the basics of Islamic Visioning

C

cleese

Registered Senior Member
dear respectful thinker :
if it is an axiom that thought is only sharpened and revised by thought, it is also an axiom that the wider your comparison between different thoughts is, the deeper and closer to the truth you are .
why Koran seems strange and difficult to discern to many people ?
why in the same time some thinkers claim the opposite about the same book?
is the quranic look to the Human being is inferior ? where it lies compared to other dogmas ?
many questions are answered in multiple parts essay, about the pillars of islamic visioning, and how they differ from the other religion's . here :
http://www.mediafire.com/?jttav4wrv2kf4af
thanks for your time , and wishing for your feedback .
 
I think that thought brings us farther away from truth. Stop thinking and ease your mind.
 
What's "visioning"?

And do I need to make an appointment with my ophthalmologist to know?:D

And during my appointment, will the doctor cover one of my eyes and have me read from a chart of Arabic letters...?:bugeye:
 
spidergoat said:
How do you know those thoughts are your own?
Click to expand...

I think (pun intended), that of the nearly 7 billion people on Earth today, the breakdown goes this way:

The thoughts of 25% are their own.

The thoughts of 29% are not their own, but rather belong to another 29% of the people on Earth.

Then, the thoughts of 15% of people are actually blue gelatin.;)

Meanwhile, the thoughts of 1% of people on Earth are actually the recycled run-off of a special fuel used by aliens from the planet Kroxxar of the SZDY4a.1378uP galaxy.:itold:
 
spidergoat said:
I think that thought brings us farther away from truth. Stop thinking and ease your mind.
Click to expand...
Sounds like the basic rule of religion. Stop thinking: you may decide that this is all bullshit and we can't let that happen.

Our uniquely massive forebrain is what distinguishes us from all other animals. We have the ability to even question and override our instincts. To "stop thinking" is to lower ourselves to the level of a worm.

Sorry, I'm not going to do that! My ancestors didn't spend millions of years evolving this wonderful brain, just so I can turn it off and act like a Christian.
 
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mr fraggle

why some people insist to apply what concerns faked religions including Judaism and Christianity to islam ?
and why some people insist to show their ignorance ?
strange that in a forum that is all about comparative religions, a person enters a post, showing that he knows nothing , and talks about what he doesnt know,
you have not even read the post. why should you open your mouth or write one word about it ?
either you do something useful , or just hide your ignorance
 
cleese,

Please explain Sura 9, Aya 28 of the Koran (or "Qur'an" for the politically correct multi-culturalist dhimmi) to me.

Thanking you in advance,
Hesperado
 
simple explanation of verse 28 of chatper 9

sir
this verse tells that Paganists are no more allowed to pray inside the mosque in Mecca. and tells muslims that muslims should not be afraid of the economic consequences that might result in that procedure.
you may study the noblest laws of war ever existed, that are represented in the islamic laws of war here in my other post .
http://www.sciforums.com/showthread.php?t=103617
in that post, you would find insights about the meaning of fasting the islamic way, and you will also see how the discussions there hacked their way towards wars in islam and their laws.
dont rely on media. you have a diamond in your head. it is enough to tell you truth.
thanks
 
cleese said:
sir
this verse tells that Paganists are no more allowed to pray inside the mosque in Mecca. and tells muslims that muslims should not be afraid of the economic consequences that might result in that procedure.
you may study the noblest laws of war ever existed, that are represented in the islamic laws of war here in my other post .
http://www.sciforums.com/showthread.php?t=103617
in that post, you would find insights about the meaning of fasting the islamic way, and you will also see how the discussions there hacked their way towards wars in islam and their laws.
dont rely on media. you have a diamond in your head. it is enough to tell you truth.
thanks
Click to expand...

Thanks. The verse also says that "Paganists" (al-Mushrikun) are "filthy" (najasun).

Two follow-up questions please:

1) What groups are included among al-Mushrikun ?

2) Why are al-Mushrikun filthy?
 
answers

first , you must understand that Quran was revealed in Arabic. so every translator is responsible for his own translation . filthy means dirty, and this is not exactly what the verse indicated, it indicated the spiritual and psychological deformation that does not permit them any more to get in the mosque and pray to their idols or statues .
Mushrikin, mean people who recognized the respectful creator of the universe, but accompanied him with less powerful Gods. "co-Gods" .
but , may i have my own question ?
have you read the essay about the meaning of fasting the islamic way yet?
 
cleese said:
first , you must understand that Quran was revealed in Arabic. so every translator is responsible for his own translation . filthy means dirty, and this is not exactly what the verse indicated, it indicated the spiritual and psychological deformation...
Click to expand...

Just on this point for now (I will get to the rest later).

The following website, with citations from the sihah ahadith, reports that among things that are najasun (plural of najis, translated variously as "impure" or "filthy") are the following:

dirt
human urine and feces
other liquids that come out of private parts (presumably including sperm)
excrement from animals
menstrual blood
dog saliva
dead animals
donkey's flesh
the foul smell that accrues on a long hem of a woman's abaya over time from contact with the dirt
the urine from a breast-fed baby

And these are not merely "dirty" things for physical hygiene -- they directly relate to a Muslim's "purity" during prayer.

Among the list above, for example, we see "menstrual blood" -- and that is why we see these Muslim teenage girls not only segregated from Muslim boys (as is customary in general) but also segregated from the other girls during prayer -- because they happen to be in the process of menstruation. And these prayers religious in nature and offensive to Western liberal tolerance of women in general and particularly during menstruation are occurring in a Toronto school funded by taxpayers.

For, after all, according to Sahih Bukhari (the most authoritative collector of ahadith, or "sayings", of Mohammed):

[Mohammed said:] ...Isn't it true that a woman can neither pray nor fast during her menses?" The women replied in the affirmative. He said, "This is the deficiency in her religion." - Sahih Bukhari 1.6.301

Then we have good old Ayatollah al-Sistani, a much respected Islamic scholar and cleric of Iran/Iraq who, on his official website, lists things that are najis:

"The following ten things are essentially najis [unclean]:

1. Urine
2. Faeces
3. Semen
4. Dead body
5. Blood
6. Dog
7. Pig
8. Kafir [unbeliever -- i.e., non-Muslims]
9. Alcoholic liquors
10. The sweat of an animal who persistently eats najasat [unclean things]."

So, in summary, it seems your attempt at making a distinction between "dirty" and "spiritually impure" is a distinction that is irrelevant in the Sunna (Islamic culture and law).
 
cleese,

In case I wasn't clear in my last post, I don't want to proceed in a discussion or debate by addressing multiple points. I rather like to proceed step by step -- one point at a time.

Thus, if you would please respond to my last post, then (if your answer satisfies the implicit question of my last post) I will proceed to other points you raised in your last post. If your answer does not satisfy it, I may have to re-phrase.
 
Form and Practice

Hesperado said:

The following website, with citations from the sihah ahadith, reports that among things that are najasun (plural of najis, translated variously as "impure" or "filthy") are the following ....
Click to expand...

What, aside from apostasy in the modern West, separates that list from the Bible? I mean, really. Pigs instead of donkeys, if we want to be exceptionally specific.

But aside from the fact that many Muslims still abide by their traditional rules and the fact that many Jews and Christians don't, it is hard to figure what point you're trying to make.
 
He appears to be discussing the absence of a clear firewall between physical 'filthiness' and spiritual 'filthiness' in Islam. The point you're trying to make is unrelated equivocation.
 
Hesperado
Again , every website, and every party is responsible for his own translation. i am saying this because i have been working as a translator for 8 years and understand the dilemmas of translation well.
filthy here means the spiritual deformation .
i hope after all that you are not chasing a virtual point that doesnt exist except inside your mind .
any way , have you read the original post , have you downloaded the article ?
 
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