Mods Gone Wild

[WillNever]

No, Kira. What you have just posted is the PM that is being quoted in MY PM to you. (1), (2), and (3) are replies to your statements -- which have still gone unaddressed. They will continue to be that way, because you are incapable of addressing such things sincerely. That is why you are merely posting old, countered, PMs. Until you try, however, enjoy:

For the record, I have no idea if SAM is avoiding Kira, nor do I even expect that she is. However, I can definitely see why Kira would be concerned, given her behavior.

 

[kira]

No, Kira. What you have just posted is the PM that is being quoted in MY PM to you. (1), (2), and (3) are replies to your statements -- which have still gone unaddressed. They will continue to be that way, because you are incapable of addressing such things sincerely. That is why you are merely posting old, countered, PMs. Until you try, however, enjoy:

Yes, and eventhough I already explained it of why I appear somedays later (in response to the administrator question in this thread) in my PM to you 2 days ago, you still accuse me with the point in no (1), (2), (3) today/now.

 

[WillNever]

Kira, then you might have simply stated "The views of WillNever does not represent me, personally." You did not do that, however. Instead, you decided to post information that was already available to everyone in the forum but you did so because you thought it might hurt us, all because you wanted to "make a name for yourself," as the expression goes.

 

[James R]

Strawdog:

I, as a supporter of Palestinian rights and a strong critic of US foreign policy, have been a victim of James R and other moderators flexible and gratuitous ire, and bullying (around what is considered appropriate evidential material) as Will describes, thus I concur.

I too am a supporter of Palestinians rights and a sometime critic of US foreign policy (which can't be ALL bad, can it?).

If you've attracted my ire (and I can't actually recall the last time I moderated anything you wrote) then it can't be because we disagree politically. It must have been something else you added into your post(s), such as a breach of forum rules.


WillNever:

That is because you define your identity in terms of this forum board, James.

Hmmm. This internet forum must be immensely important to me in order to define my entire identity. I'll have to start taking it more seriously now that you've told me that's what it does. Thanks, WillNever!

By the way, I approve of your apology, although it still is a bit half-assed and qualified. You still make yourself look small by bearing grudges against the people who disagreed with you and not unequivocally apologising to them too. Perhaps you'll grow up one day.

 

[kira]

Kira, then you might have simply stated "The views of WillNever does not represent me, personally." You did not do that, however. Instead, you decided to post information that was already available to everyone in the forum but you did so because you thought it might hurt us, all because you wanted to "make a name for yourself," as the expression goes.

As I said, by stating that, I fear that SAM will hate me for not taking her side. I do not want to take any side, I have the priviledge to stay abstain without being misinterpreted.

Then again, maybe I made too much drama. If this hurts you, I apologize. Or are you going to accuse me of trying to be noble again for apologizing? Tell me then, what do you want from me. I am tired.

 

[kira]

In case I don't respond further for today, it's because I will logout now. I have spent too much hours in this forum today.

 

[WillNever]

Hmmm. This internet forum must be immensely important to me in order to define my entire identity.

No argument here.

By the way, I approve of your apology, although it still is a bit half-assed and qualified. You still make yourself look small by bearing grudges against the people who disagreed with you and not unequivocally apologising to them too. Perhaps you'll grow up one day.

It is well that you approve. And although I bear no grudges (I simply no longer acknowledge those people in the same esteem as I do others), I am not going to be nicer to people than they themselves are to others. The people who disagreed with me (most in my list *DID* agree, however) and did so respectfully are, by virtue of their behavior, worthy of respect. Those who decided to make a scene for their own sake, their own benefit, are not noble-acting and made *ZERO* attempts to resolve things peacefully with me. Perhaps they will extract a lesson from this, as I have. It would behoove them to do so.

 

[James R]

WillNever:

People who agree with you are worthy of respect; people who disagree are self-interested and not "noble-acting".

Interesting how it always works that way, isn't it? Have you have ever met somebody who disagreed with you and found them worthy of respect? Have you ever acted "unnobly" yourself?

As a "High Society" king, you're just lilly white, aren't you? But your talents for analysing other people seem to me far greater than analysing yourself.

 

[S.A.M.]

As I said, by stating that, I fear that SAM will hate me for not taking her side. I do not want to take any side, I have the priviledge to stay abstain without being misinterpreted.

Then again, maybe I made too much drama. If this hurts you, I apologize. Or are you going to accuse me of trying to be noble again for apologizing? Tell me then, what do you want from me. I am tired.

You don't have to please anyone or everyone kira and you should never do or not do something because of what other people will say. If they are your friends, they will respect your decisions rather than expect you to simply take sides out of murawwat [the English equivalent escapes me right now, its akin to loyalty, but more active], if they don't then you are well rid of them. Ultimately, its yourself you have to live with.

Here's a hug now. <hugs>

Don't worry so much. Dump this thread.

 

[WillNever]

WillNever:

People who agree with you are worthy of respect; people who disagree are self-interested and not "noble-acting".

Interesting how it always works that way, isn't it? Have you have ever met somebody who disagreed with you and found them worthy of respect?

There is no king of the group, James. However, if those people you are mentioning had disagreed politely (as Kira had *originally* chosen to do) then they would right now be held in the same esteem as anyone else. In truth, another person in the group stated that they might not have agreed with my statements in a PM to me, and they did not feel inclined to make a page-long scene in the thread. The two of us continue to have good dialogue and they are still with us. So to your question: a resounding yes. Any more questions?

 

[James R]

There is no king of the group, James.

Ok. Whatever you say.

Maybe things have changed for the better.

 

[Neverfly]

No, it's not absurd.
You were banned from one site for being bothersome, and you came to this site.
Now, oddly enough, you have a problem with this site too.

Do I?
Tell me- no, in fact, SHOW me where I said that I have a problem with This Site.

You've only been on here ten minutes. Why not just post your stuff, sit back for a while, and don't rush to pre-judgement.

WOW!
Pot, meet kettle. Look whose talking.

You claim to have solutions/opinions/God knows what to the problems which this site has, and yet you are not even familiar with SAM's posts.
You don't know what you are talking about.

No, I have been following up as I said I would on S.A.Ms posts.
You're just pissy and bitter and jumping to a lot of conclusions.

Had I bumped in here and condemned S.A.M. you would have said nothing and not been bothered in the least.

If you think you can improve on this site, why not start your own.
You'll probably see the difficulties then.

Why not you only put fingers to keyboard when your ass isn't so puckered up a person couldn't get a needle up it with a sledge hammer?

 

[Bells]

Do I?
Tell me- no, in fact, SHOW me where I said that I have a problem with This Site.

You may not have said it, but keep posting as you are and problems will arise.

WOW!
Pot, meet kettle. Look whose talking.

You should take his advice. He's been here for a hell of a long time and is a very well liked and respected member of this forum.

No, I have been following up as I said I would on S.A.Ms posts.
You're just pissy and bitter and jumping to a lot of conclusions.

Had I bumped in here and condemned S.A.M. you would have said nothing and not been bothered in the least.

Had you "bumped" in here and condemned Sam, my response to you would have gone along the lines of "who the hell are you?" and told you to get stuffed.

You are following up on Sam's posts? Then please do so quietly. Do not jump to conclusions about members on a forum you have not been in long enough to get to know or understand.

Why not you only put fingers to keyboard when your ass isn't so puckered up a person couldn't get a needle up it with a sledge hammer?

See, it's posts like this that will draw the ire of members as a whole.

In short, stop posting like a jackarse.

 

[Neverfly]

You may not have said it, but keep posting as you are and problems will arise.

Spell out exactly what it is that you have a problem with me about.

I may not have said it because I didn't say it.

You should take his advice. He's been here for a hell of a long time and is a very well liked and respected member of this forum.

My commentary directed at S.A.M. was INDEPENDENT of SAMs history. If the two of you cannot see that in my commentary, I suggest you read the posts with less of the Bias you two seem to hold.
Now, you claim I should take his advice. I think you would need to give me a compelling reason as to why I should.

Argumentum ad Populum doesn't impress me at all. I don't care who likes him. My opinion of him is the only one that matters to me and he's not endearing himself to me very much.

He sideswiped me because he disagrees with what I had said with a litany of Ad Hom accusations.
I am not obligated to respect that behavior enough to consider his advice. If he wants to talk to me about something he disagrees with- He can improve how he approaches me.

Until then, the only thing he's convinced me of is that he's not paying attention to what I actually said and apprently- Neither are you.

I also think that it is ONLY these posts in this thread that you two are complaining about.
If it's others- Then show me which ones in which threads and tell me WHY they will be porblematical. Or Report them and allow the Mods to explain why.

I think you two are unhappy that someone had the Audacity to dare to speak to SAM in a civilized manner.

Had you "bumped" in here and condemned Sam, my response to you would have gone along the lines of "who the hell are you?" and told you to get stuffed.

Oh EXCELLENT demonstation from a guy that claims my USUALLY polite and considerate posts are going to be problematical.

THIS from the guy who told me to stop posting like an "arsehole" when I was polite. Brilliant.
Ok- You want problematical? Let me help you out and give you an eye for an eye: "Who the hell are you? Blow me."

You are following up on Sam's posts? Then please do so quietly.

I Will Do As I Please. If you don't like my input then ignore it. See? It goes two ways.

Do not jump to conclusions about members on a forum you have not been in long enough to get to know or understand.

Pot Meet Kettle. The BOTH of you have just done so for me.
Excellent example of hypocrisy becoming problematical.

See, it's posts like this that will draw the ire of members as a whole.

And you two have now drawn My Ire. So NOW what are we gonna do?
Keep arguing forever and ever? Your hypocritical behavior demonstrates the very pigheadedness you accuse me of. You sling insults and derision and then he (And with your support of him-YOU) claim members are getting away with bad behavior. You both just broke the forum rules as I had read and understood them when I joined with just these two posts of yours.



Oh No! I might make enemies of you? I'm so sad...

In short, stop posting like a jackarse.

Some more pot meet kettle.
Excellent example of maturity as you resort to Ad Homs.


Truly folks- I'm impressed.

 

[Bells]

:bugeye:

Who the hell is this guy?

Anyone know?

Spell out exactly what it is that you have a problem with me about.

I may not have said it because I didn't say it.

You have jumped into a thread with conclusions about something that has been an issue on this forum for years now, something you know little to nothing about.

That is what I have a problem with.

My commentary directed at S.A.M. was INDEPENDENT of SAMs history. If the two of you cannot see that in my commentary, I suggest you read the posts with less of the Bias you two seem to hold.
Now, you claim I should take his advice. I think you would need to give me a compelling reason as to why I should.

I would hope that any comment you throw at Sam would be independent of Sam's history on this forum. Had you commented on said history, my question to you would have been the same.. ie.. who the hell are you?

CK has been a very good friend of Sam's, as far as I am aware. I have never seen Sam accuse him of bias as you have done so. You do not know me or my views or position. So what bias are you accusing me of?

My opinion of him is the only one that matters to me and he's not endearing himself to me very much.

And seeing how you address him on this forum, I would imagine you are not endearing yourself to him either.

But that is beside the point. Who are you and why should he or anyone else care about how you think of them?

He sideswiped me because he disagrees with what I had said with a litany of Ad Hom accusations.
I am not obligated to respect that behavior enough to consider his advice. If he wants to talk to me about something he disagrees with- He can improve how he approaches me.

I believe he asked you to not get involved in something that does not concern you and of which you know nothing about. In other words, do not draw attention to yourself in a matter that is particularly sensitive on this forum.

It was sage advice.

Until then, the only thing he's convinced me of is that he's not paying attention to what I actually said and apprently- Neither are you.

What exactly have you said in this thread or this forum?

I saw some advice to Sam... after reading a few posts. Sam is a grown and intelligent woman. She is well aware of what she posts and why and how she posts it.

I also think that it is ONLY these posts in this thread that you two are complaining about.
If it's others- Then show me which ones in which threads and tell me WHY they will be porblematical. Or Report them and allow the Mods to explain why.

Actually no. I found your posts to him to be objectionable. You are entering into a fight you know nothing about. And this:

However, so far my observation of your posts have revealed several bias' on your part and unnecessary commentary.

http://www.sciforums.com/showpost.php?p=2502562&postcount=403

What the hell? You have not been here long enough to pass such a judgement. Stay out of it. Do not accuse her of something you know little to nothing about. It would take you months to go through all the posts and dredge up the history that is being discussed here.

You are being nice to Sam by abusing her friend (CK) in such a manner? Seriously?

I think you two are unhappy that someone had the Audacity to dare to speak to SAM in a civilized manner.

If that were the case, I would be a very unhappy person towards the greater majority of this forum.

Oh EXCELLENT demonstation from a guy that claims my USUALLY polite and considerate posts are going to be problematical.

THIS from the guy who told me to stop posting like an "arsehole" when I was polite. Brilliant.
Ok- You want problematical? Let me help you out and give you an eye for an eye: "Who the hell are you? Blow me."

Okay.

Now, I am going to inform you of a few things.

1) I am not a guy.
2) My advice to you was correct. Do not abuse people on an issue you know nothing about and have not been here long enough to understand either side.
3) You were and are posting like an arsehole.
4) You seem to have this chip on your shoulder towards anyone who dares tell you to step back and tone it down a notch as a new member on a forum..
5) You were not polite and still aren't polite.

I Will Do As I Please. If you don't like my input then ignore it. See? It goes two ways.

What input? What input have you had in this thread?

All you have done is make the issue go that little bit longer and further. You are attempting to say that "we" are upset at you for being nice to Sam, which is so far from the truth it's entered into a black hole to another dimension. In other words, you are fanning fires that are already out of control with cloudy issues that have zero bearing on the actual issue itself.

Pot Meet Kettle. The BOTH of you have just done so for me.
Excellent example of hypocrisy becoming problematical.

I can only go by what I have seen. And thus far, what I have seen has not been that overly impressive. You have told us of your history on BAUT, accused another of bias from BAUT because he gave you a little bit of advice and then went on to insult him for telling you to step back and take it down a notch. In other words, he asked you to not get involved in an already ugly issue on this forum.

And you two have now drawn My Ire. So NOW what are we gonna do?
Keep arguing forever and ever? Your hypocritical behavior demonstrates the very pigheadedness you accuse me of. You sling insults and derision and then he (And with your support of him-YOU) claim members are getting away with bad behavior. You both just broke the forum rules as I had read and understood them when I joined with just these two posts of yours.

And you have not?

Right..

I take it the part where you told him this:

Why not you only put fingers to keyboard when your ass isn't so puckered up a person couldn't get a needle up it with a sledge hammer?

you weren't breaking the rules?

Seriously, what the hell is that?

Oh No! I might make enemies of you? I'm so sad...

I don't have enemies on this forum.

It's an internet forum.

But if you're going to have that kind of attitude, I'll just start treating you like the village idiot.

Some more pot meet kettle.
Excellent example of maturity as you resort to Ad Homs.


Truly folks- I'm impressed.

Irony..

 

[Neverfly]

:bugeye:

Who the hell is this guy?

Anyone know?

You are jumping on my back without knowing me. You admit to not knowing me.

You have jumped into a thread with conclusions about something that has been an issue on this forum for years now, something you know little to nothing about.

That is what I have a problem with.

I addressed the issues in such a manner as to eliminate whether the history was relevant.
It's a shot in the dark.
But It CAN be productive.
If this issue is years old- What does this suggest about You?
If I had taken YOUR side and defended you- I have NO DOUBT that you would not have had a problem with that.

I would hope that any comment you throw at Sam would be independent of Sam's history on this forum. Had you commented on said history, my question to you would have been the same.. ie.. who the hell are you?

Who are you to ask?
You are not obligated to agree with me. Nor are you obligated to understand me. But you are obligated to be accountable for your OWN behavior. Attacking me does not demonstrate much responsibility on your part.
Your angry and derisive remarks- The both of you- suggest a strong defensiveness and lack of self control.
You could have handled yourselves much better.
So your judgment of me means little.

CK has been a very good friend of Sam's, as far as I am aware. I have never seen Sam accuse him of bias as you have done so. You do not know me or my views or position. So what bias are you accusing me of?

Then perhaps we are very much misunderstanding eachother. Explain to me (I'm asking AGAIN) what your exact problem with me is.

And seeing how you address him on this forum,

Uhhh... He addressed ME FIRST with a rude, derisive and attacking post. I'm not obligated to then kiss his butt to make You happy.

I would imagine you are not endearing yourself to him either.

Seems I accomplished that without having ever talked to him on this forum.

But that is beside the point. Who are you and why should he or anyone else care about how you think of them?

I can ask the two of you the same. You sure seem to care a lot, considering your emotional replies...

I believe he asked you to not get involved in something that does not concern you and of which you know nothing about.

I believe he rudely jumped all over my back so I told him off for it.

In other words, do not draw attention to yourself in a matter that is particularly sensitive on this forum.

Kinda would detract from the point- Wouldn't it? All the issues discussed here are sensitive to the people that partake in the discussions and they argue and debate endlessly. What you just said is nonsense.

If you think I butted in ignorantly- That's fine. Show me where and why and educate me.
Acting like a pompous ass and telling me what to do and what not to do and telling me how awful I am is certainly not going to inspire me to please you i n any way.

It was sage advice.

Perhaps it was. But it was very poorly expressed.

What exactly have you said in this thread or this forum?

Scroll u p if you wish to know. If you do not know- Why have you been attacking my posts?!

I saw some advice to Sam... after reading a few posts. Sam is a grown and intelligent woman. She is well aware of what she posts and why and how she posts it.

What- grown adults cannot offer eachother their two bits?
Whatever.

Actually no. I found your posts to him to be objectionable.

I found his posts to me objectionable.

You are entering into a fight you know nothing about. And this:



What the hell? You have not been here long enough to pass such a judgement. Stay out of it. Do not accuse her of something you know little to nothing about. It would take you months to go through all the posts and dredge up the history that is being discussed here.

You are being nice to Sam by abusing her friend (CK) in such a manner? Seriously?

SHE discussed my commentary on that politely in quite civilized.

He acted like an ass and got what he deserved from me.

I was honest in my opinion to her. YES I could be Wrong. But she had no problem in explaining herself to me in a cordial manner. I had no problem with her and I agreed about her ideals and style.
If what this is about is you trying to defend SAM from me- I assure you it is not necessary.
SAM, as you said, is a grown woman and if she feels I need to be put in my place for what I addressed to her- SHE can do so.

1) I am not a guy.

Irrelevant.

2) My advice to you was correct. Do not abuse people on an issue you know nothing about and have not been here long enough to understand either side.

I have not abused SAM. Ask SAM if I have and if she says I have, I will apologize and try to make ammends.
If you think I have, You are jumping to conclusions about things you don't know about yourself.

3) You were and are posting like an arsehole.

And so are you two. So that accusation is a dead end.

What I CAN try to do is to not post like an arsehole. But in all honesty - I think you've misinterpreted me and are being too defensive.

4) You seem to have this chip on your shoulder towards anyone who dares tell you to step back and tone it down a notch as a new member on a forum..

Jumping to conclusions?
SEEM? He is the ONLY o ne and he did NOT do what you just said he did.
What he said was,
"You won't last long here either."
He did not say, "Hey, tone it down, man..."
So get your facts straight.
THIS Demonstrates the Bias I have pointed out clearly.

5) You were not polite and still aren't polite.

Nor are you two. So that accusation's a dead end.
Plus, I think it's been made clear that you both may have misunderstood me and had a primary emotional defensive reaction.

If you truly think I worded things badly or put my foot in my mouth- Show me how courtiously.
I have no problem with apologizing if I can see where I screwed up.

In other words, you are fanning fires that are already out of control with cloudy issues that have zero bearing on the actual issue itself.

Well, a nube can make mistakes. It was not my i ntention to relight any fires- I saw the discussion Currently Going. How I am suddenly the villain is a bit of a mystery...

I can only go by what I have seen.

And yet you hypocritically accuse me? I can only say I can do only the same. SO now what?

And thus far, what I have seen has not been that overly impressive.

Likewise.

You have told us of your history on BAUT, accused another of bias from BAUT because he gave you a little bit of advice

Bullcrap. He rudely attacked me without any provocation toward him.
Here is YOUR BIAS.
Deal with it.

and then went on to insult him for telling you to step back and take it down a notch.

That is not what he said at all.
YOUR bias toward him at work again.

 

[Neverfly]

Considering How I misinterpretted you two intially since he attacked me out of the blue and you insulted me for not liking him attacking me...
Yet it was because you had thought I was subtly attacking SAM...

You may not like HOW I express myself in my posts but you don't have to.

It seems clear that we all THREE are most likely guilty of "reaction."

At this point, I would suggest that we All Three step back and cool it and since SAM seems to be the central point of contention- Allow Her to address any wrongdoing on my part.

I'm not trying to get the last word in, so if you must comment on my post above- Know that if I don't respond, it is because of what I am suggesting in this post.


Also... Just a note... I see several typoes in the above post and it's too long for me to go crawling through it to correct them all. So be patient with it.

 

[kira]

Was thinking to take some days break from this forum. Anyway, before I take the break, I would like to thank everyone especially Bells and Strawdog for their kind words to me. Though I matter very little, I hope you guys know that your support here means a lot to me. It is very nice to know people like you
At SAM: thanks also :cheers: While I am away, you might want to victimize Trippy over here. You are also welcome to join, Neverfly. Heh, even you, Willnever.
Ok, happy posting, guys, see you next time.

 

[S.A.M.]

I'm not sure what is going on, but I am not even remotely offended by Neverfly, who seems to be a lot like me [heaven help him or her], Captain Kremmen is usually more judicious with his words and no he does not rejoice at my misery.

 

[Captain Kremmen]

Fair enough Sam.
Maybe I went a bit overboard with Neverfly. Sorry Neverfly.

I was reading through some of the threads on here, with mounting annoyance, and I read his just as my temper broke.
A lot of the post better applies to other people, but I'll leave it as it is.