question for atheists and theists.
- Thread starter skaught
- Start date
break down of the proof i have, the proof of my religion. mainly the quran.
So would you say that you are open to the idea that there might not be a god?
mmmmm..
look at it this way, i am reasonable. i go with evidence, but evidence (including logic) is so overwhelming and soo strong and so convincing that i can't imagine the world otherwise, it's what some of you call faith, but i understand faith as "accumulated evidence strengthening each other"if that makes any sense.
and me being here in an atheist forum should answer your question.
I get SO tired of this lame old dichotomy. Why does it have to be one or the other? Why can't both see it is neither?!
The field that makes up the universe is a grand unified field of consciousness that we are all made up of.
"God" is such a primitive and personalized term that is so inapplicable. It would be like saying little invisible men make magnets come and collide together.
Far eastern philosophies and natives spirituality have a far better grasp and understanding of this concept than Aramaic Religions and the Religions that come from cultures of their traditions.
I highly recommend reading the book, "God is Red" by Vine Deloria, Jr. for a better understanding. The souls men in the third dimension are rooted in space and in time and have to more to do with our thoughts than any other factor.
Of course, there are plenty of things that could convince me (atheist) that there is a God. I wonder why they never happen though, it should be so easy for God to do.
Demonstrate that the immaterial in provably non-existent. Which is impossible; you can't prove a negative. Or, more properly, you can't disprove something that cannot be measured scientifically, since that would be in violation of the basic principles of the scientific method.
Likewise, I cannot demonstrate or prove that the gods do exist. In any case, I don't claim to have empirical evidence for them.
then the word "belief will have no meaning".. as no one sane would not believe..so "non-believers" and "atheists" would be replaced by "insane" and "crazy" and "suicidal" and "non-logical" or plain "deaf". for god to speak into their heads and then they don'...
HEY HEY HEY WAIT A MINUTE!!!
HOLD THE FREAKING HORSES!!
:bugeye:
:bugeye:
:bugeye:
won't you then be called to have schizophrenia????????
Perhaps a couple of examples of what I am talking about?
Now bear in mind, this "field" of consciousness originates from a different dimension, so measuring it with our current scientific instruments is proving difficult. Studies are underway to understand multi-dimensionality at the large HADRON collider at CERN.
The human body does have, however, I believe, the ability to tap into the extra-dimensional properties that exist out side of what is known in our own dimension, and which can affect that which goes on in what we know to be our own reality. Through out history, forces in other dimensions have affected our dimension, thus we get stories through out time from the great philosophers and prophets.
Perhaps seeing will be better.
Empirical Example One.
Empirical Example Two.
Now bear in mind, this "field" of consciousness originates from a different dimension, so measuring it with our current scientific instruments is proving difficult. Studies are underway to understand multi-dimensionality at the large HADRON collider at CERN.
The human body does have, however, I believe, the ability to tap into the extra-dimensional properties that exist out side of what is known in our own dimension, and which can affect that which goes on in what we know to be our own reality. Through out history, forces in other dimensions have affected our dimension, thus we get stories through out time from the great philosophers and prophets.
Perhaps seeing will be better.
Empirical Example One.
Empirical Example Two.
I didn't explain what that evidence would be, but I assure you, voices in my head would not be enough, unless they led to me pick stock options or the winning racehorse.
Atheists: Is there anything that could convince you that there is a god?
I haven't seen a comprehensive definition of a god, nor of God either. But let's assume that we know what we are talking about......omniscient, omnipotent, ubiquitous, etc, etc.
The only way to convince me is via the scientific method with compelling evidence. This would render god or God to nothing more than a feature of the real natural world, measurable, subject to detailed chemical and physical analysis and reproducible in a Petri dish.
Therefore, convincing me that there is a god makes it necessary to demonstrate that it isn't a god
That's why god-believers shouldn't want scientific evidence in favour of god or God.
They see scientific evidence all around us that he/she/it exists, But there isn't so it doesn't.
OriginalBiggles, Prime
"Giving every man the vote has no more made them wise and happy than christianity has made them good" H.L.Mencken
I haven't seen a comprehensive definition of a god, nor of God either. But let's assume that we know what we are talking about......omniscient, omnipotent, ubiquitous, etc, etc.
The only way to convince me is via the scientific method with compelling evidence. This would render god or God to nothing more than a feature of the real natural world, measurable, subject to detailed chemical and physical analysis and reproducible in a Petri dish.
Therefore, convincing me that there is a god makes it necessary to demonstrate that it isn't a god
That's why god-believers shouldn't want scientific evidence in favour of god or God.
They see scientific evidence all around us that he/she/it exists, But there isn't so it doesn't.
OriginalBiggles, Prime
"Giving every man the vote has no more made them wise and happy than christianity has made them good" H.L.Mencken
Scifes in #7 wrote; but i understand faith as "accumulated evidence strengthening each other" if that makes any sense.
You'll be relieved to learn that it doesn't.
FAITH, in the religious sense, means belief without evidence or in spite of evidence to the contrary. So your quotation marks, in effect, should read; "accumulated codswallop strengthened by regular additions of more codswallop."
OriginalBiggles, Prime
"Giving every man the right to vote has no more made them wise and happy than christianity has made them good" H.L.Mencken
You'll be relieved to learn that it doesn't.
FAITH, in the religious sense, means belief without evidence or in spite of evidence to the contrary. So your quotation marks, in effect, should read; "accumulated codswallop strengthened by regular additions of more codswallop."
OriginalBiggles, Prime
"Giving every man the right to vote has no more made them wise and happy than christianity has made them good" H.L.Mencken
what about avoiding a worldwide financial dump?
but what is the belief built upon? why is it there? where does it come from or originates?
besides, by your definition, you go back to square [all theists are stupid] which isn't true, explain the special cases if they exist, or explain the majority of humanity being dumb.
faith is simply preferring some evidence over other evidence.
1-the evidence they choose, you know squat of.
2-the evidence they rejected, or overruled by other evidence, you hold dear and know nor understand anything else.
I believe in a causal universe, one where actions have consequences, no matter how remote or distant from the source. If all were random, directionless or without consequences, then there would be no measure of control.
this is a great question.
and for me, the answer is no.
god is the one who proved his existence to me, so who could ever undo that?
the answer would have to be...god.