so we should just ignore an attempt to overthrow the government?
The Trump Presidency
- Thread starter joepistole
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I think the key issue here is not the protesters or accused insurrectionists but the law enforcement that allowed it.
The real crime of treason is when a sworn officer deliberately fails to uphold his oath of office. (?)
There was evidence I believe that indicated that the law enforcement situation was severely compromised that allowed what could have been just a loud pro trump protest turn into a riot.
I personally do not believe there was an attempt at insurrection ( as there appeared to be no follow though planning involved) although that belief may change as more evidence comes to light. I believe that there was however, a general consensus amongst Capital protection staff to help facilitate the incursion into the house.
One article suggested that the chief of that protection staff (since resigned) requested assistance on many occasions only to have his requests rejected.
The why his requests were frustrated should be investigated thoroughly...
My guess is that the Trump administration did all it could to ensure easy access to an angry mob and deliberately denied assistance when it was called for.
... just thoughts premised on limited information and video clips.
The real crime of treason is when a sworn officer deliberately fails to uphold his oath of office. (?)
There was evidence I believe that indicated that the law enforcement situation was severely compromised that allowed what could have been just a loud pro trump protest turn into a riot.
I personally do not believe there was an attempt at insurrection ( as there appeared to be no follow though planning involved) although that belief may change as more evidence comes to light. I believe that there was however, a general consensus amongst Capital protection staff to help facilitate the incursion into the house.
One article suggested that the chief of that protection staff (since resigned) requested assistance on many occasions only to have his requests rejected.
The why his requests were frustrated should be investigated thoroughly...
My guess is that the Trump administration did all it could to ensure easy access to an angry mob and deliberately denied assistance when it was called for.
... just thoughts premised on limited information and video clips.
By starting the impeachment of trump, Trumps capacity to act with out heavy monitoring is limited. It sends a strong signal that Trump faces consequences for his past activities but more importantly for any future activities especially over the next few weeks while the impeachment process is under way.
He wants/needs all eyes on him... and so be it...
He wants/needs all eyes on him... and so be it...
over conflating the issue is going to work in trumps favor.
Why do you you think there was any attempt to over throw the Government?
There was no means for them to do that.
There were no plans to hold building against a counter.
There may have been plans by a few protester to hold hostages ( zip ties?)
There is every possibility that Trump had hoped that the incursion may spark the military to join in...falsely believing that the support offered to him personally was greater than the support for the constitution.
Perhaps he was attempting to capitalize on his 70 million voters, narcissistically believing himself to be more important than the constitution.
His strategy failed so he tells them all he "Loves them and they should go home" but if his strategy succeeded a popular uprising may have eventuated.
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sculptor
Valued Senior Member
it does not matter
The only things missing from the shit show are
- the arena being a large square
- the 3 ropes surrounding the square
- a decent referee
- a bell which goes (beep) I mean DING DING End round ONE
It matters because, as Bells said, if the senate finds him guilty then they could prevent him from ever standing for public office again, among other things. That would mean he couldn't run for President in 2024, for starters, which can only be a good thing for the nation.
Personally, I don't think a two-thirds majority vote in the senate to impeach Trump is at all likely to be attainable. The Republican party is, for the most part, now the party of Trump. His loyal followers won't vote to impeach him in the Senate. Some Republicans might break ranks, this second time around, but it's unlikely that enough will do so, even considering what is at stake.
sculptor
Valued Senior Member
IF
if
if
if
if
Nancy could bring the house down around Trump's head and it still won't matter
Trump will be out of office in 8 days without Nancy's help
so
It does not matter what she and her house do to try and harm or embarrass Trump
It is all just meaningless grandstanding trickery
(Don't these people have anything productive to do?)
IF I were a betting man, I would give odds against the senate voting to convict in the time remaining
2:1
3:1
10:1
100:1
It ain't gonna happen
So
If it ain't gonna happen
then pretending that there is value in initiating impeachment proceedings
is an exercise in time wasting futility.
........................................................................
but
then again
I could be wrong
sculptor
Valued Senior Member
Impeachment without conviction will have no deleterious effect on our lame duck president.
Trump seems to love playing the victim.
Attempted impeachment may actually strengthen his political base.
Schmelzer
Valued Senior Member
A legitimately elected President, one of the three pillars of the US government, was about to be confirmed, and people attempted to stop that confirmation in an effort to install their own choice. How would you describe it if not an attempt to overthrow the vote, and because of what the vote represented, the government?
But it may harm his chances of the Republicans allowing him to stand under their banner in 4 years, giving him a track record that they think will harm his candidacy. That may be the case even without further efforts at impeachment, but prolonging the issue in the public domain might damage further any future political intention he has. Who yet knows.
Schmelzer
Valued Senior Member
I think you got the timing wrong. AFAI have read, the Reps wanted to start their objections. The best moment for the Dems to stop this. Remember that the police there is under Dem control. After all this ended, the Reps did no longer aim to start objections and accepted everything.
So, it was the last legal attempt of the Reps to fight the result of the elections, which was prevented. If you want to describe that action as a coup, ok, but then, please, as part of the Dem coup - stealing the elections and preventing public representations of the proofs.
As a Trump-side coup that timing makes no sense at all.
Moreover, it makes no sense to name a coup something which had no plan and no chance at all. What I have suggested as the Dem plan was a reasonable and meaningful plan and it actually reached the presumed aims, 100%. And they have even created a possibility to reach something like this:
Who yet knows if there will be Trump alive 2024. Or elections at all 2024. Or Dem or Rep parties. Or the US.
thats what its called when people want to murder sitting congress critters. i know i know its was done by right wing nut cases you have aligned yourself to so it doesn't countAttempts to overthrow? LOL.
the capitol police isn't under dem control. it is in control opf congress as a whole which you'll note your favorite fascist control the senate
legal yes ethical no
they didn't steal the election. there was no election fraud. iut was a fascist coup attempt by people you support
sure it does. all their intended victims were all in the same place.
it could have succeeded had they not been led away from the senate chambers.
what you suggested was a fever dream concoction of your conspiracy theories. quite frankly if you had anysort of real platform you would have to be consitered culpable given how aggressively yougve pushed the election was stolon from herr trump.
thats on you and yours. hope you like the blood bath the lies you've told has led too
sculptor
Valued Senior Member
Have you read my joke about Tommy?
Do you want to?
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