~The_Chosen~
Registered Senior Member
I second this statement.
Certain dumb Catholics turned me atheist for a while...
I second this statement.
Certain dumb Catholics turned me atheist for a while...
Yeah no problem, I understand. I believe we are in the same boat. I hate it when religions preach, or force their beliefs over others, assuming they are right. Just as a bad author that tries to preach in his/her book.
There is no need to wander around in the dark forest and to rely on faith to protect one from what can not be seen. Especially when the forest is dark because ones eyes are closed. Sure, there are lions, tigers and bears. But if your going to hire a bodygaurd, make sure their around when your eyes are open.
Hey Kat...
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Katazia wrote:
If I assume we both observe the same universe, how is it that I have never experienced anything that could be considered godlike, or rather have seen no need to seek the supernatural to explain something I didn’t understand, and can see no need for such a being, see no evidence of such a being, and see no grain of truth in any religion?
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Having never met you, and being devoid of psychic powers, how should I know?
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Katazia wrote:
And I would consider my life perfectly acceptable without such beliefs.
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Good for you!
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Katazia wrote:
It would seem that from your last statement you have a need for and a dependency on religion whereas I have no such needs.
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"It would seem"? No I'll tell you flat out. I NEED GOD! I AM dependant on GOD. There's no "seems" to it. Furthermore, I am not ashamed to admit it.
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Katazia wrote:
The universe contains many mysteries and we have barely begun to scratch the surface of such things.
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The universe is infinitely more complex than we can even imagine.
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Katazia wrote:
To then assert that it needed to be created and was created by the supernatural based on what can only be a rudimentary and cursory understanding, would seem extremely premature.
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Asserting that it didn't would also be premature.
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Katazia wrote:
I don’t see any way that you could possibly substantiate your assertions.
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Because I have based my beliefs on personal experiences throughout my life (both good and bad) where I have felt God's involvement. That which substantiates my beliefs would seem foolish to you. They are things such as answered prayer, positive feelings of contentment, lives changing for the better, etc.
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Katazia wrote:
You might be correct but you have no way to know that, I think you are simply guessing.
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It has to do with faith. Something which is completely anathema to non-believers.
But... that's not MY fault.
peace...
-Mike
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Katazia wrote:
If I assume we both observe the same universe, how is it that I have never experienced anything that could be considered godlike, or rather have seen no need to seek the supernatural to explain something I didn’t understand, and can see no need for such a being, see no evidence of such a being, and see no grain of truth in any religion?
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Having never met you, and being devoid of psychic powers, how should I know?
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Katazia wrote:
And I would consider my life perfectly acceptable without such beliefs.
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Good for you!
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Katazia wrote:
It would seem that from your last statement you have a need for and a dependency on religion whereas I have no such needs.
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"It would seem"? No I'll tell you flat out. I NEED GOD! I AM dependant on GOD. There's no "seems" to it. Furthermore, I am not ashamed to admit it.
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Katazia wrote:
The universe contains many mysteries and we have barely begun to scratch the surface of such things.
==============================================
The universe is infinitely more complex than we can even imagine.
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Katazia wrote:
To then assert that it needed to be created and was created by the supernatural based on what can only be a rudimentary and cursory understanding, would seem extremely premature.
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Asserting that it didn't would also be premature.
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Katazia wrote:
I don’t see any way that you could possibly substantiate your assertions.
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Because I have based my beliefs on personal experiences throughout my life (both good and bad) where I have felt God's involvement. That which substantiates my beliefs would seem foolish to you. They are things such as answered prayer, positive feelings of contentment, lives changing for the better, etc.
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Katazia wrote:
You might be correct but you have no way to know that, I think you are simply guessing.
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It has to do with faith. Something which is completely anathema to non-believers.
But... that's not MY fault.
peace...
-Mike
Re: Re: RE: wonder
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Squid Vicious wrote:
my impression here is that you consider man to be small. perhaps he is. but it almost sounds is if you want to believe it, that your prefer this belief, rather than believing that man is more capable than what he shows himself to be. why is this?
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It isn't to diminish man, but to magnify God.
-Mike
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Squid Vicious wrote:
my impression here is that you consider man to be small. perhaps he is. but it almost sounds is if you want to believe it, that your prefer this belief, rather than believing that man is more capable than what he shows himself to be. why is this?
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It isn't to diminish man, but to magnify God.
-Mike
I NEED GOD! I AM dependant on GOD.
They are things such as answered prayer, positive feelings of contentment, lives changing for the better, etc.
Of course, anyone could make this connection if they had absolutely no dependance on themselves.
It has to do with faith. Something which is completely anathema to non-believers.
No, "non-believers" simply have dependance on themselves and each other. That is because they know realistic answers regarding contenment and changing for the better come from interaction with each other, in other words, reality, and not from praying to imaginary icons.
It isn't to diminish man, but to magnify God.
Magnifying gods will ultimately diminish man.
They are things such as answered prayer, positive feelings of contentment, lives changing for the better, etc.
Of course, anyone could make this connection if they had absolutely no dependance on themselves.
It has to do with faith. Something which is completely anathema to non-believers.
No, "non-believers" simply have dependance on themselves and each other. That is because they know realistic answers regarding contenment and changing for the better come from interaction with each other, in other words, reality, and not from praying to imaginary icons.
It isn't to diminish man, but to magnify God.
Magnifying gods will ultimately diminish man.
same old same old
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Q wrote:
Of course, anyone could make this connection if they had absolutely no dependance on themselves.
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Ho hum... the old "I don't need a crutch like the damned Christians" argument.
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Q wrote:
No, "non-believers" simply have dependance on themselves and each other.
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Everyone depends on something. If you claim otherwise, then you've identified self-dillusion is YOUR crutch.
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Q wrote:
That is because they know realistic answers regarding contenment and changing for the better come from interaction with each other, in other words, reality, and not from praying to imaginary icons.
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Who is to say what makes someone content, or what makes the world better? Your heaven might be hell to me.
Also, you have your own icons which you worship. Don't pretend you don't!
-Mike
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Q wrote:
Of course, anyone could make this connection if they had absolutely no dependance on themselves.
==============================================
Ho hum... the old "I don't need a crutch like the damned Christians" argument.
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Q wrote:
No, "non-believers" simply have dependance on themselves and each other.
==============================================
Everyone depends on something. If you claim otherwise, then you've identified self-dillusion is YOUR crutch.
==============================================
Q wrote:
That is because they know realistic answers regarding contenment and changing for the better come from interaction with each other, in other words, reality, and not from praying to imaginary icons.
==============================================
Who is to say what makes someone content, or what makes the world better? Your heaven might be hell to me.
Also, you have your own icons which you worship. Don't pretend you don't!
-Mike
Ho hum... the old "I don't need a crutch like the damned Christians" argument.
Aside from the adjective, "damned," that statement is entirely correct.
Everyone depends on something. If you claim otherwise, then you've identified self-dillusion is YOUR crutch.
Not something, but someone, an entirely different concept. And yes, we depend on ourselves and one another, no other imaginary entities are required. That is reality.
Who is to say what makes someone content, or what makes the world better? Your heaven might be hell to me.
I don't base reality on a heaven or a hell, those are imaginary concepts exclusive to an imaginary afterlife. My reality is what I choose to make it, alive and well, living in that reality. What you might be illuding to is that my reality may not be yours. I would conclude that to be true if your reality was based on fantasy. If my reality gets out of control not of my own doing, I certainly do not ask an imaginary entity for guidance. I simply fix it myself.
Also, you have your own icons which you worship. Don't pretend you don't!
A truly vacuous statement. Please provide examples of these so-called icons.
Aside from the adjective, "damned," that statement is entirely correct.
Everyone depends on something. If you claim otherwise, then you've identified self-dillusion is YOUR crutch.
Not something, but someone, an entirely different concept. And yes, we depend on ourselves and one another, no other imaginary entities are required. That is reality.
Who is to say what makes someone content, or what makes the world better? Your heaven might be hell to me.
I don't base reality on a heaven or a hell, those are imaginary concepts exclusive to an imaginary afterlife. My reality is what I choose to make it, alive and well, living in that reality. What you might be illuding to is that my reality may not be yours. I would conclude that to be true if your reality was based on fantasy. If my reality gets out of control not of my own doing, I certainly do not ask an imaginary entity for guidance. I simply fix it myself.
Also, you have your own icons which you worship. Don't pretend you don't!
A truly vacuous statement. Please provide examples of these so-called icons.
gladly...
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I wrote:
Also, you have your own icons which you worship. Don't pretend you don't!
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Q wrote:
A truly vacuous statement. Please provide examples of these so-called icons.
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Vacuous eh? Okie-dokie, here's some "icons" that some people "worship":
1. Money (wealth)
2. Power
3. Prestige
4. Famous people
5. Possessions
6. Sex
7. Drugs
8. Self
That should hold you. Have a good day...
-Mike
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I wrote:
Also, you have your own icons which you worship. Don't pretend you don't!
==============================================
Q wrote:
A truly vacuous statement. Please provide examples of these so-called icons.
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Vacuous eh? Okie-dokie, here's some "icons" that some people "worship":
1. Money (wealth)
2. Power
3. Prestige
4. Famous people
5. Possessions
6. Sex
7. Drugs
8. Self
That should hold you. Have a good day...
-Mike
Vacuous eh? Okie-dokie, here's some "icons" that some people "worship"
No, I meant me, not some people. However, let's look at your list:
Money - I don't worship money, I simply gather as much as I need to make myself comfortable. That is the world we live in, the trading of money for goods. A very poor example, though.
Power - What do mean ? I'm not interested in power. I don't wish to control people. Another very poor example.
Prestige - You mean, for example, the '66 Mustang I drive. It's an awesome car. Have you seen the new cars nowadays, you can't tell one from the other. Perhaps I don't entirely understand this example.
Possessions - Sorry, I don't bow down to my material things and adore and worship them. They are just things. A completely silly example.
Sex - Now your talking, you got me there. However, I have a tendency to worship the female body as oppossed to sex. I mean, is there nothing more beautiful ? *sigh*
Drugs - Now your reaching. Ridiculous example.
Self - Bingo! But you must also include my family and friends, who I worship the most.
No, I meant me, not some people. However, let's look at your list:
Money - I don't worship money, I simply gather as much as I need to make myself comfortable. That is the world we live in, the trading of money for goods. A very poor example, though.
Power - What do mean ? I'm not interested in power. I don't wish to control people. Another very poor example.
Prestige - You mean, for example, the '66 Mustang I drive. It's an awesome car. Have you seen the new cars nowadays, you can't tell one from the other. Perhaps I don't entirely understand this example.
Possessions - Sorry, I don't bow down to my material things and adore and worship them. They are just things. A completely silly example.
Sex - Now your talking, you got me there. However, I have a tendency to worship the female body as oppossed to sex. I mean, is there nothing more beautiful ? *sigh*
Drugs - Now your reaching. Ridiculous example.
Self - Bingo! But you must also include my family and friends, who I worship the most.
Is it really comparative?
So is narcissism, then, a condition colloquially referred to as "worshipping yourself", the ritual equivalent of taking the Eucharist? Inherent greed is the ritual equivalent of prayer?
Flags and institutions are worshipped. Power, prestige, sex, and so forth--these are adored.
thanx,
Tiassa
So is narcissism, then, a condition colloquially referred to as "worshipping yourself", the ritual equivalent of taking the Eucharist? Inherent greed is the ritual equivalent of prayer?
Flags and institutions are worshipped. Power, prestige, sex, and so forth--these are adored.
•_The 21st Lie of Perdurabo
thanx,
Tiassa
Grey Seal
Religions are suppose to confuse you. It is the only way to keep hidden what most religions are really about. The truth is, all organized religions are about money and power. Those that have it and want to keep it and those that want to get it. It's power over people to make them do what ever you ask. Religions control you through intimidation. "If you don't follow my teaching you will surly die". You know the routine. You must take your self out side of the box and look in. Look at what ministers and preachers say, how they say it,what they say.
Now look at politicians, the bully on the block, the revivial preacher, the president that wants to go to war because he can't think of any thing else to do. Do you see what I mean?? But you have to find peace within yourself. Do I belive in GOD? I believe in a supreme something that probably had a lot to do with life starting on this planet. And it may have arrived in some type of space ship. Who knows. No one. Every religion claims to be the way to some where. Be happy. Try every day to do something good for your self and someone else. Respect the rights of others insofar as they don't impede your rights. Remember that any religion that threations you with something is trampling on your right to peaceful existence. If the government taxed the property of churches, many would pack their tents and slip away into the night. Go in peace and good will.
RR.
Religions are suppose to confuse you. It is the only way to keep hidden what most religions are really about. The truth is, all organized religions are about money and power. Those that have it and want to keep it and those that want to get it. It's power over people to make them do what ever you ask. Religions control you through intimidation. "If you don't follow my teaching you will surly die". You know the routine. You must take your self out side of the box and look in. Look at what ministers and preachers say, how they say it,what they say.
Now look at politicians, the bully on the block, the revivial preacher, the president that wants to go to war because he can't think of any thing else to do. Do you see what I mean?? But you have to find peace within yourself. Do I belive in GOD? I believe in a supreme something that probably had a lot to do with life starting on this planet. And it may have arrived in some type of space ship. Who knows. No one. Every religion claims to be the way to some where. Be happy. Try every day to do something good for your self and someone else. Respect the rights of others insofar as they don't impede your rights. Remember that any religion that threations you with something is trampling on your right to peaceful existence. If the government taxed the property of churches, many would pack their tents and slip away into the night. Go in peace and good will.
RR.