the "Devil" and the "Enemy"

But it isn't ONLY reason can see through this. there has to also be emotional freedom. intuition, ALL that the patriarchal deification of reason has demonized.
It is not only 'faith' -as in the patriarchal religions - that guides the patriarchal mindset, but 'reason' too. But it is a one-sided reason. This is clear when you look at the ideas of philsophy's
originators, like Plato, Pythagoras, and so on. There's is a 'reason' that fears and denigrates the body, and its intelligence. Actually they psychologically/physiologically, SEVER head from body. For example review Platonic dualism

The body and Nature are both feared by patriarchy. reason is only reasonable when it understands its DEEPER source
 
*************
M*W: Interesting list. Thanks for posting it. I happened to notice a couple of statistics I was familiar with:

~ Stalin murdered 50,000,000 of his own people
~ The Burning Times murdered 9,000,000 woman, mostly midwives
 
any time we have a thought to consider, we have the ability to think a contrasting thought. a productive thought sits beside a destructive. and visa versa. it inherent in the human ability to consider, reflect, and chose. the devil in christianity wasnt originally intended to equal something bad or evil, it was just a natural contrast. if it werent for the energy that final un-does life, the world would be a horrible horrible mess. un-creating things is just not a glamorous chore, but i imagine its no less important or valuable than creating things. its interesting how people have that choice, and in general we regard creating things as the only sane and acceptable choice, but if you take a look around you, creation seems to smother uncreation to the point of disease.. and there you go.
 
VossistArts said:
any time we have a thought to consider, we have the ability to think a contrasting thought. a productive thought sits beside a destructive.

d__which suugest complimentary opposits or extremes are are dynamically related. like life and death, and for example how decay gives life to the living plants, tress, etc

and visa versa. it inherent in the human ability to consider, reflect, and chose. the devil in christianity wasnt originally intended to equal something bad or evil, it was just a natural contrast.

d__i don't agree. with patriarchay, and especially with the absolute dualism of Christianity, we don't get the insight of complimentarity--as was understood in prepatriarchal mythology.....We rather get the idead indoctrinated of life AGANIST death, and good against evil, and light against dark. so what this does is it drasticallt affects how we ffel about ouselves, about Nature, and others we are taught to believe are 'evil'. why else do you think Christianity has been one of the most bloodthirstiest religions known to humans. it is cause of this sense of conflict between natrual complimentarities. they rather push everything into thier image of the Devil.

if it werent for the energy that final un-does life, the world would be a horrible horrible mess. un-creating things is just not a glamorous chore, but i imagine its no less important or valuable than creating things. its interesting how people have that choice, and in general we regard creating things as the only sane and acceptable choice, but if you take a look around you, creation seems to smother uncreation to the point of disease.. and there you go.
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i feel when people are indoctrinated to feear change and cylic life--the necessity of life and death and disease--is when the fear can actualize into destructive behaviour. if you demonize Nature then you have no deep respect for it, and you want to hurt it, and escape from it!
 
duendy: i feel when people are indoctrinated to feear change and cylic life--the necessity of life and death and disease--is when the fear can actualize into destructive behaviour. if you demonize Nature then you have no deep respect for it, and you want to hurt it, and escape from it!
*************
M*W: That's why I say christianity is based on the evil darkness of negativity, and that it will destroy the believer from within -- thanks to Paul's personal pride and greed (both negatives), and the early christian patriarchy who created a pagan dying demigod savior who will doom us to hell (the ultimate negativity)!

Christians, you do the math!
 
The devil isn't simply a symbol of our, or the universe's, dualistic nature. It supposes that the universe is divided against itself, and that one force will eventually win. This myth tends to make people divided aginst themselves, that's why Christians are so pathological. It's an inherently intolerable situation.
 
duendy said:
what does the 'Devil' MEAN for both religionists and athiests?

i don't just mean his mythical status, but WHY a creation like the Devil should have arisen in Christianity at all.

and also taking into account the war on terrorism, where the 'Enemy' is....? is that stretgy connected with the earlier creation of the N.T 'enemy', the Devil? what do you think
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The Devil was originally an angel of God, that rebelled against God and His laws, and started doing evil, disobeying God's laws. Many angels followed Satan in this rebellion. Satan and his followers were cast down from their status as angels of God, and became fallen angels or devils. They forsook God's ways, so Satan and hid devils are totally evil.
In the bible, the angels of God have physical bodies and seem to be capable of also moving in another dimension and disappearing. Satan and his devils never have physical bodies in the bible, which could indicate that they were killed, and lost their physical bodies when they became fallen angels. Satan and his devils are now, disembodied spirits, that float around in the air, in a spiritual dimension. They have telepathic contact to the minds of men, and tempt men in their minds to disobey God or disbelieve God, and to do evil.
God is using Satan and his devils to test men to see if they will choose to do good or evil.
God's will now is to obey and believe the New Testament of the bible; the King James version is the most accurate. The devils, being totally evil are going to telepathically try to make men disbelieve the New Testament or disobey the New Testament, so that men will be destroyed in the fires of hell along with them. The devils know that they are condemned to eternal fire and they are going to try to get as many men to go into the fire with them as they can. [Some of the thoughts that come into men's minds, are being put into men's minds by devils.]
Since most of God's commandments deal with doing unto others as you would have them do to you, and loving God, the devils are going to try to make men disobey that. The devils will use men to hurt and kill one another and lie and steal from one another.
The only power that Satan and his devils have is what God allows them to have. God is allowing the devils to test men, to see if they will do good or evil. The men that are doing good and obeying God now are the real born again Christians that follow the teachings in the New Testament. Those are the men that will be allowed to become angels of God in the next life. The people that don't become Christians, will burn in everlasting fire with the Devil and his fallen angels, the devils. So, the only ones allowed in heaven in the future are going to be tested and proven faithful on the Earth, the real Christians. This will help ensure that there will be no more rebellions in heaven.

Scriptures that show that God is using Satan to test men:

Revelation 20:7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,
Revelation 20:8 And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom [is] as the sand of the sea.

Also, Job 1:8 - 1:11, and Job 2:3 - Job 2:7, show that God is using Satan to test men to see if they will do good or evil.
 
itopal said:
Utter B.S.


The existence of morals: if the numbers were used as proof(!); the conclusion would be God has no effect, and thus no morals handed down; apparently the mosquito squashing scenario (man being the entity within the hand, and thusly crushed) is the rule and not the exception.


Your conclusion is incorrect. God does exist and so do absolutes of right (obeying God) and wrong (disobeying God). God's rules for conduct are now in the King James version New Testament.
The reasons for the terrible destructions that have visited men are simple.
MOST OF THE PEOPLE OF EVERY GENERATION ARE LIVING IN DISOBEDIENCE TO GOD. So, God punishes them, either by His own hand, or by the hand of His angels, or by allowing men that are controlled by the devils to do the punishment. Those destructions of people that you posted are good proof that a God that punishes evil men, does exist, like the Bible describes Him to exist.

Matthew 7:13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide [is] the gate, and broad [is] the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:
Matthew 7:14 Because strait [is] the gate, and narrow [is] the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.

According to the Words of Jesus, many are living in disobedience to God, which leads to destruction, and few find the path of obedience to God which leads to life. So, if God does exist, there should be large numbers of people perishing as punishment for their sins. Your post tends to prove the existence of God.

Luke 13:1 There were present at that season some that told him of the Galilaeans, whose blood Pilate had mingled with their sacrifices.
Luke 13:2 And Jesus answering said unto them, Suppose ye that these Galilaeans were sinners above all the Galilaeans, because they suffered such things?
Luke 13:3 I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish.
Luke 13:4 Or those eighteen, upon whom the tower in Siloam fell, and slew them, think ye that they were sinners above all men that dwelt in Jerusalem?
Luke 13:5 I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish.

Your understanding of God seems to be incorrect causing you to develope false conclusions. Read the Old and New Testament and see how God punishes evil men, and sometimes many of them at one time.

[One further note: If you don't repent of sin and get right with God, He will punish you too - in due season.]
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Ghost, you are an out and out literalist, however, at LEAST you are the only religionists -as far as i know-that has come to this thread, so i give you that

you have deeellllved into Devil's county. From here there Is no turning back (mad howls of utter devil howling echoing))))))))

Actually the Devil is soley a Christian concept which came into promience -in the church int Middle Ages
it's function is to frighten people such as yourselves from devling tooo DEEEEEPLY, and thus keeping you indoctrinated in your faith. it acts like a scarecrow. an 'Enemy'. for when the people fear an ....'Enemy' thay look to THAt and fail to see the puppet-master pullin their strings! this works both in patriarchal religion ANd State
For example in State it is 'the Terrorist' currently who is 'The Enemy'...the 'Evil one'

ok then. what the Christians did was demonize the pagan Horned God. This Horned God goes way way back into our species' history and was connected with Goddess. he was son/love of Goddess

He represents our depth, and wildeness and instinct and eroticism. all that the Christian church - unprecedentedly-demonizes

there is in a way no way out (though there always is if you are open to it) for the Christian once hooked dogmatically. cause if anyone tries to reason with them, they inevitably become the very devil they fear. the 'prince of lies' bla bla

so yo have made yourself a might cage dude
 
duendy said:
Ghost, you are an out and out literalist, however, at LEAST you are the only religionists -as far as i know-that has come to this thread, so i give you that

you have deeellllved into Devil's county. From here there Is no turning back (mad howls of utter devil howling echoing))))))))

Actually the Devil is soley a Christian concept which came into promience -in the church int Middle Ages

The Devil is in the Old Testament written long before the middle ages.

Satan and his devils are real and they have telepathic contact to the minds of men. Evil men can be controlled by them like puppets on a string, which is why there is so much evil in the world.

One of the Devil's biggest deceptions is to make people believe that he don't exist.

He sure seems to have you deceived.
Click to expand...
 
ghost7584 said:
Satan and his devils are real and they have telepathic contact to the minds of men. Evil men can be controlled by them like puppets on a string, which is why there is so much evil in the world.
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if that was true than God wouldnt be Allmighty nor All good as He couldnt or wouldnt control this devil dude!
anyway
how would you explain natural evils such as tornadoes,floods,volcanic eruptions,droughts etc ,,so called Acts of God in which many innocent people and children die needlesly?
 
ghost7584 said:
duendy said:
Ghost, you are an out and out literalist, however, at LEAST you are the only religionists -as far as i know-that has come to this thread, so i give you that

you have deeellllved into Devil's county. From here there Is no turning back (mad howls of utter devil howling echoing))))))))

Actually the Devil is soley a Christian concept which came into promience -in the church int Middle Ages

The Devil is in the Old Testament written long before the middle ages.

d__NO. the 'Devil' is a wholly Chrstian creation. where he becomes the adversary of 'God' and man. in the O.T 'satan' doesn't appear until after Genesis (The Serpent represents the oppressed GODDESS, not Satan)......."G.R. Taylor has\ pointed out that a truly siniste and malgnant image of the Devil does not appear in Christian imagery until early in the fourteenth century. Prior to that the Devil is, in popular representatopn, somewhat of a buffoon, and, in theology, "A pure spirit, dangerous and tempting but not a direct enemy of man". (The Two Hand of God: The Myths of Polarity, Alan Watts)

Satan and his devils are real and they have telepathic contact to the minds of men. Evil men can be controlled by them like puppets on a string, which is why there is so much evil in the world.

d))))That is just the excuse they make so as to disown their ACTUAL behaviour. Blame it on a scapegoat, their 'Devil'

One of the Devil's biggest deceptions is to make people believe that he don't exist.

d)))this is your double bind not mine. a way out of it, i suggest to you, is to begin being bold and exploring, doing research about the history of the 'Devil' in history. use your reason and intuition

He sure seems to have you deceived.
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Your the one decived babe. you belief blocks you off from exploring your deeper self which the pATRIARCHY HAS demonIZED!
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ghost7584 said:
God does exist and so do absolutes of right (obeying God) and wrong (disobeying God).
Click to expand...
LIKE THESE!
The reasons for the terrible destructions that have visited men are simple.
MOST OF THE PEOPLE OF EVERY GENERATION ARE LIVING IN DISOBEDIENCE TO GOD.
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nice try, but no cigar, people die b/c thats how nature works,
and following gods blindly leads to shit like 9/11, Crusades, Inquisition witch burnings,gay bashing,killing abortion providing doctors, voting a brain dead morron for prez etc.etc....religion preaches hate all those who believe differently..

no one could posibly follow/obey all rules of Xian God,well not if you want to live in modern society,...your bibles rules are obsolete
www.evilbible.com/
According to the Words of Jesus, many are living in disobedience to God, which leads to destruction, and few find the path of obedience to God which leads to life.
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your god/jesus was pretty heavy into the destruction himself it seems

"Do not think that I have come to bring peace on earth; I have not come to bring peace, but a sword. For I have come to set a man against his father, and a daughter against her mother, and a daughter-in-law against her mother- in-law...."
..........Matthew 10:34

"Do you think I have to come to give peace on earth? No, I tell you, but rather division; for henceforth in one house there will be five divided, three against two and two against three; they will be divided, father against son and son against father, mother against daughter and daughter against her mother, mother- in-law against her daughter-in-law and daughter-in-law against her mother-in- law.
..........Luke 12:51
"'But as for these enemies of mine, who did not want me to reign over them, bring them here and slay them before me.'"
..........Luke 19:27 (parable)

"If any one comes to me and does not hate his own father and mother and wife and children and brothers and sisters, yes, and even his own life, he cannot be my disciple."
..........Luke 14:26
So, if God does exist, there should be large numbers of people perishing as punishment for their sins. Your post tends to prove the existence of God.
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or its just natures way...;) whatever lives dies eventualy,
no gods needed
[One further note: If you don't repent of sin and get right with God, He will punish you too - in due season.]
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kinda like HANK eh?
 
scorpius said:
if that was true than God wouldnt be Allmighty nor All good as He couldnt or wouldnt control this devil dude!
anyway
how would you explain natural evils such as tornadoes,floods,volcanic eruptions,droughts etc ,,so called Acts of God in which many innocent people and children die needlesly?
Click to expand...

God is controling the Devil. The Devil can only do what God allows him to do. God is using the Devil to test men to see if they will choose to do good or evil. That is to determine who becomes a future angel in heaven and who will go to hell. The Devil is totally evil, and if God allows him to do anything at all the Devil will do evil.
Scriptures at the beginning of Job shows that God is allowing Satan to test men. Also scriptures in Revelation about the Devil being let loose after the 1000 year reign of Christ, show that God is using the Devil to test men.

Children that die below the age of reason, go to heaven. Children above the age of reason have committed at least one sin and are not innocent anymore, they need to believe in Jesus to be forgiven. Many of those natural disasters are punishment for sin. God will curse the work of a sinners hands, and children are part of the work of the sinners hands.
Most of the world in every generation is living in disobedience to God and subject to being punished.

Matthew 7:13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide [is] the gate, and broad [is] the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:
Matthew 7:14 Because strait [is] the gate, and narrow [is] the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.

Only the really saved Christians, that believe in Jesus as their Lord and Saviour and have repented of practicing sin, are living in obedience to God now, in these New Testament times. They are few compared to the whole population.
Real Christians are the ones trying to follow the New Testament. [The King James version is the most accurate.]
 
you are getting 'Satan' of the O.T. and the 'Devil' of the N.T. mixed up. i've explained alrady but you dont listen

but listen. Satan in the patriarchal Hebrew myth is an appropriation of a much more ancinet god, the Horned God who was connected with a Great Goddess (this mtif is worldwide in different forms)......the Horned God wasn't 'evil' but represented wild Nature, and instinctual nature. this was an inner psychological process to be explored, not a literalist mythology to divide
This is where you fundys go wrong. in your ignore-ance of the meaning of myth, you project what you dont understand onto the world and others--not part of your club (even children), and demonize all of them if they dont cowtow to your absurd interpretations. you may seem relatively harmless ranting away in this thread, but as we've seen in Christinaty's bloody histroy, give you power and you are extremely oppressive againsy ANY form of dissent

but what you should know is that the Devil you fear is your own Depths. These depthas were explored in ancinet earth religious spirituality whereby actual direct experience came from eating and drinking inspirational plants

not understanding all that you are presently lost in a superfical pile of dead old words that spread divisiveness, not just between 'you' and the 'other' you create, but also between you and the part of you you fear
 
.....and look ghost. you got:
'good'~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~'bad'''prepatriarchal peoples KNEW that that was a continuum. a dynamic movement. for example, look at Nature. ever seen a lion attack and kill another animal? would you call that bad? i am guessing you would, and so your myth pretends that one day that aint gonna happen right. that the lion will lie down with the lamb. heh that's even beyond the goodywoodyness of Walt disney isn't it?

but that Lion with his evolved fangs for the kill and eating meat is marverous Nature in its diversity. Nature which eats itself to live, like a living organism. for example, your cells from your body. they are constantly falling off--look at the DUSt in your house--and guess what, microscopic tenchology now can show us these incredibbly tiny creatures that feast on our dead cells. that too is part of this amazing organism that is alive and self-regulating itself....the bird eats the worm, the worm eats deacying matter...and son on and so on. all this wondreous event agoing on

then the back&white patriarchal myth tries to understand this and cant. why? cause it has split up a 'good' and 'bad' and confuses his abstract thinking with reality.....are you gettin it yet ghost?
from there he paints all he doesn't understand....preadtory animals etc, decay, death, etc as 'bad' and dreams of 'only-good'....but only-good would be a fukin nightmare. imagine if there weren't these tiny creatures eating your dead cells. you'd be up to your ears in dead cells. its be horrendous. or if one animal didn't prey on another ther'd be imbalance

us humans have caused the imbalance we have precisly cause patriarchy demands e mutiply, giving no thought for everything else. and thers the clinging to life too

just some thoughts for now
 
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