Pope declares self immortal

I must admit that I have never had much contact with Catholicism, and I don't understand the fascination with Mary. I'm sure Catholics are easy to pick on because of all its "churchliness", but I've heard similar arguments used by non-denominational churches against protestants - that they put "church" before "God". Personally, I don't see how the Pope is necessary, since Jesus teaches us all we need to know in the Bible. The Pope hasn't received more of the Holy Spirit than any other Christian.

I do think that Jesus meant his church to be truly catholic - in the ecumenical sense - otherwise he wouldn't have used the 'many limbs, one body' comparison. The structure prevents it from breaking up into a completely individualistic religion where each denomination thinks it is self-sufficient, and every new idea creates a new denomination.

Jesus should be the head, and I think it is easy for less informed people to confuse the Pope with Christians' real spiritual leader. Love should be the message of salvation, not damnation.

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I just want to add something. Priests and Ministers don't forgive sins on their own merit, but in Jesus' name. They are merely repeating what Jesus said. The only true confession of the guilt of sin is not in the words, but the deeds. All our sins have already been forgiven, and we can do nothing more to add to what Jesus did for us.
 
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Jenyar,

Of course, St. Peter doesnt have much more of a Holy Spirit than you and me. Thats silly, God is in every one of us. But Im sure St. Peter responds more to the calling of God more than an average person. After al, he dedicated his enitre life serving the Lord, he didnt even bother looking for wife, just like the Pope.

Simple, if the Pope, cardinals, bishops, etc. (12 functions of the church) is not necessary, then the 12 tribes of Israel, and the 12 apostles is also not necessary..If it wasnt because of the Pope, bishops, and fathers of the church. "THE BIBLE WOULD HAVE NEVER BEEN COMPILED FROM HUNDREDS OF SCROLLS", God used them as His instrument, just as Jesus used the12 apostles as His instrument...

You have to understand the handed down generations of Abraham, which God promised to number as the sands of the shore, Jesus didnt come to abolish the law, but to fulfill it. The catholic church with all the Pope and bishops in synagogues are just the tradition of the judaism, just as Jesus taught in synagogues as well at times...

Again I am a catechist teacher. The church have nothing against other religions, as long as it doesnt teach its ok to abort, rape, molest, etc. (against morals).
There are levels of truth, as every individual is their owwn religion (the body is the temple of God). We take things according to how we can handle them and it depends to every individual, NOT ONE PERSON IS ALIKE, INCALCULABLE HUMANS, ALL DOESNT HAVE THE SAME FINGER PRINTS, we are unique in our own way...
The catholic church acknowledges the Protestant churches and other bible based denomination to contain some truth, BUT THE FULLNESS OF TRUTH COMES FROM THE CATHOLIC CHURCH, the word "Truth" is defined as that which leads us to live in harmony with God, our real purpose, and to meet him at the end.
Even Hinduism and Buddhism have some "TRUTHS (MORAL VALUES)" in it, but the problem with some of them is they teach immorality as well (such as its ok to be perverted, and the goal of heaven is sexual satisfaction), BUT THE FULLNESS OF VIRTUES, MORALITY COMES FROM THE CATHOLIC CHURCH....simple...Once again we are judged by our virtues for faith without works is dead....To enter heaven u dont have to carry the title "christian" or "catholic", BUT TO ENTER HEAVEN IS TO FOLLOW THE MORAL VALUES AND VIRTUES, WHETHER YOUR A BUDDHIST OR NOT, IF YOU ARE PATIENT, HUMBLE, LOVING, FORGIVING, GENEROUS, RESPECTFULL, AND MEAN IT, EVEN TO THE POINT OF GIVING UP YOUR LIFE TO SAVE ONE MAN, THEN YOU WILL ENTER HEAVEN, AND ALL THIS TEACHING YOU WILL FIND IT IN THE CATHOLIC CHURCH (others have as well but not as complete).If the protestant churches have 3 sacraments, we have 7 sacraments. We have the book of maccabees and other things in our bible that they dont (because Martin Luther took it out during the reformation to fit his idea of religion), thats why Protestants dont believe in praying for the dead because the boook of Maccabees is taken out of your bible where it says "It is good and wholesome to pray for the dead".
AND PROTESTANTS ALSO DONT BELIEVE IN PURGATORY AND CLEANSING OF SINS, SO IF THE OWNER OF HUSTLER MAGAZINE, OR ADOLF HITLER LIVED THEIR ENTIRE LIFE KILLING EVERYBODY, HAVE SEX ANYTIME THEY WWANT, TALK SMACK AGAINST GOD, CARELESS AND SPITS AT CHILDREN, SLAUGHTER THEM, DO ALL KINDS OF EVIL, AND AT THE END THEY SAY "LORD FORGIVE ME" THEN THATS IT, THEY GO TO HEAVEN, THATS ILLOGIC..."You sow what you reap, for the same measure you give it shall be measured back unto you"- Jesus. "Faith without works is dead"- Bible. MARTIN LUTHER AND MANY PROTESTANTS BELIEVE ONLY IN FAITH ALONE A MAN IS SAVED, BECAUSE MARTIN LUTHER TOOK THAT OUT WHERE IT SAYS FAITH WITHOUT WORKS IS DEAD, TO HAVE THE IDEA OF "ENTERTAINING CHURCH"....(I am not sure if its in protestant bible where it says that..).
 
God's grace
God saved me as well as St. Peter. I can never earn God's forgiveness, because it is by grace alone that I was saved. My actions are a testament to my faith, not a validation of it. When Jesus uttered said "it is finished", tetelestai, it means there is nothing left to be done, all debts were paid, and I believe that.

Rom.1:32Although they know God's righteous decree that those who do such things deserve death, they not only continue to do these very things but also approve of those who practice them.

Human justice demands "an eye for an eye", i.e. everybody get what they deserve. God's justice demands all sins to be punished fairly, and since all sins are against the life God gave us, their penalty is death. Jesus died so we don't have to. There is nothing you can do to lessen your guilt; that would mean Jesus died in vain, because we could eventually redeem ourselves!

Romans 5:15
But the gift is not like the trespass. For if the many died by the trespass of the one man, how much more did God's grace and the gift that came by the grace of the one man, Jesus Christ, overflow to the many!

Jesus was sown in death, we reap the life
Matthew 6:26
Look at the birds of the air; they do not sow or reap or store away in barns, and yet your heavenly Father feeds them. Are you not much more valuable than they?

We sow and reap for our own benefit, or to our own destruction. We contribute nothing to God's grace (which God "feeds" us with love).

Galatians 6:8
The one who sows to please his sinful nature, from that nature[ Or his flesh, from the flesh] will reap destruction; the one who sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life.

It's more important why we do it, and for whom.

But Jesus told him, "Follow me, and let the dead bury their own dead."
1 Thessalonians 4:14
We believe that Jesus died and rose again and so we believe that God will bring with Jesus those who have fallen asleep in him.

Jesus is the only intercessor we need. Priests can do no more than affirm what we already know:
Romans 8:34
Who is he that condemns? Christ Jesus, who died–more than that, who was raised to life–is at the right hand of God and is also interceding for us.

God said Himself that He is not a God of dead people. And since everyone who believes in God through Jesus has eternal life, what do we hope to achieve in praying for the dead? We can't bring the dead to life, only Jesus can, and already has.
 
If the Pope really did mention that he is immortal (but in what way?), then there's a problem. Immortal in spirit, sure that's a good claim, but immortal as in, "I can't die physically and won't age." Get off the drugs.

Religion...it can make people say and do very frivolous things.
 
Can we just get clarity on one thing please: that website, and that article, has no more validity than anything posted similarly on theonion.com

Please don't post fabrications and present them as truth. The resulting chaos is unproductive...
 
Whassup, please don't post in caps...you're giving me a headache...alll these zealously religious posts all caps really chip away at my sanity.

Oops I can just hear you yelling "THATS BECAUSE YOU HAVE NO FAITH ATHEISTS NEVER DO THEY LIE ANYTIME THEY WANT YOU SOUL ON THE I95 TO HELL!!!"

Ugh.

_________________________________________
There is no god, afterlife or divine love. There is only Entropy, the mother from which we were all born. She tugs our souls with the beautiful, maternal love of chaos. Why do you keep Her waiting?

-central philosophy of Zero, Sage of Chaos
 
Re: Off the subject...

Originally posted by VAKEMP
Zero,

You live on the East Coast, Zero?
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*innocent babyeyes*

What makes you say that?

_________________________________________
There is no god, afterlife or divine love. There is only Entropy, the mother from which we were all born. She tugs our souls with the beautiful, maternal love of chaos. Why do you keep Her waiting?

-central philosophy of Zero, Sage of Chaos
 
I have received an E-mail the other day about the pope declaring himself to be immortal and so as I searched for more information, I discovered you folks. I have not read all of the threads and so I may be redundant in my remards, please forgive. I am a protest-tant who from a historical and doctrinal point of view strongly disagree and disaprove the the system of Catholicism.

Has anyone read the text in the Bible, I Timothy 6:16? "Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honor and power everlasting. Amen." It is clear when one reads this text that it is talking about God. Does the pope think of himself equal with God? Actually, I believe that he does. He calls himself the vicar of God.

One of two very profound thigs will happen; he will die and many Catholics will honestly begin to look at why protestants protested in the first place way back centuries ago in Germany. If not, then Satan, will soon impersonate the second coming of Christ before the pope has time to die (it would have to be soon) and the whole world will be deceived. (see Revelation 13:3).

Catholic doctrine is very brilliant but dangerously anti-Biblical. Infallibility of the pope is one just example. :)
 
Xev said:
Nebula:
Oh, I know the concept of Infallibility. It's still funny.

I mean, he's, like, immortal now. Immortal and infallible....he's......SUPER-POPE!

Anyways, I have it on good authority that I abuse the Catholics too much. I need another religion to make fun of. :cool:
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M*W: What religion other than Christianity is there to make fun of?
 
Andre' said:
I have received an E-mail the other day about the pope declaring himself to be immortal and so as I searched for more information, I discovered you folks. I have not read all of the threads and so I may be redundant in my remards, please forgive. I am a protest-tant who from a historical and doctrinal point of view strongly disagree and disaprove the the system of Catholicism.

Has anyone read the text in the Bible, I Timothy 6:16? "Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honor and power everlasting. Amen." It is clear when one reads this text that it is talking about God. Does the pope think of himself equal with God?
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M*W: As an x-xian and former Catholic, I'd like to take a stab at answering. According to catechism, the Pope is not equal to God. The Pope is Jesus' representative here on Earth.
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Actually, I believe that he does. He calls himself the vicar of God.
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M*W: Technically, I believe he calls himself "Vicar of Rome."
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One of two very profound thigs will happen; he will die and many Catholics will honestly begin to look at why protestants protested in the first place way back centuries ago in Germany. If not, then Satan, will soon impersonate the second coming of Christ before the pope has time to die (it would have to be soon) and the whole world will be deceived. (see Revelation 13:3).
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M*W: I think someone has misinterpreted the Pope's address. Surely the Pope knows he will experience genetic decay. I think he was referring to his eternal spirit. However, if you've ever been to St. Peter's, you'll know that the basement contains the crypts of earlier popes, and let me tell you what, that place is as musty as any mausoleum. The Pope probably means eternal life in the spirit, which I believe we all have.
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Catholic doctrine is very brilliant but dangerously anti-Biblical. Infallibility of the pope is one just example. :)
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M*W: Infallibility of the Pope has long passed its usefulness. JPII is a good man and a good teacher. He's an Apostle, but I'm not Catholic anymore. The RCC only recognizes Apostles, Martyrs and Saints. The Pope is a good guy. He means no harm. We all have eternal life in the Spirit, but that doesn't mean we need to profess Christianity.
 
This is not a valid ex-cathedra statement from the Pope. I know simply because I've never heard of it.
 
whatsupyall said:
they accuse the Pope as being so rich, when the fact is he owns nothing but his ring,
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so what does he live on? :rolleyes:
the gold in vatican are dedicated to the temple, as requested by God himself,
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so God needs gold?
what the fuck for?
dude's supposed to be omnipotent ruler of the Universe :rolleyes:
for we dedicate to God whats valuable in this earth, but the bishops, priest, and pope owns none of those gold,
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you lying sack of shit,
you are all greedy mofos,only interested in exploiting everyone stupid gullible enough to believe in your fairy tales. :mad:
why dont you share some of that wealth with the needy and poor,use it to improve the lifes of the sick by giving to the hospitals,etc,
 
Of course, St. Peter doesnt have much more of a Holy Spirit than you and me. Thats silly, God is in every one of us. But Im sure St. Peter responds more to the calling of God more than an average person. After al, he dedicated his enitre life serving the Lord, he didnt even bother looking for wife, just like the Pope.
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Peter was married because the bible mentions his son in law, but I can't imagine Peter following Jesus without his wife. I think perhaps Peter's wife died before Peter met Jesus. Any case, the Church consider celbracy a matter of practice, not doctrine.

While Jesus does not need a leader on earth, statements by him imply that he wanted the Church to be under one leader, namely Peter.
<blockquote>
41 Peter said, "Lord, are you telling this parable for us or for all?" 42 And the Lord said, "Who then is the faithful and wise steward, whom his master will set over his household, to give them their portion of food at the proper time? 43 Blessed is that servant whom his master when he comes will find so doing. 44 Truly, I say to you, he will set him over all his possessions. 45 But if that servant says to himself, `My master is delayed in coming,' and begins to beat the menservants and the maidservants, and to eat and drink and get drunk, 46 the master of that servant will come on a day when he does not expect him and at an hour he does not know, and will punish him, and put him with the unfaithful.</blockquote>
 
Hmm. Anyone who believed that story needs to have their minds checked. Look at some of the other <a href="http://web2.airmail.net/~elo/news/">articles</a> the site hosts.
 
read the guys thought and belief where that words come from, THE GUY IS AN ATHEIST AND BELIEVE THERE IS NO SOUL, NOTHING...ONCE AGAIN YOU DONOT EXPECT TO HEAR "TRUTH" FROM ATHEISTS, YOU DONT! THEY DONT CARE, THEY LIE ANYTIME THEY WANT, "REPENTANCE" IS A MYTH TO THEM, THEY HAVE NO RESPECT AND WILL FALSELY ACCUSE THE CHURCH (I CANT SPEAK FOR ALL, BUT I THINK 99.9999999% OF THEM ARE)(SATAN KNOWS THE TRUE CHURCH STANDING, BUT JESUS SAID "NOT EVEN THE GATES OF HELL SHALL PREVAIL AGAINST IT", YOU CAN TALK SMACK ABOUT THE CATHOLIC CHURCH ANYTIME U WANT, BUT YOU WILL NEVER SUCCEED IN DESTROYING US, NEVER, YOUR ONLY MAKING US STRONGER AND STRONGER)
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Don't make me slap you, you stupid little monkey.
 
It suffices to say that the Pope can only make ex-cathedra statements concerning the deposit of faith and morals within the tradition of the Church; and therefore, the Pope cannot make such a statement.
 
thats why Protestants dont believe in praying for the dead because the boook of Maccabees is taken out of your bible where it says "It is good and wholesome to pray for the dead".
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It's been my experience that Protestants and Jews will pray for the dead, but usually not to the dead.

MARTIN LUTHER AND MANY PROTESTANTS BELIEVE ONLY IN FAITH ALONE A MAN IS SAVED, BECAUSE MARTIN LUTHER TOOK THAT OUT WHERE IT SAYS FAITH WITHOUT WORKS IS DEAD, TO HAVE THE IDEA OF "ENTERTAINING CHURCH"
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Well, Martin Luther attempted to take out the book of James and Revelations. Martin Luther was wrong, though if faith is defined to encompass love, then salvation would be only by faith alone. Nevertheless, Paul makes the distinction between faith and love in his writings. Out of faith, love, and hope, he says that love is the greatest and he says that he is nothing without love. Thus, faith alone insofar as defined by Paul is nothing without love, which makes sola-fide empty.
 
You know, Satan in the garden of Eden told Eve that she would not die and Jesus himself told us to fear Him who can destroy both body and soul. Man does not have an immortal soul. If he did then he would truely be as God and could not die. Something is wrong here.

If Jesus made Peter the first pope and he was the head of the early church, then you have a problem in Acts 15 where there was a controversy as to whether new converts should have to become "jewish" in terms of circumcision etc. Actually the recognize head of the church was not Peter but James. Protestants do not believe that Jesus made Peter the first pope.

The text acutually says. "Thou art Petros (little stone) and unpon this rock
(Himself - great rock), I will build my church and the gates of hell will not prevail against it." The true vicar of Jesus on earth is The Holy Spirit not John Paul II. Paul tells us in his epistles that Jesus is the chief cornerstone and he also tells us that Jesus was the Rock that gave the Jews water in the wilderness. Jesus also said to call no man "father" (papa - pope). We do not need to confess our sins to another sinner like ourselves. We can go directly to God. Yes the Bible says to confess our faults one to another, but notice that it does not say sins. The difference is about something that I have done to someone and am asking that person to forgive me. If this is not true then why would Jesus again and again tell us to approach God as our Father directly. For these and many other reasons, protestants should have trouble with catholocism. Celebacy of priest, turning the bread into the body of Jesus are just some of the example of great liberty and not being scriptural. I am not trying to be mean here but there is a tremendous precedent here, and thoughtful souls would go directly to God about these things if there is any truth to them at all. God bless you all. :)
 
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