The Bible

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Roman

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Has anyone here read the bible (or large parts of it)?
If so, what were you reading it for? How did you approach the reading (ie, as a Christian, atheist, historian, scholar, etc)? What did you think of it?

I bought the New Revised Standard Version for a class about the history of ancient Israel. We're studying the history of the Israelites through readings of the Old Testament (as well as reading some old Caananite & Sumerian texts). Even as an atheist, I can say it's really quite a wonderful collection of stories. I especially enjoyed the part where Abraham gave away his 80 or 90 year old wife to the local warlord, because he wanted to sleep with her, and Abraham wanted more sheep.

Truly, the father of the Abrahamic faiths is a paragorn of virtue.

Seriously, how can anyone with any ability to read critically interpret the god of the Old Testament as all powerful, all knowing, and good and just? The damn thing is so full of anachronism and contradiciton, it must take a very dedicated (and braindead) mind to read such interpretations as literal truth AND claim that god is omni-everything.

Hell, there isn't even that claim made in the Old Testament, that God is all powerful. Very powerful, yes, but the LORD has to bargain (!) with Abram, a mere mortal!
 
It's amazing what's actually in there. I have read some of it, but not completely. It appears to be a diverse collection of ancient texts, but hardly the kind of thing you would expect a God to dictate as an instruction manual for life.
 
It does have some really amazing stories. I think I was reading one the other day where I think God and a donkey had an argument, but I may have got that one muddled up.

I was brought up a Roman Catholic, went to sunday school and freeken caticism. My mom became one of those born agains, and when I met her friends I decided Gods fan club was a bunch of freaks.

I then went looking for the real God.

In the mean time, here is a very good website about the bible and its stories.

http://skepticsannotatedbible.com/highlights.html

You should read their version of the bible :p
 
The Bible is an incredibly vague book, written in incredibly vague language, which can be interpreted in an infinite amount of ways. Hence, the millions of biblical sects out there (Catholic, Protestant, Judaism, Sunni, Shiite, etc.)
 
Ah yes, I forget who has the argument with the ass. It might be Joseph.
That's a good site for searching for stuff that gives theists pause, but I find most of their interpretations require almost as much stretching as the theistic ones.
 
spidergoat said:
It's amazing what's actually in there. I have read some of it, but not completely. It appears to be a diverse collection of ancient texts, but hardly the kind of thing you would expect a God to dictate as an instruction manual for life.
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Which it is. The Torah, or Old Testament, was put together in 800 BC by a bunch of Israelite priests as part of a national identity campaign, sponsered by Isaiah, I think.
 
w1z4rd said:
It does have some really amazing stories. I think I was reading one the other day where I think God and a donkey had an argument, but I may have got that one muddled up.

I was brought up a Roman Catholic, went to sunday school and freeken caticism. My mom became one of those born agains, and when I met her friends I decided Gods fan club was a bunch of freaks.

I then went looking for the real God.

In the mean time, here is a very good website about the bible and its stories.

http://skepticsannotatedbible.com/highlights.html

You should read their version of the bible :p
Click to expand...

That was the prophet Balaam and his donkey. The donkey saved Balaam from being killed by an angel of God when it refused to walk past the angel. Balaam could not see the angel and thinking that the donkey was just being stubborn he started to beat the donkey. The donkey then was given the power to speak and it complained about being beaten. Well the donkey and Balaam had a short argument then Balaam was given the power to see the angel.

It is a great story one that made me smile and laugh. :D


All Praise The Ancient Of Days
 
Roman said:
Has anyone here read the bible (or large parts of it)?
If so, what were you reading it for? How did you approach the reading (ie, as a Christian, atheist, historian, scholar, etc)? What did you think of it?

I bought the New Revised Standard Version for a class about the history of ancient Israel. We're studying the history of the Israelites through readings of the Old Testament (as well as reading some old Caananite & Sumerian texts). Even as an atheist, I can say it's really quite a wonderful collection of stories. I especially enjoyed the part where Abraham gave away his 80 or 90 year old wife to the local warlord, because he wanted to sleep with her, and Abraham wanted more sheep.

Truly, the father of the Abrahamic faiths is a paragorn of virtue.
Click to expand...

Abraham was not God. He was a human being and like all human beings he was faulty. God never approved of the thing done by Abraham and saw to it that the warlord did not have sex with Sarah. In the end Sarah was restored to Abraham and the warlord was not harmed.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days
 
If there is no J in hebrew, aramaic and ancient greek, where do the words Jesus and Joseph come from?

Deaths in the Bible:
God - 2,270,365 (not including the victims of Noah's flood, Sodom and Gomorrah, or the many plagues, famines, fiery serpents, etc because no specific numbers were given)

Satan - 10
 
Roman said:
Seriously, how can anyone with any ability to read critically interpret the god of the Old Testament as all powerful, all knowing, and good and just? The damn thing is so full of anachronism and contradiciton, it must take a very dedicated (and braindead) mind to read such interpretations as literal truth AND claim that god is omni-everything.
Click to expand...

Then I would suggest that you quit reading it. When a book no longer interests you, I don't see why you continue to read it.

I read "Revenge of the Swamp Monster from the Black Lagoon" and didn't really like all of it, but it was fun to read. But I didn't come here and make a post just to criticize others who might have enjoyed the book.

Baron Max
 
Emo Philips When I was a kid I used to pray every night for a new bicycle. Then I realised that the Lord doesn't work that way so I stole one and asked Him to forgive me.

Annie Dillard, 'Pilgrim at Tinker Creek' Eskimo: "If I did not know about God and sin, would I go to hell?" Priest: "No, not if you did not know." Eskimo: "Then why did you tell me?"
 
w1z4rd said:
If there is no J in hebrew, aramaic and ancient greek, where do the words Jesus and Joseph come from?
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*************
M*W: Jesus = Ieous (sp) Greek
Joseph = Cheops Egyptian

Deaths in the Bible:
God - 2,270,365 (not including the victims of Noah's flood, Sodom and Gomorrah, or the many plagues, famines, fiery serpents, etc because no specific numbers were given)

Satan - 10
Click to expand...

*************
M*W: Interesting numbers, but nobody died, so the numbers are invalid.
 
there are many new versions of the bible...

Be warned... some are from the mormons... some from sects of christianity.

they make fundamental changes off of the old king james version.

i dont trust any of them.

they should mearly put notes in a side bar... not re-write it, and not give you specifics about where they changed it.

-MT
 
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As Mosheh Thezion knows, god spoke Elizabethan English.
there are many new versions of the bible...

ne warned... some are from the mormons... some from sects ofs christianity.

they make fundamental changes off of the old king james version.

i dont trust any of them.

they should mearly put notes in a side bar... not re-write it, and not give you specifics about where they changed it.
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Any modern attempt to change one word of the King James version of the holy bible is blasphemous. Jews who read the Torah in Hebrew are pagans. When medieval Catholic priests used a Latin bible, they were heretics. Christianity, the only true religion, started when the King James version was first published.
 
NO.. but to change it... and not make it clear where the chnage is... and why you did it... is in my opinion criminal.

for if such is allowable... i could re-write it in many ways.

imagine the madness wHICH will follow over the years as people take to reading all kinds of wacked out biased bibles.???

they all stem from the king james... and they should use that as a base, and add notes... only.

in this way.. they can still write it... but showing clearly what was changed and why.

the ..... what and ......why... are really important.

-MT
 
I read "Revenge of the Swamp Monster from the Black Lagoon" and didn't really like all of it, but it was fun to read. But I didn't come here and make a post just to criticize others who might have enjoyed the book.
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Such a shame. Perhaps you should join a book club and then you can openly debate whether that book was any good or not. You wouldn't come here certainly, but I fail to see why you think someone shouldn't make posts or debates concerning things they have read.

Abraham was not God. He was a human being and like all human beings he was faulty. God never approved of the thing done by Abraham and saw to it that the warlord did not have sex with Sarah. In the end Sarah was restored to Abraham and the warlord was not harmed.
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A) Abraham told his wife to lie purely so his life would be saved. The pharoah then took her and god inflicted severe plagues on all of pharoahs household because of Abrahams lies. Pharoah got understandably angry and kicked Abraham and his wife out. (gen 12:10)

B) Abraham then lies again, this time to Abimelech. Then god comes to Abimelech in a dream and threatens him. Abimelech responds that he is innocent and god's like "ahh, yeah uhh" and lets him off... Eventually god heals all the innocent women whos wombs he closed because of Abrahams lies. Further than that Abimelech is also nice enough to give them money and livestock even though he did no wrong, they did. (gen 20)
 
Mosheh Thezion: Are you unaware of the basis for the King James & modern versions?

The King James version was first published in about 1611 and was based on translations of documents from much earlier hand written documents. The more modern versions of the bible are considered to be more accurate because we have reason to believe that modern scholars are more knowledgeable than the scholars of the early 17th century.

The modern versions are not changes to the King james version just for purposes of modernizing the English. They are based on modern translations of ancient documents, including some used by the authors of the King James version. Some documents ignored or not available to the authors of the King James version were studied and used by the modern translators.

What makes you so gung ho for the King James version? Do you think that god spoke Elizabethan English?

There are several reasons to consider a modern translation to be superior.
  • Modern scholars are more knowledgeable of the ancient languages used in the source documents, and have more ancient documents available to them than the English scholars of the 17th century.

  • Modern English is a richer language than Elizabethan English, allowing modern scholars to express subtle concepts in a more easily understood manner.

  • Unless you are an expert in Elizabethan English, you are likely to better understand a modern translation into modern English.
There are known errors in the King James version. The only exmple I know of is from the Exodus story. The original Hebrew referred to crossing the Sea of Reeds, not the Red Sea. I have often wondered how this error was introduced.
 
I remember when I was little I read Genesis, and I always pictured God as Abraham's personal body guard. Anyway, what's so wrong about trading your 90 year old wife for some sheep?
 
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