The Logistics of Knowing Everything

PsychoticEpisode

It is very dry in here today
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Should God know the future? Assuming He is real, being omniscient has to be God's greatest attribute. The amount of knowledge required to run the physical universe is staggering, let alone other realms. However I see a couple of problems with it.

I'm not sure if God can be omniscient with a plan. A plan implies a strategy and in order for it to be perfectly executed then every cause and effect has to have been choreographed by God Himself, nothing can be haphazard.

If you take me for instance, every particle of my being has to have been arranged just for this moment. If one of my atoms is from a supernova explosion 10 billion years in the past then God arranged for cosmic events to occur over that time period in order for that one piece of the puzzle to be a part of me. Multiply that by who knows what and you'll arrive at a figure that's transcalculational. He has to possess this knowledge just to be able to predict the future with unerring accuracy. There is no other way.

Can he simply predict a future event without worrying about how everything comes to be in place? Possibly, but I don't see how without the complete knowledge of the universe and by employing a hands on approach. He would have to give up omniscient status if He lacked control.

So in actuality I'm offering a reason for God, the orchestrator of everything. This must be what He does every waking second, ensure the plan works as He said it would. Wait a minute. If every moment, infinite little bits of time, has God doing His thing on a universal scale just so the plan succeeds then He wouldn't get past one second, let alone 15 billion years while lost in infinite segments of time.

God still may exist but He isn't omniscient. Oh I'm sure God can count to infinity if He had to, but I cannot see Him as all knowing. There is a paradox of information, there can be no infinites if God is to carry out His strategy. Maybe God set things in motion and relied on His super knowledge to calculate likelihoods but that's it.
 
I don't view it that way. Personally, I do find the idea of a Creator plausible, but not an omniscient one. There is no way, at least, it's highly unlikely

I find it more likely that the universe might have been created by some sort of intelligence with certain physical and natural laws, and the rest is natural progression
 
God should both know the future and understand that letting himself know the future and use it to his own advantage would undermine him as a fair power user...therefore God would not know the future because he chooses not to.
 
Just as a thought experiment.

1) Perhaps there is a multiverse of all possible worlds
2) God knows them all
3) We can navigate amongst these options.
 
Just as a thought experiment.

1) Perhaps there is a multiverse of all possible worlds
2) God knows them all
3) We can navigate amongst these options.

Are you saying 'if this then that'? That way all possibilities are covered?

How can we navigate without knowledge aforehand? God would be the navigator, no?
 
Are you saying 'if this then that'? That way all possibilities are covered?
don't know what you mean.

How can we navigate without knowledge aforehand? God would be the navigator, no?
We would be choosing different routes through the variety of possibities. I don't think God would be navigating. Actually I think there could be an atheist version of this.
 
don't know what you mean.

We would be choosing different routes through the variety of possibities. I don't think God would be navigating. Actually I think there could be an atheist version of this.

It is common knowledge that god uses a moral compass.
 
Are you saying 'if this then that'? That way all possibilities are covered?

How can we navigate without knowledge aforehand? God would be the navigator, no?
I should add PE that I am just imagining something that I am not even sure is possible. I am not putting it forward as a claim. So going back to the OP 'the future' might be more complicated than we tend to think. God might know 'the futures'.
 
Should God know the future? Assuming He is real, being omniscient has to be God's greatest attribute. The amount of knowledge required to run the physical universe is staggering, let alone other realms. However I see a couple of problems with it.

I'm not sure if God can be omniscient with a plan. A plan implies a strategy and in order for it to be perfectly executed then every cause and effect has to have been choreographed by God Himself, nothing can be haphazard.

If you take me for instance, every particle of my being has to have been arranged just for this moment. If one of my atoms is from a supernova explosion 10 billion years in the past then God arranged for cosmic events to occur over that time period in order for that one piece of the puzzle to be a part of me. Multiply that by who knows what and you'll arrive at a figure that's transcalculational. He has to possess this knowledge just to be able to predict the future with unerring accuracy. There is no other way.

Can he simply predict a future event without worrying about how everything comes to be in place? Possibly, but I don't see how without the complete knowledge of the universe and by employing a hands on approach. He would have to give up omniscient status if He lacked control.

So in actuality I'm offering a reason for God, the orchestrator of everything. This must be what He does every waking second, ensure the plan works as He said it would. Wait a minute. If every moment, infinite little bits of time, has God doing His thing on a universal scale just so the plan succeeds then He wouldn't get past one second, let alone 15 billion years while lost in infinite segments of time.

God still may exist but He isn't omniscient. Oh I'm sure God can count to infinity if He had to, but I cannot see Him as all knowing. There is a paradox of information, there can be no infinites if God is to carry out His strategy. Maybe God set things in motion and relied on His super knowledge to calculate likelihoods but that's it.
In short ....

Iso Invocation: The Personality of Godhead is perfect and complete, and because He is completely perfect, all emanations from Him, such as this phenomenal world, are perfectly equipped as complete wholes. Whatever is produced of the Complete Whole is also complete in itself. Because He is the Complete Whole, even though so many complete units emanate from Him, He remains the complete balance.


In other words it is the unique capacity of god that he can emanate things that can operate as complete wholes without diminishing himself.

The logistics of us doing that are next to nil, as anyone working in IT support will testify ....
:D
 
lightgigantic;1934937In other words it is the unique capacity of god that he can emanate things that can operate as complete wholes without diminishing himself.[/QUOTE said:
If so then He doesn't need to be here.

Anyway I'm off to another part of the world for a few days. Comforting to know God had worked this out eons ago. As to where I'm going I'm a litle perplexed at why a difficult situation exists there for other humans I share the planet with but I have to assume their suffering is in the exact time slot it was allotted. Are they merely stage props? Shakespeare was right.... One man in his time plays many parts. So far I like my role.

If I decide not to go then I can also take comfort knowing that it was meant to be. Knowing my life is scripted means I can take comfort for any decision but so can anyone else. Unfortunately that makes me uncomfortable. Pardoxes abound
 
If so then He doesn't need to be here.
well you don't seem to have seen him lately
Anyway I'm off to another part of the world for a few days. Comforting to know God had worked this out eons ago. As to where I'm going I'm a litle perplexed at why a difficult situation exists there for other humans I share the planet with but I have to assume their suffering is in the exact time slot it was allotted. Are they merely stage props? Shakespeare was right.... One man in his time plays many parts. So far I like my role.
safe travels
everyone's role affords the possibility of fulfilling desires, so happiness visits everyone, as well as distress

If I decide not to go then I can also take comfort knowing that it was meant to be. Knowing my life is scripted means I can take comfort for any decision but so can anyone else. Unfortunately that makes me uncomfortable. Pardoxes abound

BG 18.59 If you do not act according to My direction and do not fight, then you will be falsely directed. By your nature, you will have to be engaged in warfare.

Basic gist is that your duty arises from your nature .... and since there is no scope for avoiding your nature, act you must
;)
 
BG 18.59 If you do not act according to My direction and do not fight, then you will be falsely directed. By your nature, you will have to be engaged in warfare.

The Gita was a fun read at the time. I never took it seriously and I still don't but I loved that passage. I'm engaged in 'innocent civilian".:D

Pick it up again next week, ciao.
 
I should add PE that I am just imagining something that I am not even sure is possible. I am not putting it forward as a claim. So going back to the OP 'the future' might be more complicated than we tend to think. God might know 'the futures'.

I wonder whether he cheats by buying pork belly futures ?
 
god can't know the future because that would violate the creation principle (free will).

creation isn't something that triggers just once in the past and then it can't be changed. god creates the universe in every moment. the future wasn't created in the past, it is created in the now.

knowing the future for absolute certainty is paradoxical and impossible. if god knew what he was going to create or do, he could easily just choose to not do it.

to know your future actions is free will. for example, i know that i'm going to stop writing now.
 
god can't know the future because that would violate the creation principle (free will).

creation isn't something that triggers just once in the past and then it can't be changed. god creates the universe in every moment. the future wasn't created in the past, it is created in the now.

knowing the future for absolute certainty is paradoxical and impossible. if god knew what he was going to create or do, he could easily just choose to not do it.

to know your future actions is free will. for example, i know that i'm going to stop writing now.

In a nutshell, god doesn't know what the hell he is doing. That figures !
 
Should God know the future? Assuming He is real, being omniscient has to be God's greatest attribute. The amount of knowledge required to run the physical universe is staggering, let alone other realms. However I see a couple of problems with it.

I'm not sure if God can be omniscient with a plan. A plan implies a strategy and in order for it to be perfectly executed then every cause and effect has to have been choreographed by God Himself, nothing can be haphazard.

You have not defined the problem only your difficulty in believing. The problem is you cannot believe that God can come up with a plan and set in motion, a realm that will produce the outcome.

If you take me for instance, every particle of my being has to have been arranged just for this moment. If one of my atoms is from a supernova explosion 10 billion years in the past then God arranged for cosmic events to occur over that time period in order for that one piece of the puzzle to be a part of me. Multiply that by who knows what and you'll arrive at a figure that's transcalculational. He has to possess this knowledge just to be able to predict the future with unerring accuracy. There is no other way.

Yes he has that knowledge but not to predict the future because he is outside our time and knows the beginning of our time and the end of it all at once. You cannot comprehend this other way and because you are so full of pride you believe if you cannot comprehend it then it cannot exist.

Can he simply predict a future event without worrying about how everything comes to be in place? Possibly, but I don't see how without the complete knowledge of the universe and by employing a hands on approach. He would have to give up omniscient status if He lacked control.

He does have complete knowledge of the universe and he has injected his interventions at the right moments. Jesus being the most important input.

So in actuality I'm offering a reason for God, the orchestrator of everything. This must be what He does every waking second, ensure the plan works as He said it would. Wait a minute. If every moment, infinite little bits of time, has God doing His thing on a universal scale just so the plan succeeds then He wouldn't get past one second, let alone 15 billion years while lost in infinite segments of time.

A scientist sets up a laser and prism's to create a light dispersal. He has pre thought out the layout and knows the dynamics of the procedure. He knows when he turns the laser on where the beam will go and how the prisms will effect the light and he knows what the end result will be, the type of light he wants at the end of the experiment. Turning on the laser the results to him are instant, as he had planned. The experiment does not appear to the scientist as a beam travelling through prisms but a picture of light instantly seen as a whole.

God still may exist but He isn't omniscient. Oh I'm sure God can count to infinity if He had to, but I cannot see Him as all knowing. There is a paradox of information, there can be no infinites if God is to carry out His strategy. Maybe God set things in motion and relied on His super knowledge to calculate likelihoods but that's it.

God does exist and He is Omniscient. Knowing the beginning and the end just as the scriptures reveal. :)


All Praise The Ancient Of Days
 
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