Non - linear time beginning from 2001 in Quito, Ecuador?

[Dennis Tate]

I could be wrong but I have ran into what I consider to be a lot of evidence over the past thirty or so years that has me thinking that time is not limited to being one straight line but instead branches and branches and branches.........
somewhat like Multiverse Theory........
and what is in my mind would be termed Theistic Multiverse Theory or even Applied Multiverse Theory, (applied by The G-d of Abraham who I believe EVOLVED over infinite time in the past)...... but I admit it.... .I am biased due to the number of times that I read and re-read the Christian and Jewish scriptures since I was a teenager.

I taught English as a Second Language in Quito, Ecuador from 2001 into 2002 and I admit it......
much of what I write links to my subconscious desire to grab the attention of English language students and increase their level of motivation to increase their vocabulary and actively practice English.

Philosophically I am rather rabidly "Universalist" so my reasoning is that the most ancient Intelligence is off the scale emotionally involved in the success of all of His / Her creations....... no matter what level of energy they happen to be primarily vibrating at?????

 

[Dennis Tate]

What I have in my mind at this time could potentially be linked as a challenge to all of the Moderators here at Sciforums.... but also to all of the posters here as well and it could fit with this other discussion that I began over here:

http://www.sciforums.com/threads/proposal-for-creation-of-sciforums-volunteerism-hour.164213/
"Proposal for creation of Sciforums Volunteerism Hour."

Now I am going to send off the link to this discussion to one of the moderators to ask if what I have in mind is appropriate for Sciforums or not????

 

[sculptor]

While my son was a peace corps volunteer in Ecuador:
I found myself standing atop a mountain north of Quito hurtling toward the east at over 1000 miles per hour
with no sensation of motion

It seems that one feels acceleration rather than motion

 

[Dennis Tate]

I believe that my wife could be termed a "Pentecostal Prophetess" or "Charismatic Catholic Prophetess"......
either designation would work fine in my opinion.

I first wrote to my wife on August 8, 2000 through a Christian dating website and somehow she was shown
by Jesus... that I was going to be her husband and that she should fast and pray for me. When my wife began to
really pray for me powerfully I felt as if a whole new level of Shalom or peace of mind had hit me.... that was
radically better than where I had been at psychologically since 1990.

To give you a strange..... (and I think really funny), example of the type of messages that my wife gets.....
as my future wife was planning for my landing in Quito, Ecuador on January 12, 2001 she checked out
the local newspaper and found that two Seventh Day Adventist women wanted a room mate to split the rent with.....
my wife went so far as to contact them.. .and then somehow....... (I am not one hundred percent sure how)... Jesus somehow
told her.... "Don't put him in there......... he is only human!"

In retrospect both my wife and I laugh rather often about that message that she got about that possibility that she was facing!

 

[Dennis Tate]

While my son was a peace corps volunteer in Ecuador:
I found myself standing atop a mountain north of Quito hurtling toward the east at over 1000 miles per hour
with no sensation of motion

It seems that one feels acceleration rather than motion

Wow!!!!

You have really got my attention with that comment. Could you please explain further?

 

[Dennis Tate]

To give you an idea of how I personally think.....
I live in the old stomping grounds of Dr. Moses Coady:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moses_Coady

The relationship between the poll question that I included with this discussion is that I am of the belief that Eventual Universal Salvation......
that is a largely Philosophical Question has a possible link over to a somewhat similar idea being applied in job creation..... universal and free health care...... full employment and even a brilliantly financed Universal Basic Minimum Income!

My belief is that Dr. Moses Coady...... because he was personally Roman Catholic ....
had a tendency to take his ideas of "Hope for the Dead" that his belief in some form of "Purgatory" would tend to
generate........ and he concluded that there was also Hope for the economically nearly dead.......
the very poor residents of Nova Scotia of one century ago.

h. Who goes to heaven?
In the end ... believe it or not (sigh of relief), everyone gets to come home! Heaven is a place of ultimate LOVE. When we have learned how to become individuals that base our entire existence and consciousness around manifesting LOVE, we then become capable of entering the domain of the higher Realms of Heaven. If we do not practice Love, we can only go so far and we will be made to incarnate somewhere out there in God's super Universe again and again (unlimited times) until we learn." (Christian Andreason, near-death .com)

https://www
.near-death.
com/experiences/gay/christian-andreason.html#a04h

I am of the belief that our ideas on philosophy or theology, (or the lack thereof).......
have at least something of an effect on our feelings toward economics, politics, world events and history. I find it rather intriguing that my own belief in Eventual Universal Salvation philosophically tends to significantly mirror my beliefs on economics and politics.

 

[Dennis Tate]

What I am about to write may cause you to think of me as an idiot.....
but that is OK.... that is entirely your choice.

Similar to the people who report having some sort of otherworldly experience and claim to have seen some aspects of the future.....
I suspect that Matthew chapter four indicates that Rabbi Yeshua - Jesus may have hade at least an out of the body experience.....
if not a full fledged near death experience ..... and he may have glimpsed many aspects of at least some variations on our time period........
as well as our next thousand years?????

Luke 23:31
"For if they do these things in a green tree, what shall be done in the dry?"

I believe that this statement indicates that Messiah Yeshua - Jesus was predicting some aspects of a general "Global Warming" trend a bit like
Dr. James Hansen has done over the past several decades.

I believe that Messiah Yeshua - Jesus was comparing our near future with the time period of the siege of Jerusalem of seventy C. E. ......
and I think that he meant that in some ways our future...... or the future for our grandchildren...... or great grandchildren....
might perhaps in some ways be even worse than the events surrounding the siege of Jerusalem and / or Capernaum by the Roman Armies.

Historian Josephus wrote some amazing details of how rough events were at that time.

Doom of Capernaum Fall of Galilee in 67 AD


Matthew 11:23
"And thou, Capernaum, which art exalted unto heaven, shalt be brought down to hell: for if the mighty works, which have been done in thee, had been done in Sodom, it would have remained until this day."

Although our time period is somewhat like Sodom and Gomorrah..... we have the freedom of choice to set in motion a vastly better future than the people of Capernaum set in motion by their choices and ways of thinking.

 

[Dennis Tate]

I've been in correspondence with Latter day Saints since 2018 and I believe that
they are in a unique position to significantly decrease the level of hostility in the Middle East
due to their tendency to identify with the Lost Tribes of Israel which put them in a special position
to perhaps be willing to trade homes with Palestinians living in the West Bank or perhaps with Muslims living in
any part of Israel who might be willing to
move to wherever a particular LDS family happened to be living?

Latter day Saints already have an agreement with the Jewish Rabbi's in Israel to not proselytize to Jews
but..... Latter day Saints may even be willing to join in some variation of the Noahide Movement that
is like a Jewish outreach to the Gentile world.

A near death experiencer in 1992 was given a series of visions related to bringing peace to the Middle East that
would have obvious "artistic value" that can be transformed into "educational value, diplomatic value and yes economic value" in
the form of reality film projects where Latter day Saints end up living in Israel......
having traded places with an Israeli family who would prefer to live wherever those Latter day Saints happened to have their home.

Now we are in a position to even liven things up further if the Latter day Saints could make an agreement with the nation of China to
pay a ransom for Uighur Muslims who perhaps become students at BYU in Jerusalem, or at any BYU campus.

It is obvious that the nation of China sure does not want Uighur Muslims living in their nation so this presents a special
opportunity to set in motion something that could alter the formula in the Middle East because...... if the LDS had an agreement that
rescued thousand and soon tens of thousands and soon hundreds of thousands of Uighur Muslims and moved them out of China.....
I suspect that Uighur Muslims who have been saved from a modern Holocaust would tend to be very difficult to convince to
become "suicide bombers" due to their level of thankfulness for their new nation that may accept them?

For the record I personally could not catch onto the logic for "God's Peace Plan for the Holy Land" until I read "Way of Holiness and the Sacred Hoop"
by the same near death experiencer.

http://godspeaceplan.org/books-download-page/

God's Peace Plan Arabic Version (final)
God's Peace Plan English God's Peace Plan for the Holy Land
God's Peace Plan Hebrew God's Peace Plan Hebrew Version (final)
Way of Holiness and the Sacred Hoop Way of Holiness & the Sacred Hoop
What's Going On in the Holy Land What_s Going On In The Holy Land
Map of the Holy Land Map of the Holy Land
Map of the Holy Land Map of the Holy Land (Arabic & Hebrew)

It has been estimated that the Latter day Saints church could come up with a hundred billion dollars if they had to
and I believe that they would be open to a variation of Theistic Evolutionary Theory that would tend to lay a foundation
for the idea that perhaps each human life has something like infinite value to a Creator composed of fundamental or nearly
fundamental energy who was "evolving" and learning over infinite time even before the last major Big Bang type event.
Investing in saving human lives through some variation of "art" could potentially transform and boost the world economy
out of this COVID 19 economic slump that fits with the two factors needed for a time of hyperinflation.
1. print extra money
2. DRAMATICALLY REDUCE PRODUCTIVITY

This is a basic idea that Agnostics, Atheists, Latter day Saints, Jews, Muslims and many other people all over the world could potentially cooperate to some degree on. I have in mind a new genre of film entitled "semi-reality science fiction" that deals with the predictions of the Jewish, Christian, Muslim and other prophecies for the latter days or last hour that........ create acting jobs and address some of the circumstances that might tend to produce WWIII.

Here is an ancient Islamic prediction that I believe Agnostics, Atheists, Muslims, Jews, Christians and many other people could cooperate on:

Book 005, Number 2208:
"Abu Huraira reported Allah's Messenger (way peace be upon him) as saying: The Last Hour will not come before wealth becomes abundant and overflowing, so much so that a man takes Zakat out of his property and cannot find anyone to accept it from him and till the land of Arabia becomes meadows and rivers."
SAHIH MUSLIM, BOOK 25: The Book on General Behaviour (Kitab Al-Adab)

In theory film footage that actually saves lives and makes the world a somewhat better and safer place for everybody could play the role of metaphorical "gold" in backing up an increase in the supply of "money" in one form or another.

 

[Dennis Tate]

I have in mind to attempt to convince the Latter day Saints to build another BYU in Quito, Ecuador..... or at least near Quito!

I do believe that a percentage of the faculty and student body of Brigham Young University at all of their various campuses would tend to see significant value in the writings and illustrations of Chaim Henry Tejman M.D. on Wave Theory.

 

[James R]

I could be wrong but I have ran into what I consider to be a lot of evidence over the past thirty or so years that has me thinking that time is not limited to being one straight line but instead branches and branches and branches.........

Please present your best two or three pieces of evidence that point to that conclusion.

Philosophically I am rather rabidly "Universalist" so my reasoning is that the most ancient Intelligence is off the scale emotionally involved in the success of all of His / Her creations....... no matter what level of energy they happen to be primarily vibrating at?????

What has that got to do with non-linear time? Can we stick to one topic at a time, please?

 

[Write4U]

Please present your best two or three pieces of evidence that point to that conclusion.

Can the "tree of life" have an associated "tree of time-lines".

Can we say that within the greater universal spacetime new individual time-lines emerge along with the birth of new patterns?

If time is a fluid medium subject to relativity, can we say there are several time variable time frames?

Is time the same for a photon as for a slug or a mayfly?

 

[James R]

Can the "tree of life" have an associated "tree of time-lines".

Let's be clear about what we're trying to discuss here. For a start, can somebody please define the term "time line"?

Can we say that within the greater universal spacetime new individual time-lines emerge along with the birth of new patterns?

I don't know. Can we? What's an "individual time line", and can the "individual" concerned ever have more than one of them?

If time is a fluid medium subject to relativity, can we say there are several time variable time frames?

I don't know what you mean by time being a medium.

Certainly, it is possible to use different time variables in different reference frames. That's kind of the point of relativity. Time is not fixed. Spacetime and the events that occur in it are, according to relativity.

Is time the same for a photon as for a slug or a mayfly?

Is time the same in what way?

 

[Write4U]

Let's be clear about what we're trying to discuss here. For a start, can somebody please define the term "time line"?

My father-in-law’s brother, Kenneth Fisher, organized a reunion for the descendants of his grandparents, and I wanted to make a nice graphic showing the relationships between attendees that could fit on a single printed page. I was inspired by a paper on a technique called TimeNets, which shows a timeline of the lives of various family members, laid out such that marriages and parent-child relationships are easy to visualize. With a small data set such as the one I had to work with, I was able to do the layout by hand, and I opted to replace the curved lines indicating marriages with some grey bars, due to the limitations of the tools I was using. The end result is also somewhat reminiscent of one of my very first visualizations: Context.

http://nicolas.kruchten.com/content/2015/08/family-trees/

I don't know. Can we? What's an "individual time line", and can the "individual" concerned ever have more than one of them?

According to relativity an individual can.

I prefer to think that subjectively each event that has a beginning and and end has an associated timeline for the duration of its existence. You may be more familiar with the terms "worldline", "wordsheet", "worldvolume", which addresses the durational aspect of dimensional space.

If the Universal timeline began with the beginning of the Universe, then it stands to reason that your timeline began with your birth (age=0)

I don't know what you mean by time being a medium.

Well the easy answer is that Time is a dimension., a measurable quantity.

The physical nature of time is addressed by general relativity with respect to events in space-time. Examples of events are the collision of two particles, the explosion of a supernova, or the arrival of a rocket ship. Every event can be assigned four numbers representing its time and position (the event's coordinates).

However, the numerical values are different for different observers. In general relativity, the question of what time it is now only has meaning relative to a particular observer. Distance and time are intimately related and the time required for light to travel a specific distance is the same for all observers, as first publicly demonstrated by Michelson and Morley. General relativity does not address the nature of time for extremely small intervals where quantum mechanics holds. At this time, there is no generally accepted theory of quantum general relativity. [15]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Time

Certainly, it is possible to use different time variables in different reference frames. That's kind of the point of relativity. Time is not fixed. Spacetime and the events that occur in it are, according to relativity.

IOW, time is a fluid but unidirectional medium.

Time is the indefinite continued progress of existence and events that occur in an apparently irreversible succession from the past, through the present, into the future.

Wiki.

Is time the same in what way?

A subjective experience?

 

[RainbowSingularity]

I could be wrong but I have ran into what I consider to be a lot of evidence over the past thirty or so years that has me thinking that time is not limited to being one straight line but instead branches and branches and branches.........

science has already proven that time is non linear, TWICE !

• 1st time with atomic clocks & high altitude air travel

• 2nd with gravitational lenseing

 

[James R]

According to relativity an individual can.

How?

I prefer to think that subjectively each event that has a beginning and and end has an associated timeline for the duration of its existence.

Technically, in relativity, the word "event" refers to a single set of coordinates in spacetime. That is, an event has no beginning or end; it's just a single point that happens at a particular place at a particular time. In that sense, your life is a complicated series of connected spacetime events.

You may be more familiar with the terms "worldline", "wordsheet", "worldvolume", which addresses the durational aspect of dimensional space.

Yes. It sounds like your word "timeline" is closest to relativity's "worldline".

If the Universal timeline began with the beginning of the Universe, then it stands to reason that your timeline began with your birth (age=0)

This is where precise definitions start to become important. The entire universe is made up of a huge number of individual particles, all of which have their own worldlines. We can't speak of a "universal worldline". The universe as a whole doesn't have a single worldline.

Well the easy answer is that Time is a dimension., a measurable quantity.

That's a different idea from it being a medium.

IOW, time is a fluid but unidirectional medium.

Again, I can't tell what you mean by that. Your definitions seem muddled.

A subjective experience?

I think that, as a first step, you need to settle for yourself the question of whether time is a quantity, a medium, or an experience. It can't be all of those things, because those things are all different from one another.

 

[Write4U]

How?

How old are you? That's your individual time line (world line)

Technically, in relativity, the word "event" refers to a single set of coordinates in spacetime. That is, an event has no beginning or end; it's just a single point that happens at a particular place at a particular time. In that sense, your life is a complicated series of connected spacetime events.

Yes, that is one of the definitions. Another definition is a "sports event" that has a time line (world line) of 2 or 3 hours (plus overtime in case of a tie). Or any event that has an extended duration.

Yes. It sounds like your word "timeline" is closest to relativity's "worldline".

Yes, and the term timeline is used by other people describing individual chronologies.

Chronology

1: the science that deals with measuring time by regular divisions and that assigns to events their proper dates
2: a chronological table, list, or account, a chronology of the author's works
3: an arrangement (as of events) in order of occurrence, reconstruct the chronology of the trip

This is where precise definitions start to become important. The entire universe is made up of a huge number of individual particles, all of which have their own worldlines. We can't speak of a "universal worldline". The universe as a whole doesn't have a single worldline.

I agree with the first part, but the Universe has a defined timeline (world line) of 13.8 billion years. Anything which can be associated with a duration of existence has a timeline (worldline)

That's a different idea from it being a medium.

Ok, I agree, if you will. But one can also argue that spacetime is not a fabric. Yet we use the term because it symbolizes a flexible sheet. I use the term medium in the same context as the term fabric.

I am not proposing anything new. I am using conversational terms to address known science.

What happens to the fabric of space-time when an object moves through it near the speed of light? [quote[First of all, space-time is not a fabric. Space and time are not tangible 'things' in the same way that water and air are. It is incorrect to think of them as a 'medium' at all. [/quote]

No physicist or astronomer versed in these issues considers space-time to be a truly physical medium, however, that is the way in which our minds prefer to conceptualize this concept, and has done so since the 19th century.

We really do not know what space-time is, other than two clues afforded by quantum mechanics and general relativity. General relativity as developed by Albert Einstein, says, and this is a direct quote from Einstein, that;
"Space-time does not claim existence in its own right, but only as a structural quality of the [gravitational] field".

https://einstein.stanford.edu/content/relativity/q909.html#

So, what would you call it, without needing half a page to give a full description of spacetime ?

Again, I can't tell what you mean by that. Your definitions seem muddled.

I appreciate your insistence on the precise scientific terms, but I am sure you understand what I am saying when using these conversational shorthand terms. (p.s. what is shorthand, a person with little hands?)

Shorthand.

a short and simple way of expressing or referring to something.
"poetry for him is simply a shorthand for literature that has aesthetic value"

I think that, as a first step, you need to settle for yourself the question of whether time is a quantity, a medium, or an experience. It can't be all of those things, because those things are all different from one another.

I agree, but you know my personal perspective of time; "Time is an emergent property of measurement of duration", IOW time is not a dimension at all, except as an emergent product of duration of change or existence. I was using the term in context of a variable individual measurement of duration, an individual worldline , including any object with a durable existence, except for the worldline of the universe itself which has a timeline of 13.8 billion years. I don't see how that can be confusing. If I were to use the terms "worldvolume" of 13.8 billion years, that would be confusing.

 

[Dennis Tate]

Please present your best two or three pieces of evidence that point to that conclusion.


What has that got to do with non-linear time? Can we stick to one topic at a time, please?

The summary of the book that Helen Wambach Ph. d. and Dr. Chet Snow collaborated on was rather impressive to me.

https://www.baproducts.com/chetmap.htm


Here is a one page summary of her book that also summarizes her collaboration with Dr. Chet Snow.
The last four paragraphs summarize her work with Dr. Chet Snow on what they got when they progressed people into
visions of the future.

I would like to think that this all means that humanity made better decisions and we are now living in a much more
peaceful world than the one that Helen Wambach Ph. D. and Dr. Chet Snow put people into from their research in the 1980's.

http://www.carolmoore.net/articles/helenwambach.html

DR. HELEN WAMBACH AND REINCARNATION
Dr. Helen Wambach (Ph.D.) was one of the earliest scientific researchers into past lives and reincaration. She was the author of Reliving Past Livesand Life Before Life (both published in 1978 by Bantam paperback books). The updatedReliving Past Lives: The Evidence Under Hypnosiswas published in 1984. Mass Dreams of the Future was published by Chet Snow in 1993 after her death was based on her research.

Initially motivated by a desire to debunk reincarnation, beginning in the mid-1960s, Helen Wambach conducted a 10-year survey of past-life recalls under hypnosis among 1,088 subjects. She asked very specific questions about the time periods in which people lived and the clothing, footwear, utensils, money, housing, etc. which they used or came in contact with. Wambach concluded found peoples' recollections to be amazingly accurate and wrote that ''fantasy and genetic memory could not account for the patterns that emerged in the results. With the exception of 11 subjects, all descriptions of clothing, footwear, and utensils were consistent with historical records.''

Victor Zammit describes Wambach's research thus:


By doing a scientific analysis on the past lives reported by her 10,000 plus volunteers she came up with some startling evidence in favor of reincarnation:

• 50.6 % of the past lives reported were male and 49.4 % were female — this is exactly in accordance with biological fact.

• The number of people reporting upper class or comfortable lives was in exactly the same proportion to the estimates of historians of the class distribution of the period.

• The recall by subjects of clothing, footwear, type of food and utensils used was better than that in popular history books. She found over and over again that her subjects knew better than most historians — when she went to obscure experts her subjects were invariably correct.

Her conclusion was:

'I don't believe in reincarnation — I know it!' (Wambach 1978).

In Life Before Life Dr. Wambach described the results of hypnotizing another 750 people and taking them to the time between their past and current lives. One of her most controversial findings was that people have some choice in their current lives and that the disembodied consciousness or soul does not enter the body until near birth. "The soul usually enters the body near birth, and has a choice of which fetus to enter. If one fetus is aborted, it is possible to choose another. In some cases, the soul who will occupy the fetus, is in contact with the soul of the mother, and can influence her decision regarding abortion."

Dr. Wambach found that 89% of those hypnotized said they did not become part of the fetus until after six months of gestation. A large group said they did not join the fetus, or experience inside it, until just before or during the birth process. They existed fully conscious as an entity apart from the fetus and even after six months many reported being 'in' and 'out' of the fetal body. "Many subjects reported that the onrush of physical sensations on emerging from the birth canal was disturbing and very unpleasant. Apparently the soul exists in a quite different environment in the between-life state. The physical senses bring so much vivid input that the soul feels almost 'drowned' in light, cold air, sounds. Surprising to me was the frequent report that the new-born infant feels cut off, diminished, alone compared to the between-life state. To be alive in a body is to be alone and unconnected. Perhaps we are alive to learn to break through the screen of the senses, to experience while in a body the transcendent self we truly are."

Dr. Wambach found that a certain number of people she hypnotized actually saw into future lives. What they saw concerned her--a devastated and depopulated world. So in the early 1980s, Dr. Wambach decided again to apply systematic methods. She did a huge study that involved over 2,500 people undergoing hypnotic future life progression.

The future life progressions were conducted over a number of years and several groups were involved in the study. Wambach offered the participants a choice of five time periods (three in the past and two in the future) with instructions that their subconscious minds would choose one of the periods. Of the 2,500 people in the study, six percent reported being alive in 2100 AD, and 13 percent said they were alive in the 2300 AD period. Only a handful of the subjects progressed to the future. (My guess that hypnotic progression into the future is just a lot harder than into the past! C.M.)

There was evidence, she believed, that there was a decline of up to 95 percent of the population within a few generations. Concerned, Wambach asked one of her students to progress to a specific date in the late 1990s but had to bring the woman out of hypnotic trance rapidly after the woman found herself "choking to death on a big, black cloud". Wambach found predictions for the last years of the century to include severe earthquakes, a new US currency, severe weather patterns, financial crises, bank failures, an increase in volcanic activity and the decimation of a large number of people. In 1999, there would be an isolated incident in which a nuclear explosion in Europe kills many people.

Wambach was working with Dr. Chet Snow who, after her death, published Mass Dreams of the Future. It contains the results of many such in depth future life progressions, presented in perhaps a more sensationalistic way than Dr. Wambach would have presented it. On the internet, Wambach today is most quoted by those interested in these future lives than in past lives.

 

[James R]

Dennis:

Nothing happened between 1998 and 2012 to make the map of the United States look like the map in your previous post.

Does that concern you at all? Does it do anything to shake your faith in Dr Chet Snow?

 

[Dennis Tate]

Dennis:

Nothing happened between 1998 and 2012 to make the map of the United States look like the map in your previous post.

Does that concern you at all? Does it do anything to shake your faith in Dr Chet Snow?

If a badly planned Carbon Tax had been put into effect after the year 2000 it could have led to the negation of the Global Dimming Effect which could have led to rapid warming and cracking and sliding of ice off the land based Greenland Ice Pack.

 

[Dennis Tate]

The ash and soot and dust from industry are thought to increase Global Dimming.....
which slows down a general global warming trend.

PROF VEERABHADRAN RAMANATHAN: Almost everything we do to create energy causes pollution.

NARRATOR: Burning fuel doesn't just produce the invisible greenhouse gases which cause global warming. It also produces visible pollution, tiny airborne particles of soot and other pollutants. These produce the haze which shrouds our cities. So Ramanathan wondered: Could this pollution be causing Global Dimming? The Maldives were the perfect place to find out. The Maldives seem unpolluted, but in fact the northern islands sit in a stream of dirty air descending from India. Only the southern tip of the long island chain enjoys clean air coming all the way from Antarctica. So by comparing the northern islands with the southern ones, Ramanathan and his colleagues would be able to see exactly what difference the pollution made to the atmosphere and the sunlight. Project INDOEX, as it was called, was a huge multinational effort. For four years every possible technique was used to sample and monitor the atmosphere over the Maldives. INDOEX cost twenty-five million dollars, but it produced results - and they surprised everyone.

PROF VEERABHADRAN RAMANATHAN: The stunning part of the experiment was this pollutant layer which was three kilometre thick, cut down the sunlight reaching the ocean by more than 10%.

NARRATOR: A 10% fall in sunlight meant that particle pollution was having a far bigger effect than anyone had thought possible.

PROF VEERABHADRAN RAMANATHAN: Our models led us to believe the human impact on the dimming was close to half to one per cent. So what we discovered was tenfold.

NARRATOR: INDOEX showed that the pollution particles were blocking some sunlight themselves; but far more significant was what they were doing to the clouds. They were turning them into giant mirrors. Clouds are made of droplets of water. These only form when water vapour in the atmosphere starts to condense on the surface of naturally occurring airborne particles, typically pollen or sea salt. As they grow, the water droplets eventually become so heavy they fall as rain. But Ramanathan found that polluted air contained far more particles than the unpolluted air, particles of ash, soot and sulphur dioxide.

PROF VEERABHADRAN RAMANATHAN: We saw ten times more particles in the polluted air mass north of the Maldives compared with what we saw south of the Maldives which was a pristine air mass.

NARRATOR: In the polluted air billions of man-made particles provided ten times as many sites around which water droplets could form. So polluted clouds contained many more water droplets, each one far smaller than it would be naturally. Many small droplets reflect more light than fewer big ones. So the polluted clouds were reflecting more light back into space, preventing the heat of the sun getting through. This was the cause of Global Dimming.

PROF VEERABHADRAN RAMANATHAN: Basically the Global Dimming we saw in the North Indian Ocean, it was contributed on the one hand by the particles themselves shielding the ocean from the sunlight, on the other hand making the clouds brighter. So this insidious soup, consisting of soot, sulphates, nitrates, ash and what have you, was having a double whammy on the Global Dimming.

NARRATOR: And when he looked at satellite images, Ramanathan found the same thing was happening all over the world. Over India. Over China, and extending into the Pacific. Over Western Europe... extending into Africa. Over the British Isles. But it was when scientists started to investigate the effects of Global Dimming that they made the most disturbing discovery of all. Those more reflective clouds could alter the pattern of the world's rainfall. With tragic consequences.

https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/transcripts/3310_sun.html

If USA politics had not gone the way that it did in our time line rapid melting could have been the result.

I know that Mr. Al Gore meant well with his ideas in An Inconvenient Truth but.... the type of carbon tax he was proposing could have been dangerous for the land based Greenland Ice Pack.