So I was reading NewsScientist today

R

Roman

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Banned
There was an article I didn't really try to read about how time doesn't exist.

Time is a non-linear event, it doesn't "flow," because it is, set out like furniture.

If this turns out to be true, what would it mean for God? What would it mean for the bible?
 
Roman said:
There was an article I didn't really try to read about how time doesn't exist.

Time is a non-linear event, it doesn't "flow," because it is, set out like furniture.

If this turns out to be true, what would it mean for God? What would it mean for the bible?
Click to expand...

Time does exist otherwise we would live forever.

Dave
 
Depends on whose time you're talking about, because it's relative to whatever you attach it. In other words, you can only appreciate the furniture if you are in the room with it.
 
Why should this have any implications for God?

Various problems with free will are raised by the scenario, but they apply equally to God as to anything else in the universe.
 
Time is completely subjective. It only becomes a significant factor in your life if you allow it to become so. We have invented completely arbitrary units of measurement for time to help us cope with it, but that doesn't necessarily make it a valid measure of anything. Time is a man-made concept. Do with it what you will, but don't presume that anything else in the universe gives a shit...
 
wow that sounds pretty crazy, but not surprising. There have been a number of theories on the existence of time
I agree with 15ofthe19, and I would like to add that time is subjective AND relative - well everything is. The concept of time is only a representation and measurement of change.
 
time obviously IS.

it's just that it's not what you probably think it is.

my theory of time is based in my crude understanding of string theory.

string theory calls for a some number of spatial dimensions (11 I think, depending on your flavor of string theory). I think that if such is true, time is whatever binds all those dimensions together... whatever it is they share in common. So whatever that common part is, appears to us as we view it from a four dimensional (x,y,z, and imaginary time) perspective... as time.
 
wesmorris said:
time obviously IS.
Click to expand...

I agree. The universe is a sort of clock as far as my understanding goes in anyways.

In Time stars die, people die, people are born and stars are born.

Dave
 
wesmorris said:
time obviously IS.

it's just that it's not what you probably think it is.

my theory of time is based in my crude understanding of string theory.

string theory calls for a some number of spatial dimensions (11 I think, depending on your flavor of string theory). I think that if such is true, time is whatever binds all those dimensions together... whatever it is they share in common. So whatever that common part is, appears to us as we view it from a four dimensional (x,y,z, and imaginary time) perspective... as time.
Click to expand...

For another perspective, in 10-d string theory I recall that the 'time'
dimension facilitates every possible state of matter at once (think of it as a
plethora of cells in an huge 2-D array). We perceive (as individuals) a path in
this array; changes from one cell to another (where each cell changes at 186,000 mps). Funny thing is, this would mean that our conciousness 'splits'
into 'n' conciousnesses with ever cell transition as there are alot of states
of matter that need to be filled and you (as a single conciousness) only get
one of them. Now as I am thinking about this, if some of your side-by side
conciousnesses came to this understanding then they may all compete with
you for the best state of matter :), but thats just getting weird.
 
Time exists so that everything wouldn't happen at once.


Roman said:
Time is a non-linear event, it doesn't "flow," because it is, set out like furniture.
Click to expand...

I say that we

1. *Generate* time according to our perception and needs.

2. In language, the concept of time is strongly bound to the concept of space. Space is something that simply is there, it is set out; as such it serves as a metaphor for time. Examples:

I wrote my thesis *in* three weeks.
I work Monday *through* Saturday.
We have the *space* of three weeks.
*on* Monday
*in* the afternoon
...
Time and space are dealt with by the pretty much same principles.


If this turns out to be true, what would it mean for God? What would it mean for the bible?
Click to expand...

How could it ever turn out to be *true*?
If time is set out, then it already is true, if time is not set out, then it isn't true ... Ah, let's try and confuse ourselves with logic.
:bugeye:
 
An individuals perception of time will vary. What I think seemed like a long day may have been the quickest day in the world to another however the sun comes up and the sun goes down. If we divide the actual time it takes for that process to take place into a set number of equal parts we can say that the sun is in one of those divisions at any time and this is what forms our basis for 'recording' time.
How long someone 'feels' they live between any two markers is of course completely subjective but the sun up and down thing is not.
I have felt like i have lived many hours even days in what was just 3 minutes under the influence of certain chemicals.
 
Time is a "result" of the celestial bodies.. as the book of Genesis clearly details.

God is not confined to time since He made time; He is not old nor is He young. It wouldn't mean anything for the Bible because in the very FIRST book of the Bible, the issue has been settled.

Either way, eternity "exists" and therefore, time must "exist".
 
§outh§tar said:
Time is a "result" of the celestial bodies.. as the book of Genesis clearly details.

God is not confined to time since He made time; He is not old nor is He young. It wouldn't mean anything for the Bible because in the very FIRST book of the Bible, the issue has been settled.

Either way, eternity "exists" and therefore, time must "exist".
*************
M*W: There has been some study refuting Genesis as the first book of the OT. The sequence of the books in the bible were not written in that same sequence. The oldest book of the Bible is Job. The first five books of the bible, the Pentateuch, is attributed to Moses, but some biblical scholars say the story of Noah and the Flood takes place before Adam and Eve in the Garden of Eden.
Click to expand...
 
i would think that because we can make two objects occupy the same space, but at what seems like different instances, that time must exist.
 
c20,

I have felt like i have lived many hours even days in what was just 3 minutes under the influence of certain chemicals.
Click to expand...

I just hope those chemicals was love ... ;)
 
Time is the weirdest thing in the universe. I sometimes tend to think time is not linear also. It is concurrent but we are only sensing frames for some reason.

If time is not linear could it be circular? I have always hoped eternal recurrence was somehow true...
 
I always liked the 'flatlanders' explanation of n-dimensional space, which affects my perception of time as well... Just as we 3-dimensional creatures would be imperceptible to the senses of a hypothetical 2-dimensional creature, inhabitants of a (3+n) hyper-dimensional space are imperceptible to us. I haven't quite absorbed the string theory 'cells' that Crunchy Cat mentioned, although it seems to be conceptual extension of the flatlander concept.

But what if conciousness exists at hyperdimensional levels? It would be connected to our experiential universe just as surely as the perceptual dimensions of length width depth and time are. No doubt it would be weird beyond comprehension. Could it affect us? Would it be truly imperceptible and rationally unknowable? Would we be able to vaugely sense and interact with it? Would we call it God? Maybe it's having a bout of indigestion right now, and that's why everything is so messed up :)
 
I don't think time really exists...just think about it. It's just a concept, it doesn't physically exist, we can only supposedly see the effects of it. It's not a force, it doesn't measure anything physically like liters, cm, etc.....it's just like an illusion created because of our memory...it's completely subjective. I understand what the article means by saying that it doesn't flow, it's just there. People come up with all these theories to explain time, like how people come with all these theories to explain God, it might exist, but it just makes more sense to eliminate it. Everyone is just used to the concept of time, so they can't imagine it not existing.
 
Turduckin said:
I always liked the 'flatlanders' explanation of n-dimensional space, which affects my perception of time as well... Just as we 3-dimensional creatures would be imperceptible to the senses of a hypothetical 2-dimensional creature, inhabitants of a (3+n) hyper-dimensional space are imperceptible to us. I haven't quite absorbed the string theory 'cells' that Crunchy Cat mentioned, although it seems to be conceptual extension of the flatlander concept.

But what if conciousness exists at hyperdimensional levels? It would be connected to our experiential universe just as surely as the perceptual dimensions of length width depth and time are. No doubt it would be weird beyond comprehension. Could it affect us? Would it be truly imperceptible and rationally unknowable? Would we be able to vaugely sense and interact with it? Would we call it God? Maybe it's having a bout of indigestion right now, and that's why everything is so messed up :)
Click to expand...

:eek:

I don't think that's anywhere close to what Moses wrote down..
 
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