To Better Understand The Theist

[S.A.M.]

What does that mean?

Evolution just is. It has no direction or meaning.

What does that mean?

We could still become extinct by environmental changes we ourselves induce (this includes disease, weapons, climate changes etc) or due to natural changes we cannot forsee or overcome. All our persistence indicates is that we have genetic diversity sufficient to withstand the effects of environmental pressures.

 

[one_raven]

Yes and the ones who persist (or survive) are the ones who multiply. If our personalities are a product of our biology, then environmental interaction is merely what helps to weed out what is best suited to survive.

Yes, and?
It still stands that influence is vastly different from predetermination, and with great influence, we still have free will.

 

[S.A.M.]

Yes, and?
It still stands that influence is vastly different from predetermination, and with great influence, we still have free will.

Only the illusion of it. We are all slaves to our nucleotide sequences. e.g. What if what we decide (free will) is determined by our CNV (copy number variation)? Where then, free will?

 

[one_raven]

Only the illusion of it. We are all slaves to our nucleotide sequences. e.g. What if what we decide (free will) is determined by our CNV (copy number variation)? Where then, free will?

I'm not getting into this one yet again.
I'll let someone else field this.

 

[S.A.M.]

I'm not getting into this one yet again.
I'll let someone else field this.

Oh has this been done before? Could you let me know?

 

[one_raven]

Could you let me know?

Unfortunately, I haven't been able to figure out how to do quoted search phrases on the search page on this site yet - I can't search for "free will".

I can, however, offer results for predetermined and predetermination and you can sift through those results.

You can, however, skim through these 6,570 threads that resulted in a Google search of the site for the words "free will" in a post.

Wish I could have been more of a help.
Good luck.

 

[(Q)]

Evolution just is. It has no direction or meaning.

That has nothing to do with upholding your argument, our species has not slaughtered itself, you've killed no one lately, have you? According to you, it should be a daily event.

We could still become extinct by environmental changes we ourselves induce (this includes disease, weapons, climate changes etc) or due to natural changes we cannot forsee or overcome. All our persistence indicates is that we have genetic diversity sufficient to withstand the effects of environmental pressures.

But it will most likely be the willingness to cling to false ideologies that will eventually do us in, lest we make drastic changes.

 

[S.A.M.]

That has nothing to do with upholding your argument, our species has not slaughtered itself, you've killed no one lately, have you? According to you, it should be a daily event.

Killing is a daily event, don't you watch the news? And not everyone is subject to the same environmental pressures, which is why we have genetic diversity.

But it will most likely be the willingness to cling to false ideologies that will eventually do us in, lest we make drastic changes.

Whining is very unattractive in a grown man.

 

[(Q)]

Killing is a daily event, don't you watch the news? And not everyone is subject to the same environmental pressures, which is why we have genetic diversity.

Please explain how 'environmental pressures' cause more or less killing?

It would appear far more evident, as in hard evidence, that daily killing is more prevalent in societies wrought with false ideologies, like Islam, for example.

Whining is very unattractive in a grown man.

How disengenuous and immature of you to consider alternatives that would help mankind to survive as whining.

But, it's not surprising to see those responses from you when you're cornered and have nothing to say.

 

[S.A.M.]

Please explain how 'environmental pressures' cause more or less killing?

It would appear far more evident, as in hard evidence, that daily killing is more prevalent in societies wrought with false ideologies, like Islam, for example.

You mean in places with less education and less exposure to science and technology and hence more vulnerable to exploitation and fear from those with more education and greater exposure to S&T?

This explains why such places also have higher birth rates, right?

How disengenuous and immature of you to consider alternatives that would help mankind to survive as whining.

I had no idea mankind was in danger of extinction. Don't you mean provide people with equal opportunities for better lives?

But, it's not surprising to see those responses from you when you're cornered and have nothing to say.

No fear of that, ever.

 

[baumgarten]

It would appear far more evident, as in hard evidence, that daily killing is more prevalent in societies wrought with false ideologies, like Islam, for example.

How is ideological tension not an environmental pressure?
On a similar note, notice that murder is fairly uncommon in places like the Bible Belt, where a "false ideology" is overwhelmingly prevalent. Only when two or more such ideologies conflict with each other, as in Iraq, does bloodshed break out.

I see no guarantee that knowledge of the truth would stop people killing each other. Why, if you happen to be an emotional individual, the truth may lead to the opposite.

 

[(Q)]

You mean in places with less education and less exposure to science and technology and hence more vulnerable to exploitation and fear from those with more education and greater exposure to S&T?

This explains why such places also have higher birth rates, right?

You conveniently didn't answer the question, hence did not back up your emotionally charged claim. Hot air.

I had no idea mankind was in danger of extinction. Don't you mean provide people with equal opportunities for better lives?

False ideologies must be removed first if equal opportunities are to become a reality.

 

[(Q)]

How is ideological tension not an environmental pressure?
On a similar note, notice that murder is fairly uncommon in places like the Bible Belt, where a "false ideology" is overwhelmingly prevalent. Only when two or more such ideologies conflict with each other, as in Iraq, does bloodshed break out.

Huh? The bible belt of the US has the highest crime rates in the country, pal. Where ya been?

 

[Adstar]

That is not what is ment by "predetermination" We know god has not pre-programed anything, however if free will exists, and a choice will be made, how do you account foreknowledge for that choice? if not predetermined?




Hense no free will! if an entity has foreknowledge of a choice, then there's no free will, it has been "predetermined" what that choice will be!

I have free will, and no entity can predetermine what my choices will be, "it" can't have foreknowledge of my choices, I have to deal with the consequences of choices made. Thus true free will, is to accept that no entity exists, that can predetermine, have foreknowledge of any choice one makes!

You simply are unable to understand. your logic is your prison.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days

 

[baumgarten]

Huh? The bible belt of the US has the highest crime rates in the country, pal. Where ya been?

Right, since that's comparable to the sectarian violence in Iraq.