Because firstly, time is not a thing, it only exists if there is a presence that can put a value on their own existence.
Time Travel is Science Fiction
- Thread starter Farsight
- Start date
Time is not something we can see, touch or smell......
If time did not exist we would not be here, and the BB would not have happened.
But anyway, this is not the subject of this thread.
The subject of this thread is time travel can not be true.
We invented time, time is an invention by humanity to record our own existence, a pink invisible unicorn that does not have a relationship to space. Time and space is not entangled.
If time is invented, how can you travel back through an invention that does not exist, except in the form of an invisible pink unicorn?.
Time dilation of an atom is explained by physics. The steady state of gravity on the ground being different to that at altitude.
Muons are by timing,
GPS is explained by distance displacement by curvature.
''If time did not exist we would not be here, and the BB would not have happened.''
Yes it would, but no one would be here to observe it had happened and added a time scale to it.
Last edited:
No it would not. The BB was an evolution of space and time.
But if you have another theory, then take it to the alternative section.
I cant really be bothered with someone that claims time is not real but suggests shadows and dark is. Bye,
You can say what you like Farsight....But the evidence is there for all to see.
I have not had threads closed or others moved to alternative sections as you have.
I defend the scientific method and peer review, which you have so often deride, I defend accepted theory and knowledge against those that seek to tear the establishment down, due to their own inflated egos, religious convictions, or just that rather anti science trait that some have. I defend "observers" that come here for knowledge, and are then confronted with pseudoscience such as the speed of light is not constant, or in this thread's case, the laws of physics and GR forbid time travel.
I defend against any ego inflated individual that comes here, claims to have a TOE, then derides the scientific method, peer review and then misinterprets more then a 100 years of knowledge.
Last edited:
Yes I do.
I didn't start this thread to bait people. I started it to explain why time travel is never going to happen. I think the thing about the stasis box is the killer - you "travel to the future" by not moving at all, whilst everything else does.
Not so. There's plenty of peer-reviewed woo out there. Woo-mongers review papers by woo-mongers. have a look at Woit's blog.billvon said:
I don't have the comprehension problem, it's guys like paddoboy who says clocks measure the flow of time.billvon said:
Only we can't. And when you heat up a gas all you're doing is making the molecules move faster.billvon said:
Landau Roof
Registered Senior Member
Hey Farsight, et al, I don't know if this is what you mean by the quote above, or if I am now asking about something else, but riddle me this:
If I were to try some 'easy' time traveling, say I want to travel 24 hours into the future to here in my living room... well, my living room along with the rest of the world would have traveled how far in it's annual journey around the sun?
Some sci-fi time machines don't go anywhere. They just travel forward or backward in the same place they are occupying. But besides all the calculations of moving in time, the machine would also have to calculate place. I can have my time-machine onboard computer calculate where my living room will be tomorrow, and I can assume it will be at the same height above sea level and the building's foundation, but if I were to go backward or forward many years, how could I know I won't appear eighty feet off the ground? Or if the computer miscalculated I could end up in Earth's orbital path, but thousands of miles from the planet. Now if I saved my pennies and got one of those sorts of time machines that could take me to places beyond my living room, like ancient Greece, say, or Greece 10,000 years hence, the calculations become a lot trickier. Even if I could calculate the exact position of my destination in space, how could I know I won't appear 1000 feet above the ground, or even inside of a mountain?
Well, we're 93 million miles from the sun, so the circumference of the Earth's orbit is about 600 million miles, and there's 365 days in a year, so the Earth has travelled about 1.6 million miles.
You can't, and it's all academic anyway, because the past isn't a place you can travel to. Clocks clock up motion, there's no such thing as negative motion, and there's no way you can move such that the motion of everything else was undone.
Landau Roof
Registered Senior Member
Yes. I know all that. I agree with you. That's why I'm imagining a trip forward in time of just 24 hours to my own living room. My question is - wouldn't my living room traveled about 1,610,592 miles through space during those 24 hours? And how could the time machine move forward that far and fast in space besides traveling in time? I mean, it just shows how ridiculously difficult time travel would be.
Last edited:
Yes. And the Sun is going round the galaxy, and our galaxy is moving too. See the CMBR dipole anisotropy on Wiki, which says our local group of galaxies is moving at 627 km/s relative to the reference frame of the CMB. Since there's 86,400 seconds in a day, we're moving 54,172,800 kilometres through the universe a day. And the rest.
You betchya. Only it isn't just ridiculously difficult. It's ridiculous. It's right up there with heaven and hell and sweet baby Jesus. But people do so love their woo.
farsight,
you give me the impression that you are afraid of change.
you like humanity as it is.
this leads to a result of your actions, sticking your fingers in your ears screaming na na na, claiming everything is wrong or doesn't exist.
if anything,
the past should have shown you that, it is sci-fi that decides the future.
it's the sci fi that creates the path.
everything that exist in our world today, was once sci-fi.
there were once individuals who spewed the same things in the past.
example:
" What, sir? You would make a ship sail against the wind and currents by lighting a bonfire under her decks? I have no time to listen to such nonsense. "
[ Napoleon Bonaparte to Robert Fulton, upon hearing of the latter's plans for a steam-powered engine.]
you give me the impression that you are afraid of change.
you like humanity as it is.
this leads to a result of your actions, sticking your fingers in your ears screaming na na na, claiming everything is wrong or doesn't exist.
if anything,
the past should have shown you that, it is sci-fi that decides the future.
it's the sci fi that creates the path.
everything that exist in our world today, was once sci-fi.
there were once individuals who spewed the same things in the past.
example:
" What, sir? You would make a ship sail against the wind and currents by lighting a bonfire under her decks? I have no time to listen to such nonsense. "
[ Napoleon Bonaparte to Robert Fulton, upon hearing of the latter's plans for a steam-powered engine.]
Like Stephen Hawking?
Yep. I mean, have you ever read How to build a time machine? It's just popscience junk for kids:
"To approach the speed of light means circling the Earth pretty fast. Seven times a second. But no matter how much power the train has, it can never quite reach the speed of light, since the laws of physics forbid it. Instead, let's say it gets close, just shy of that ultimate speed. Now something extraordinary happens. Time starts flowing slowly on board relative to the rest of the world, just like near the black hole, only more so. Everything on the train is in slow motion..."
Time dilation isn't time travel. If you were on that train we could watch you every step of the way, and you don't end up in the middle of next week. It's no more a time machine than a refrigerator.
"To approach the speed of light means circling the Earth pretty fast. Seven times a second. But no matter how much power the train has, it can never quite reach the speed of light, since the laws of physics forbid it. Instead, let's say it gets close, just shy of that ultimate speed. Now something extraordinary happens. Time starts flowing slowly on board relative to the rest of the world, just like near the black hole, only more so. Everything on the train is in slow motion..."
Time dilation isn't time travel. If you were on that train we could watch you every step of the way, and you don't end up in the middle of next week. It's no more a time machine than a refrigerator.
Yeah, well thanks for that...
Last edited:
time dilation or traveling at the speed of light is not needed to time travel.
you can time travel by jumping out of the time line.
it's mainly high energy physics.
Well at least you admit to being wrong....That's a start.
Yes you do...You start many threads to bait people and spread your woo concepts. That is evident in some of your threads being closed and others moved to the fringe sections.
I don't have the comprehension problem, it's guys like paddoboy who says clocks measure the flow of time.
Time is not a gas.
The true nature of time is unknown, even if I may be so bold, from the PoV of those claiming to have a ToE.
You do have a ToE dont you Farsight?.........................
Last edited:
Landau Roof
Registered Senior Member
Or perhaps the situation of a time machine moving forward on Earth (in my living room) would be akin to jumping inside a train. I mean, like when you are standing inside a speeding commuter train and suddenly jump high. You don't go flying toward the back of the car and smashing into the door - you move with (and relative to) the train. Perhaps time travel, if it were possible, would be like that. Yet, even then if I traveled say 250 years into the future, I have no way of knowing if my living room at its present height from the ground is still where it is now. I would not know if this location is underwater or perhaps some part of a new building. I could arrive 250 years hence partly in a concrete wall or floor - how could I or my time machine possibly know in advance...?
Whatever you think about time travel, it most certainly IS NOT FORBIDDEN BY THE LAWS OF PHYSICS AND GR"
It won't be easy, but I'm sure any sufficiently advanced civilisation could achieve it.
Landau Roof
Registered Senior Member
You say that as if it were an accomplished fact. As if the human perception of history were as real as a river or planetary path. You claim to be a scientist, yet you accept things on faith. Does not a 'time line' refer to past time? How can there be known future time lines? How can we reverse all that has ever happened and undo all that physical motion that has occurred and travel backward through time? It's nonsense, or at best science fiction-fantasy. (Shakes head)
Last edited:
Not quite. Time on board, relative to those onboard, or in that same FoR, experiences nothing strange...It flows/passes./progresses as per normal at one second/second.
Time on the train only appears slower from the FoR of someone in another FoR.
Sure it is.
If that train stops and the people get out, they will find they have aged less then those that were not on the train.
To take that further....
If you and I were twins Farsight, and me being the more intrepid took a trip on a space ship at 99.999% "c" for six months, turned around and returned six months later.....from the PoV of my own FoR, I will return to an Earth around 230 years later, and you long since dead and buried. At the same time, my clocks show that only 12 months have passed, both mechanically and with myself biologically,
Now that's travelling into the future.
Last edited: