There was no Sun worship

J

John99

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I moved some posts from "Who was Jesus talking to when he said..." to a new thread here because John started another subject altogether, i.e., he thinks that there has never existed Sun worship on Earth.
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Medicine*Woman said:
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M*W: To whom was Jesus talking when he allegedly cried out from the cross in Greek, no less, and said, "Eli, eli, lama sabachtheni?" (My god, my god, why have you forsaken me?)

Let me explain... "El" is a shortened form of "Elias," the sun god "Helios," to whom Jesus called out from the cross. "El" is the sun. The "Elohim" also represents the many stars. Also known as the "Ali," who were associated with gods. "Ali" is Egyptian in origin and represents the "Atum," "Aten," and the "Amen," who are all part of "Elohim." "Atum" was later known as "Adam."

Jesus, as the sun of god, was crying out to his heavenly father/creator god, the sun, "Eli" and/or "Helios" who had abandoned him on the cross that day. Then the skies grew dark and stormy as the sun set behind the earth and died.
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First we need to cosider the fact that without the Sun there would be no life, this is a simple fact of nature. However, this can be said about many things such as water, throughout human history we have always been very aware of this. Yet we dont claim that water was once worshipped, for anyone to say 'Sun, Sun why have you forsaken me' at the moment of death is far fetched and would indicate very low IQ. As a matter of fact it is hard to believe a human under any circumstances would say such a thing. It is like looking at an egg and saying 'why have you forsaken me'.

Humans identify with humans and to a lesser extent other living creatures. The Sun is an object but has no characteristics humans would identify with. I doubt that the Sun was ever worshipped at all, more than likely this stems from a misunderstanding of ancient people and ancient art which draws some amazing conclusions. We can look at artifacts and can claim to know more from them but we dont, whatever makes us feel better i guess.

The moral of the story is just because we read about things and see it in movies does not make it true. Of course i am fairly certain i know why it was said but our civilization is not ready to know this- absolute truth. I just dont know what kind of effect it would have.
 
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Oli said:
Wow, you don't know about heliolatry?
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It is impossible to worship something that cannot respond in any way whatsoever, it is like worshipping a Maseratti. If people worship the Sun and equate it with life they can just as well worship bacteria.
 
John99 said:
It is impossible to worship something that cannot respond in any way whatsoever, it is like worshipping a Maseratti. If people worship the Sun and equate it with life they can just as well worship bacteria.
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Nevertheless it was done.
 
The sun looks more magnificent and because of its energy and gravitational force there is life on this planet what can not be said about bacteria.

Your claim that people didn't worship the Sun is uneducated at best. I've just returned from a festival where ancient baltic hymns to the Sun were sung.
 
Avatar said:
The sun looks more magnificent and because of its energy and gravitational force there is life on this planet what can not be said about bacteria.

Your claim that people didn't worship the Sun is uneducated at best. I've just returned from a festival where ancient baltic hymns to the Sun were sung.
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Oh, excuse me you went to a festival anf got educated.

Just because it 'looks magnificent' does not change the fact that it is no more important to human existence than bacteria. Without bacteria we would not survive more than a few hours.

Oli -
Nevertheless it was done.
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I think we make more of it being done then it actually was. And of course who does not like the Sun?:rolleyes:
 
John99 said:
Oh, excuse me you went to a festival anf got educated.
Just because it 'looks magnificent' does not change the fact that it is no more important to human existence than bacteria. Without bacteria we would not survive more than a few hours.
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None of which was known back then.
 
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John99 said:
Oh, excuse me you went to a festival anf got educated.

Just because it 'looks magnificent' does not change the fact that it is no more important to human existence than bacteria. Without bacteria we would not survive more than a few hours.

Oli -

I think we make more of it being done then it actually was.
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1. That was an example that proves the point.
2. Sun is more important to the existence of life on this planet. It's simple cosmology, not even biology.
 
Avatar said:
1. That was an example that proves the point.
2. Sun is more important to the existence of life on this planet. It's simple cosmology, not even biology.
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You are wrong. No one thing is more important than another essential element for providing life.

You know what the problem is? Intellectual dishonesty.

If in the distant future a few artifact from our civilization reamain and one is the a copy of the Beatles - 'Here come the sun' recording will that be enough to conclude that we worship the sun? It is no different than what you are doing.
 
I refuse further conversation on this subject with you because you're so dumb my head hurts.

The Sun holds this little planet in place, kid, without it Earth would be a dead rock probably spinning into some black hole. No, not even that, without the Sun there would have been no Earth in the first place.
 
Avatar said:
The Sun holds this little planet in place, kid, without it Earth would be a dead rock probably spinning into some black hole. No, not even that, without the Sun there would have been no Earth in the first place.
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Yes, good plan, there.
 
Here are some good articles for you to read:

http://www.stephenjaygould.org/library/gould_bacteria.html
http://www.actionbioscience.org/biodiversity/wassenaar.html

I have concluded that perceived 'Sun Worship' is a straw man, a figment of imagination and overactive fantasy. It is quite possible ancient people did not even know life could not exist without the sun but they sure knew they would not survive without food and water. So maybe the worshipped a river or a food source for that matter.
 
Indeed, some rivers were also worshipped. Indian Ganges is a goddess, for example. There were many sea and ocean spirits. In Greek mythology Ocean is a god.
In ancient Egypt floods were seen as a holy act of god.

Without the Sun there is no warmth, no plants grow and there is starvation and suffering. You don't have to be an expert to see how important is the Sun to life.

p.s. I laugh in the general direction of your conclusion.
 
Avatar, many objects are elevated to high status for whatever reason. Festivals, clebrations or ceremonies incorporate this folk art form of 'worship'.

I know that from the first time breath was drawn by a human he looked up towards the sky for a living entity, a creator. They didnt look up at another rock and say 'ewww wonder what it is thinking'.
 
In Latvia we had a huge rock called Staburags that was seen as a spirit and a meeting place for the gods. Unfortunately now it's under water.

Oli said:
Which just goes to show how little you actually know.
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Agreed
 
Oli said:
Which just goes to show how little you actually know.
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How did you conclude that ancient people worshipped the sun? NOT appreciated it or recognized its importance, actual full out worship.

My main objective is to point out M*W's innacurate deduction that any person in the last minutes of life would wonder why the SUN would foresake them. Wholly illogical.
 
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History lessons, anthropology, the usual.
It's called an education (look the word up on-line).
There were a number of civilisations that practised sun worship and deified the sun (and moon).
 
Oli said:
History lessons, anthropology, the usual.
It's called an education (look the word up on-line).
There were a number of civilisations that practised sun worship and deified the sun (and moon).
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Give specifics, a cave drawing of a big ball in the sky means shit. Modern people who go out in the sun for a tan are calle what??? SUN WORSHIPPERS.
 
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