Possibility of star formation around black holes

Beaconator said:
So if the man with the biggest imagination says to put all the elements together to continue to gain answers unthought of by anyone else's imagination... What are the chances that any objective facts will supersede a real unresearchable experiment?
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I have always spoken in support of Imagination.....The great man even said that "Imagination was more Important then knowledge".....although I believe he was just making a point. Imagination of course goes hand in hand with knowledge.
What some need to realize though is, Imagination remains Imagination, until some practical application can be applied, and until an hypothesis is formed....Then tests, observations and experiments either validate or invalidate what the Imaginative quality has been transformed into.

I have often mentioned the otherwise great scientist, Lord Kelvin, and his words in around 1897 that human flight was Impossible, or words to that same effect.
Some are probably laughing at the "Planetary resources" and its founder Peter H. Diamandis for their current efforts in promoting asteroid mining. I fully support and praise such Innovative activities.
These are the type of innovative, Imaginative people that will take current NEO manned flights out to the rest of the solar system and beyond.
I fully support the likes of Marc Millis, Paul Gilster, Geoff Marcy, and David Brin, and the "Tau Zero" foundation.
Marc Millis of course being a Propulsion Physicist with the NASA Glenn Research Center.


But Imagination must be tempered with fact, realism and the laws of physics and GR.
Goblins, fairies etc are Imaginative qualities of children, while Wormholes, and time travel are allowed predictions of GR.
 
paddoboy said:
I have always spoken in support of Imagination.....The great man even said that "Imagination was more Important then knowledge".....although I believe he was just making a point. Imagination of course goes hand in hand with knowledge.
What some need to realize though is, Imagination remains Imagination, until some practical application can be applied, and until an hypothesis is formed....Then tests, observations and experiments either validate or invalidate what the Imaginative quality has been transformed into.

I have often mentioned the otherwise great scientist, Lord Kelvin, and his words in around 1897 that human flight was Impossible, or words to that same effect.
Some are probably laughing at the "Planetary resources" and its founder Peter H. Diamandis for their current efforts in promoting asteroid mining. I fully support and praise such Innovative activities.
These are the type of innovative, Imaginative people that will take current NEO manned flights out to the rest of the solar system and beyond.
I fully support the likes of Marc Millis, Paul Gilster, Geoff Marcy, and David Brin, and the "Tau Zero" foundation.
Marc Millis of course being a Propulsion Physicist with the NASA Glenn Research Center.


But Imagination must be tempered with fact, realism and the laws of physics and GR.
Goblins, fairies etc are Imaginative qualities of children, while Wormholes, and time travel are allowed predictions of GR.
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Finally got some blah blah, yackidy smackidy outa you! I don't mean to be insulting here truly I just want to skip the bulls@&t.

Just likethereisnogreaterpeace than every emotion balanced within oneself. There is no greater experiment than all elements we infer to be different yet similar in the same box!

No chemist has ever argued against me.
 
paddoboy said:
What I have posted is accepted logic, scientific reasoning and facts.
What have you posted?
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Um a universal inequality, unaccepted reasoning. The fact no chemist has ever argued against me should count for something. The fact I'm more articulate a savant than Ben Stein and dress myself better than Einstein. Sing better than Johnny Cash, and laugh more than Buddah! The fact I've never taken an iq test and can place your's somewhere around 165.
 
Beaconator said:
Um a universal inequality, unaccepted reasoning. The fact no chemist has ever argued against me should count for something. The fact I'm more articulate a savant than Ben Stein and dress myself better than Einstein. Sing better than Johnny Cash, and laugh more than Buddah! The fact I've never taken an iq test and can place your's somewhere around 165.
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Nothing in other words, obviously. Sad.
 
All that and the fact nobody understands the koide formula when it is nothing more than a ratio of density that relates when fermions decide to go boom!

Did I mention I threw the iq curve? Ah well that's just basic statistics.
 
Moderator note:

Ten posts deleted as being rude, insulting or off topic, along with responses to them.
 
Trippy said:
Moderator note:

Ten posts deleted as being rude, insulting or off topic, along with responses to them.
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Thanks. The last thing I need to do is debate Mr. Hawking and his Mage while I'm drunk. I can only
Take so much evasion while still being human.
 
Beaconator said:
You will admit star formation occurs in a region near a black hole as long as you input your own specifications. Fine. My point still stands as star formation "beginning" before or at your region by a process that has been previously described.
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Black holes are considered strong enough to pull light itself in. It should stand to reason light would build up in orbit around black holes before the event horizon. If this is true the accumulation of energy would form a ring or accretion disk which would eventually coalesce into a star.
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I do not see how this could work. Any energy in the form of photons outside of the event horizon will have a velocity that exceeds the escape velocity of the black holes gravity and will move away into space.

By what mechanism could energy coalesce into a star?
 
origin said:
I do not see how this could work. Any energy in the form of photons outside of the event horizon will have a velocity that exceeds the escape velocity of the black holes gravity and will move away into space.

By what mechanism could energy coalesce into a star?
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Gravity
 
Photovoltaic effect causes electrons (like all fermions) to gain mass by emparting energy from entropy into electrons. The mechanism is gravity.
 
solar cell.
the top cell captures the high-energy photons and passes the rest of the photons on to be absorbed by lower-band-gap cells.
 
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Wow that's the most inaccurate and worthless explanation of photovoltaics I have ever heard. But you probably never read any of Einstein's papers or even generally understand the propagation of light or photon absorption. Your nothing more than living voltometer!
 
Beaconator said:
Wow that's the most inaccurate and worthless explanation of photovoltaics I have ever heard. But you probably never read any of Einstein's papers or even generally understand the propagation of light or photon absorption. Your nothing more than living voltometer!
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yes yes,
more pathetic nonsense.
i'm in accurate ?
comical :)

it appears(as obvious as can be), clueless is involved on what photovoltaic effect actually is from who i responded to.


yzarc.
 
with this vast inconceivable(to anyone else) knowledge of yours,
i would like to see a theorem of such.
have you even heard of a guy named srinivasa ramanujan

i'm just curious.
 
Beaconator said:
Photovoltaic effect causes electrons (like all fermions) to gain mass by emparting energy from entropy into electrons. The mechanism is gravity.
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The way the photovoltaic process works is that a photon is absorbed by an electron in a semiconductor. If the photon has sufficient energy then the electron will jump across the band gap of the semiconductor and become a free electron that can be used in an electrical current.
The electrons in a photovoltaic cell get their energy from photons not entropy.

How do you think gravity would drives the photovoltaic effect?

Also this explanation is different from your original statements. It seems you are no longer saying that a star forms from energy; instead you are saying that the existing mass around a star increases in mass from the photons near the black hole, leading to star formation.

This presents some problems. The rest mass of an electron is $$9.109 x 10^{-31}$$ kg. When a photon is absorbed by the electron its rest mass does not change. The electron has an increase in velocity that corresponds to an increase in its relativistic mass. So the more photons it absorbs the faster the velocity of the electron making it less likely to coalesce into a star. Another issue is that stars are not composed of a relatively few heavy electrons and protons.

Could you go into more detail about the formation/increase of mass around a black hole?
 
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