefore, I have to believe everything anyone (including my fears and panic) says about God." "God can do whatever He wants to, I accept it, I cannot understand it, I am too stupid and too evil."
This way, an enormous faith is required in anyone who claims to know about God, as well as enormous faith in one's own fears and panic. (Acting on such faith only makes the fears worse, though.)
This is what fideism is, and I am finding difficult to argue against it.