Jesus - What was the point?

davewhite04

davewhite04

Valued Senior Member
A simple question:

Why did a perfect being who apparently lived a sinless life then got crucified for some ancient laws live?

What is there to learn from that?

According to Old Testament prophecies the Messiah would carry the worlds sin on his shoulders and everyone would reject him and he would die.

Jesus, according to the New Testament was sinless, so it makes no sense?

He didn't actually commit a sin so how could he experience sin?

Bottom line is this:

People have died the same or worse deaths.
Alot of people have been raped or abused or tortured and certainly experienced sin first hand and died.

So what was the point of the New Testament?

Was it God showing us that it's possible to live a sinless life?

I am starting to find it absolutely absurd.
 
The point according to the New Testament authors was to try and get you to live without sin, as far as you can. The myth of Jesus dying for sin was an extension of even more ancient sacrificial practices. In the end, it is true life is absurd and there is no ultimate justice.
 
Unless Jesus experienced and commited sin during the time of his life that isn't covered by the New Testament, I think he isn't the messiah.

However, maybe he did go through ALOT more than we know before he hit 30.
 
I don't think his life would be all that significant if we knew all about it. He just happened to be in the right place at the right time to inspire a religion. No doubt there were many like him. We shouldn't be looking for saviors, it breeds subservience. What's wrong with saving yourself?
 
This occurence has shaped the world big style, and I want to know the truth.

Whether you think so or not, the years of his life that aren't covered mean a great deal.

The fact that they aren't covered pisses me off to be quite frank. We are left with a faultless being that has shaped the western world as we know it, and we don't even know if he is the messiah.

Based on the New Testament, I would say he was not, unless he supernatrually contained all the sins of the world without experiencing them, which isn't a fair test in my opinion.
 
I think the sinless label was applied later on. No one can gain wisdom being perfect from the start. I think he probably lived like the Essenes, being celebate and living simply. He probably spent time alone in the wilderness thinking about religious things. I don't believe there was anything supernatural about him, and I don't think there was or ever will be a messiah. There are plenty of people that lived interesting and inspiring lives who we do actually know about, it would be better to follow them.
 
Like Buddha.

There is something special about Buddha and Jesus I admit, I admire them. I do actually think they could both preform miracles but I don't want to go into that. I just don't think either (obviously not Buddha) had anything to do with the Old Testament propheseis.

I think there is a messiah, and I think we need him(I think it's a he without sounding sexist ;) )
 
davewhite04 said:
A simple question:

Why did a perfect being who apparently lived a sinless life then got crucified for some ancient laws live?
Click to expand...

I have read this question a few times very intently and i cannot figure it out. Have a read of it yourself as it is written and try and figure it out?

Very bad English.

i know i cannot talk because my english is sometimes very bad, but still if discussion is what we want we got to take the time to read our own posts over in an attempt to fix errors.

According to Old Testament prophecies the Messiah would carry the worlds sin on his shoulders and everyone would reject him and he would die.

Jesus, according to the New Testament was sinless, so it makes no sense?
Click to expand...

How so? If He takes the sins off others and carries them on His shoulders then they are not within Him are they. He can take the sins of others away without them now being His sins. Then again this is symbolic speech you are referring to so maybe your confusion comes from your interpretation of symbolic speech?

He didn't actually commit a sin so how could he experience sin?
Click to expand...

If you can see the thoughts of others you can know all about their sins without ever sinning yourself.

Bottom line is this:

People have died the same or worse deaths.
Click to expand...

So?


Alot of people have been raped or abused or tortured and certainly experienced sin first hand and died.
Click to expand...

And they where sinners themselves who experienced the outcome of others sins towards them.

So what was the point of the New Testament?
Click to expand...

To reveal the way of salvation that God has Made for us through the Messiah Jesus and the forgiveness of sins.

Was it God showing us that it's possible to live a sinless life?
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No. He was showing us that it is possible to have a life of sin forgiven.

I am starting to find it absolutely absurd.
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Yeah, well, as the scriptures say:

1 Corinthians 1
18 For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days
 
Adstar said:
I have read this question a few times very intently and i cannot figure it out. Have a read of it yourself as it is written and try and figure it out?

Very bad English.
Click to expand...

I'm geordie, so I am automatically excluded.

i know i cannot talk because my english is sometimes very bad, but still if discussion is what we want we got to take the time to read our own posts over in an attempt to fix errors.
Click to expand...

Finished punishing me?

How so? If He takes the sins off others and carries them on His shoulders then they are not within Him are they. He can take the sins of others away without them now being His sins. Then again this is symbolic speech you are referring to so maybe your confusion comes from your interpretation of symbolic speech?
Click to expand...

How does he take the sins of the world on his shoulders exactly?

No need to play the symbolic card.

If you can see the thoughts of others you can know all about their sins without ever sinning yourself.
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How do you know the thoughts of others exactly? How do you bear their sin because you know what they are thinking? Why did it take Jesus to do this, God surely knew their minds in anyway? Why did God need a walking talking mind reader?

So?
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Do you give a damn about human beings?

And they where sinners themselves who experienced the outcome of others sins towards them.
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Karma?

To reveal the way of salvation that God has Made for us through the Messiah Jesus and the forgiveness of sins.
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Salvation eh? So how much shit has happened since Jesus was crucified? Do you just dream of the next life all day? Do you give a fuck about the shit kids and people go through day in day out?

No. He was showing us that it is possible to have a life of sin forgiven.
Click to expand...

Good answer.

Yeah, well, as the scriptures say:

1 Corinthians 1
18 For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God.
Click to expand...

I can show you what else the scriptures said too, but no doubt paul will save you with his faith.

Maybe Paul should have had an ounce of the humanity Jesus had/does, and maybe you should.

All Praise The Ancient Of Days
 
What gives you the right to claim i have no humanity? I have cried with people who have suffered abuse as childeren. I have suffered abuse myself. And in claiming i have no humanity you are taking part in abuse yourself. Talk about dirt throwing. Without any evidance you are prepared to paste that persona on me. It's not me you hate mate. It is the message i give that drives you to hate.

Yes i give a damn about human beings. I give a damn about you even when you throw that kind of shit upon me.

Keep up your mocking arrogance if you will. My God will avenge me.

I hope one day you accept Jesus as your Redeemer because then His vengance will be turned away and you will not have to face the wrath of God.


Romans 12
19 Beloved, do not avenge yourselves, but rather give place to wrath; for it is written, “Vengeance is Mine, I will repay,”[a] says the Lord. 20 Therefore

“ If your enemy is hungry, feed him;
If he is thirsty, give him a drink;
For in so doing you will heap coals of fire on his head.”


All Praise The Ancient Of Days
 
“ Bottom line is this:

People have died the same or worse deaths. ”

So? (your answer)
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I responded to this answer. It didn't really show a great deal of care for other people, I didn't mean to open a can of worms I just responded to you.
 
Your God Adster, is the same as everyone elses, so don't threaten me with your God's wrath, if the god you worship is as petty as this then it isn't the one I know.
 
davewhite04 said:
Your God Adster, is the same as everyone elses, so don't threaten me with your God's wrath, if the god you worship is as petty as this then it isn't the one I know.
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"Your God Adster"

Stop believing in the lie of satan. Only God is God we are not Gods.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days
 
I didn't mean it like that lol, I *think* you are not God lol

Psalm 82:5-7
5They know not, neither will they understand; they walk on in darkness: all the foundations of the earth are out of course.
6I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most High.
7But ye shall die like men, and fall like one of the princes.

translate this for me.
 
davewhite04 said:
Stop believing in what paul wrote.
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Are you referring to Paul the Liar? The one who changed the whole Bible? and then lied about Jesus? Is that the one? The one who misguided Christians? or were they something else before Jesus??:confused:
 
skywalker said:
Are you referring to Paul the Liar? The one who changed the whole Bible? and then lied about Jesus? Is that the one? The one who misguided Christians? or were they something else before Jesus??:confused:
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-Changed, how, you mean he added new chapter ? This brings question, should New Testament even be a part of The Bible ? Why, because...
...in another thread JESUS OR BURN I asked that if Jesus is the only way to Heaven according Christians doesnt that mean that Jews will burn in hell beacause their unwillingness to accept Jesus as The Saviour ? Havent got any answers yet...
-What a dilemma eh ? Can someone show some light on these issues ?

I´m baptized Lutherian Evangelist, just a sidenote.

Bible has its origins empires of Babylon and Egypt, age of Taurus and Aries. New Testament is Roman, the age of Pisces.
 
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