Some words of wisdom.

V

Victor E

Registered Senior Member
If god created the world,
Then who created god?

If god has always existed,
Has the universe always existed as well?

If gods power is unlimited,
Is the universe unlimited as well?

If the universe is unlimited,
Does god exist within it?

If god exists within it,
Is he then a part of the universe?

If god is a part of the universe,
Is he then a part of the creation?

If god is a part of the creation,
Can he be the creator?


I know what I would answer on each of these questions, I'll be glad to see wheter you agree with me or not.
 
these questions have come up countless times before. theist will say something to the effect of "god does not need to be logical, so god can create himself and the universe/"
 
Victor E said:
If god created the world,
Then who created god?.
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God is uncreated, the foundation of all BEING
Victor E said:
If god has always existed,
Has the universe always existed as well?
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No, the universe has not always existed, it had a beginning andwill have an end.
Victor E said:
If gods power is unlimited,
Is the universe unlimited as well?
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The power of God is infinite, but He will not go against His own purpose, in that way it could be called willfully limited .
Victor E said:
If the universe is unlimited,
Does god exist within it?
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God exists beyond the universe, in a category beyond space-time continuum. He also permeates all Being, so He is within the universe as well, as a matter of speaking.
Victor E said:
If god exists within it,
Is he then a part of the universe?
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God participates in the Universe. Expresses himself through the Universe. He is not subordinated to the Universe, or Nature.
Victor E said:
If god is a part of the universe,
Is he then a part of the creation?
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Already answered above
Victor E said:
If god is a part of the creation,
Can he be the creator??
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A creator cannot also be part of the creation in the same way as the Prime-creator. God is uncreated. Were He created he could not be the Creator of All things. God alone is the one necessary being, all other beings, technically are unnecessary
 
cato said:
these questions have come up countless times before. theist will say something to the effect of "god does not need to be logical, so god can create himself and the universe/"
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You truly love strawmen, don't you?
 
Victor E said:
If god created the world,
Then who created god?
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No one (or nothing - which is God). God is the self within us. It has never been created. Or do you really remember your birth, or will you ever see your death? No, so you have always existed.

Creation is not something that happens once, sometime in the "past", but it happens at each moment, forever. Time can't start somewhere in "time" (past), neither can the universe.

If god has always existed,
Has the universe always existed as well?
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Yes, and yes to all the rest
 
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Its totally irresponsible and incorrect to say that an individual human soul has always existed. Souls are created by God at the moment of conception.
 
Lapdog: Its totally irresponsible and incorrect to say that an individual human soul has always existed. Souls are created by God at the moment of conception.
*************
M*W: Prove it.
 
No Lawdog is in error. No it's Yorda!

Lawdog!

Yorda!

You're going to HELL!

No, YOU"RE going to HELL!

...
 
Your missing the point. Youre saying "This is how it is". But then, tell me why instead. Give me some evidence ffs!

Most of you are just talking shit, think before answering.
 
superluminal said:
Besides, I thought souls came from the gup? They already exist in a giant storage bin somewhere, right?

http://www2.ida.net/graphics/shirtail/doctrine.htm
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No superluminal, no. You need to focus on Catholic Doctrine, which is supported by Reason and Tradition.

Why do you think the Catholic Church has survived so long and created the greatest minds and heroes on Earth? St. Augustine, Constantine, Charlemagne, Pope Leo, Pope Gregory the Great, Isidorus, Aquinas, Galileo, Barbarrossa, Joan of Arc, St. Patrick, Copernicus, Cortez, Pascal, Tolkien, and many others.

Avoid other cults, like Mormonism. They will confuse you.

Here is what is known: God has foreknowledge of your existance from before the beginning of Time. At the time of your conception He brings His plans into existance, creates your soul. He makes it indestructrable, immortal.
 
Lawdog said:
No superluminal, no. You need to focus on Catholic Doctrine, which is supported by Reason and Tradition.
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the catholic church and reason, this must be an oxymoron.
Lawdog said:
God has foreknowledge of your existance from before the beginning of Time. At the time of your conception He brings His plans into existance, creates your soul. He makes it indestructrable, immortal.
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why do you people constantly say things like this, cant you understand we, dont have any belief in your god, so whatever you say to us is irrelevent.
 
Lawdog said:
Its totally irresponsible and incorrect to say that an individual human soul has always existed. Souls are created by God at the moment of conception.
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I don't think an individual soul always exists. I think a person dies when the body dies. But the self ("observer") which is within all of us, can never die. It is in all of us. And this self is the thing which religions call God. I'm not talking about a "personal" self, which is but a reflection of the body (an illusion) God, our real self, is impersonal.

Victor E said:
But then, tell me why instead.
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It feels weird to explain things which are self-evident to me. You can ask if you don't understand something.
 
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Lawdog:

No superluminal, no. You need to focus on Catholic Doctrine, which is supported by Reason and Tradition.

Why do you think the Catholic Church has survived so long and created the greatest minds and heroes on Earth? St. Augustine, Constantine, Charlemagne, Pope Leo, Pope Gregory the Great, Isidorus, Aquinas, Galileo, Barbarrossa, Joan of Arc, St. Patrick, Copernicus, Cortez, Pascal, Tolkien, and many others.

Avoid other cults, like Mormonism. They will confuse you.

Here is what is known: God has foreknowledge of your existance from before the beginning of Time. At the time of your conception He brings His plans into existance, creates your soul. He makes it indestructrable, immortal.
Click to expand...

At what point does a rationalist stop arguing with a mad man?

A rationalist has a finite set of arguments and will present them a finite number of times, by simple definition - rationalism.

A mad man has an infinite number of arguments (since anything can serve as such) and will present them an infinite number of times also by simple definition - MAD man.

So, in order to continue my entertainment, I will now begin to implement tactical and strategic planned irrationalizsm in my arguments and we'll see who gets more frustrated.
 
God is simply an invention of man. Therefore, he can be anything to anyone at anytime. "Whatever turns you on", says it best.
 
superliminal,

just take some elses advice for once,
study Plato and Aristoltle, learn Catholic Doctrine.
then decide if its false or not.
 
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