Mods Gone Wild
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WillNever
Valued Senior Member
7, but I think you know that, anklebiter.
No it isn't, given the context and the post I was responding to. You not being American would have no experience in the subject of what it means for blacks to "act white," which is all I was explaining to someone.
WillNever
Valued Senior Member
Trippy, don't EVER tell somebody that they wrong unless you are POSITIVE that you fully understood their statements. And in this case, you obviously did not.
The dynamic between blacks and whites in America is unique ONLY to America. It is not the same as the relationship between, for example, Saudis and Europeans, nor is it similar to relationship between the Aboriginals and Australians, nor the relationship between the natives of your country, wherever that might be, and whoever else resides there. My statement was designed to address somebody's inquiry as to what it meant for a black American to be "acting white." All I have done in that post is describe as objectively as possible what is typically meant by that expression by the people who use it, including the traits that expression typically involves. There is nothing inherently racist about doing so, as I am not advocating that expression at all.
And what are we to make of this disparaging tone? :m:
The same could be said of you.
Let's set the politics and angst to one side for a minute, and take a rational look shall we?
Here's what you actually said:
"You not being American would have no experience in the subject of what it means for blacks to "act white," ."
And here's what I said in response:
"Analogous behaviour occurs in virtually every multicultural society."
Do you understand why I felt, and feel perfectly comfortable stating that you were wrong?
You stated that someone who wasn't American could have "NO experience" of what it means for "Blacks to act white" and I stated that you were wrong because analogous behaviour existed in most multicutural societies.
Definitions of the word Analogous:
"Similar or alike in such a way as to permit the drawing of an analogy."
"similar or corresponding in some respect."
"similar or equivalent in some respects though otherwise dissimilar; "brains and computers are often considered analogous"; "salmon roe is marketed as analogous to caviar"."
"similar, like, related, equivalent, parallel, resembling, alike, corresponding, comparable, akin".
The statement "You ... would have no experience in the subject of" excludes the possibility of even an analogous experience, because a similar experience is still some experience, which is excluded by, and contradictory of the statement no experience.
Also, being Australian does not exclude the possibility of her being black (in the american usage or the term), having travelled to the United States, or having spent an extended amount of time living in the United States - in short, being Australian does not exclude the possibility of having any experience either directly or by analogy of a "Black acting white". In fact, how did you exclude the possibility of Bells being an expatriot Black American, which would also directly contradict your assertions, especially if she no longer considers herself American.
Finally, have you ever travelled outside of the United States?
No, I do not ask this question out of antagonism, it's a genuine question that warrants a genuine answer, the reason being this.
If you haven't travelled outside of the United States, then how do you know that an Englishman's experience of a Black Englander acting like a White Englander, or, Bells has made statements elsewhere that suggest she could have a mixed heritage family that includes some direct French relatives, if you haven't travelled outside of the US, how do you know that a Frenchman's experience of someone who is Black and French acting like someone who is white and French is any different from what you're describing?
The short answer is, you don't.
WillNever
Valued Senior Member
No Trippy, you are wrong to do so. All that is, is a repetition of previous and unsubstantiated statements. I am quite sure that whatever you have in mind (New Zealand?) is not analagous nor similar.
More than once Trippy. I have even lived outside of the USA for a period of time, meaning we can throw out everything you just said. Meanwhile, have you ever lived in the USA for several years at a time... or are you basing your statements on what you have experienced vicariously, since your country (like most other developed countries) might be exposed to American culture mostly through your television set?
However, this is purely for argument's sake. In reality, none of this matters because my statements were not racist for the reasons I explained in my above post.
Didn't you just get through learning me on how uncouth it is to tell another person they are wrong?
Assumption.
No, we can't, and there's a very good reason for this - your experience of the things I've described is an American experience of the things I've described, not the experiences I've described.
It's analogous, but not the same thing.
Red herring (logical fallacy).
Strawman (logical fallacy) - I didn't claim they were racist, only that they were wrong.However, this is purely for argument's sake. In reality, none of this matters because my statements were not racist for the reasons I explained in my above post.
WillNever
Valued Senior Member
Not when you are merely stating that someone's statement of you being wrong is wrong. Try to think about the difference for a second.
Those other experiences are not the issue here, Trippy.
It is neither analagous nor similar, else you should explain, from your non-American perspective, in what way it is.
Exposing what is actually the issue is not a red herring, Trippy. You need to look up the definition of certain fallacies: you might not understand them.
Nay, not a strawman. That's just me dismissing your statements as unimportant because the chief complaint about my post by Bells, who is the one originally made any statement about it, is that it is racist. However, it is not. I can see why you feel compelled to call it a fallacy, however. It renders all you have said as irrelevant.
This, right here, is precisely why trying to explain anything to you is a waste of my time.
People recently had much to say about JamesR's reading comprehension, let's examine yours for a moment shall we?
Let's start by examining the sentence you're replying to in context.
The sentence "It's analogous, but not the same thing" draws it's context from the previous paragraph, putting it back in the context of the previous paragraph, you have just explicitly admitted that you have no grounds, whatsoever for drawing your conclusions. After all, if an American experience of a Black Englishman pretending to be a White Englishman is neither analagous nor similar to an American experience of a Black Englishman pretending to be a white englishman, than you have nothing relevant experience to draw upon to substantiate your claims.
After all.
If you've only had the american experience of a black englishman pretending to be a white englishman. And the American experience of a black englishman pretending to be a white englishman is neither analgous nor similar to a white englishman's experience of a black englishman pretending to be a white englishman.
That what possible grounds do you have for making the claim, other than ignorance?
Is ignorance considered a firm footing for making a comparison these days?
Bells
Staff member
I believe I made myself quite clear.
You can make what you will make of it. Or you can go back to the group and ask them (or Willy) what should be made of it.
Oh, in with the big leagues now, eh? Anklebiter you say?WillNever said:
Is that meant to be insulting?
So 7 people out of this whole forum? Wow! And you are their spokesman and represent a "high society" that demands the freedom of free thought? So much so that you have to tell them, all 7 of them, to come into this thread and offer support to your supposed demands?
I won't bother to point out the irony and the absolute hilarity of this whole scenario Willy!
So, in your opinion, a black person in the US acts white when they become educated?
I read the thread as a whole. And frankly, you come off sounding like you wear a white hood in your leisure time. You are, for lack of a better term, a racist.
perhaps cos we do not take offense and snitch?
or we know that redress, if desired, is futile in the face of james's puppets?
i mean, anklebiters is libelous but puppies aint?
i mean, you fucks know they are practically synonymous, ja?
y' know, history, gendy, whatnot?
bells said:
/smirk
dunno darlin
is gusgus?
Looks to me like WillNever's "High Society" will shortly be a group of one, with all other members resigning in protest against their self-appointed king.
Oi! I didn't give you permission to use my photo.
Bwahahaha. Oh, the power, the power.
Oi! I didn't give you permission to use my photo.
Bwahahaha. Oh, the power, the power.
Hmmm..
17 pages in just this thread alone of your "we do not take offense"..
lets make "we", "i"
then eyeball tt and opening posts
explain my "offended" sensibilities?
speculate then
try a few scenarios
its what we do here, ja?
Bells
Staff member
Where did I call you that?
Bells
Staff member
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