The German Forced to Become a Turk

[Doreen]

Doreen he had no choice right?

No reasonable person would suggest he should have made his parents return to Turkey or turn them in as a minor.

I mean he was born in Germany but by law that doesn't make one an instant german citizen.

I know. I never asserted this.

I have no idea what you mean by him being 'unborn'.

I meant that the law essentially criminalizes the unborn.

During Thatcher there were many children who were born in England who lost their status and given the domicile of their parents, that was the law and it didn't matter if they had ever been to the land of their parents or not. It was Thatcher's attempt at controlling immigration.

Yes, some governments act like this. I am not denying that some governments act like this.

This guy is a grown adult Doreen not an infant.

That is the problem. If her were an infant he could be repatriated with his parents, no problem. He has not culture shock, his family is his world.

The fact that its his parents who made the decision is meant to thwart parents into thinking that they can gain status for their children and themselves by simply having a child in the country.

I understand the intention of the law. But the government messed up. They missed them this whole time. To send the parents back, I can understand, but not the now adult child who is innocent and as far as his experience of life, German.

Its like this case here in Ireland:
(snip)

Again. I am not saying it does not happen. I am saying it is wrong in this case. He is culturally German. He speaks German not Turkish. He did not come illegally to Germany since he was either not born or in any case a minor. The government needs to take responsibility for the current situation and not make an innocent suffer. Someone caught with a small child is an entirely different situation. That child is still in the bosom of the family and probably culturally at least if not more so at home in the original country. Nothing in your response to me shows you understand this issue.

 

[Mrs.Lucysnow]

No reasonable person would suggest he should have made his parents return to Turkey or turn them in as a minor.

I know. I never asserted this.
I meant that the law essentially criminalizes the unborn.

Yes, some governments act like this. I am not denying that some governments act like this.

That is the problem. If her were an infant he could be repatriated with his parents, no problem. He has not culture shock, his family is his world.

I understand the intention of the law. But the government messed up. They missed them this whole time. To send the parents back, I can understand, but not the now adult child who is innocent and as far as his experience of life, German.

Its like this case here in Ireland:
(snip)

Again. I am not saying it does not happen. I am saying it is wrong in this case. He is culturally German. He speaks German not Turkish. He did not come illegally to Germany since he was either not born or in any case a minor. The government needs to take responsibility for the current situation and not make an innocent suffer. Someone caught with a small child is an entirely different situation. That child is still in the bosom of the family and probably culturally at least if not more so at home in the original country. Nothing in your response to me shows you understand this issue.

Well I'm glad Doreen because I never suggested anywhere or at anytime that he should turn in his parents or make them return to Turkey

I am saying that laws like these are there to deter the PARENTS from thinking they can change their status or that of their child by virtue of having a child in the country. If they know their children will have the same illegal status as they do even if born in the country then they are less likely to use it as a means to gain citizenship.

The law doesn't criminalize anyone! Citizenship from another nation is not a human right!!!! Its a privilege!!! They have these laws to protect their society from being flooded with illegals which THEY have to pay for. He was sent back to Turkey not the Sudan or Congo. The fact that he is not an infant doesn't make him any less an illegal immigrant under the law. He can always apply from citizenship from Turkey and he would probably be accepted by Germany (or not!) but if you ignore the law then you might as well open the border because there will always be another 'exception'.

He was illegal Doreen, being a child doesn't make him a legal citizen and neither is being born in the country, the fact that it wasn't his fault nor his decision is besides the point and irrelevant under the law. I know of a two children here in Cambodia, one of Irish parents and the other has one vietnamese and Israeli parent. Both children were born here in Cambodia and have never been anywhere else save on vacation and both children speak fluent Khmer. Neither were awarded with Cambodian citizenship. As far as the government is concerned they are NOT cambodian citizens. Both children were awarded the citizenship of their parents (Irish and Vietnamese). They cannot claim citizenship rights simply because they were raised in Cambodia and have never been to Ireland or Vietnam. They can apply for citizenship which really means to buy it but that is what they would have to do if they want to be recognized as citizens. If they for some reason stopped paying for their visa to remain in Cambodia they would be taken to immigration and deported.

I'm afraid it is YOU who hasn't understood the situation. You claim that he is an 'exception' because he was raised there and I am saying that this is besides the point and not a factor at all!!

I was raised in the US and I am not a US citizen. When I go back to the States and walk through immigration I am seen as an EU citizen. If I wanted to return to the States to work or do anything I would be treated as a foreign national NOT a citizen by virtue of all the time I was raised in the country. I can APPLY for citizenship but not assume I am one already just because I have spent most of my life there. The law wasn't created to punish anyone it is there to protect society in general. When I go to London I speak with a NY accent, I cannot navigate the streets of London like I can NY and if I don't tell someone I'm a Brit they will assume I am an American. Does this make me an American? No. Can I say to the US immigration that I belong in the States because I was enculturated there? No. Why? Because its not an argument. I am not one of their nationals and that is that.

This law is not uncommon nor is it wrong.

 

[PsychoTropicPuppy]

He was never German in the first place..if you want to point your finger at anyone then it should be the parents of said child, and not the government itself that is just enforcing the laws.