Is Mohammad in Heaven or hell?

[Zero]

"Mohammad" isn't in Heaven, nor is he in hell.

I'd hazard a guess that by now he's all over the world. Since he's biodegradable, his molecules will have spread all over the place, see?

 

[WildBlueYonder]

You seem to supposing that Mohammad will be answering to Paul as to whether or not he goes to Heaven. All your tacit assumptions are based on the Doctrines of Paul.

au contrair, both Mohammad & Paul face the same Judge, Jesus stated that He was the only way to God

Now you should wonder who is likely to be more correct about Theology... Paul or Mohommet? Paul started out as a murderer

but ended up a 'saint', read more about Mohammad, he ended up a murderer, a plunderer, a saytr (plowing all those wives)
http://www.howtohavegoodsex.com/ds.htm

Christ's quick defeat in death only assured that his enemies would destroy all His writings.

if you were a christian, you would not see it as a defeat, I guess the term "Reserrection" doesn't mean anything to you?

At least Mohommet is represented by his own writings.

that may be debatable, read about how the 3rd version of the quran (the one we have now), was compiled after the fact, by the 3rd calif Uthman, after others had done this,
also, don't forget the fabled 'stones, bones, & palm leaves' that many of the suras were originally written on &
that 'trump' of all 'trumps'; Mohammad was supposedly illiterate, for all he knew he was teaching & preaching christianity, but his 'writers' may have had other ideas! if he couldn't read them, how did he know what was written down? Hmmm?

Christ comes to us by the writings of his persecutor and enemies.

No, that's more of a problem nowadays; thanks to muslims, secularists, liberals & anti-christians

 

[Bruce Wayne]

grasping at straws, as your hands slip from sure holdings?

Didn't find anything else to say, eh? Try a d find arguments instead.

 

[WildBlueYonder]

Didn't find anything else to say, eh? Try a d find arguments instead.

what me? I already won, loser

 

[Bruce Wayne]

what me? I already won, loser

lol. Yeah, sure

And what about the foul language. I wonder who it was that said:" By their fruits you shall know them" Sounds very true to me.

Oh, and btw you didn't "win". Samaria (If it was the one meant at all) was inhabited 4000 yeas B.C.E.

 

[Bruce Wayne]

au contrair, both Mohammad & Paul face the same Judge, Jesus stated that He was the only way to God

Pas vraiement. Mohammad and Isa -peace be upon them- and paul will face One God. Allah.

if you were a christian, you would not see it as a defeat, I guess the term "Reserrection" doesn't mean anything to you?

Is true, But if you were not a christian but a follower of the Messiah -peace be upon him- you would see it as a defeat.

that may be debatable, read about how the 3rd version of the quran (the one we have now), was compiled after the fact, by the 3rd calif Uthman, after others had done this,
also, don't forget the fabled 'stones, bones, & palm leaves' that many of the suras were originally written on &
that 'trump' of all 'trumps'; Mohammad was supposedly illiterate, for all he knew he was teaching & preaching christianity, but his 'writers' may have had other ideas! if he couldn't read them, how did he know what was written down? Hmmm?

That is not debatable. Total concensus about one Qur'an. In fact no sect of Islam has ever doubdet the one version. The Qur'an was written down in small pieces but it was learned by heart too. Less that 2 years after the death of the Prophet -peace be upon him- some 500 or 1000 men that learned the Qur'an by heart fought along. So it was memorized. And it was written down by men around the Prophet, but there were multitudes of them, If one thought of deviating he would be caught.

This memorization is so very important. Because thanks to it we did not need a conference 300 years after the departure of the prophet -peace be upon him- to judge what is scripture and what is not. For Muslims there has never been a shred of doubt contrary to the many many different readers of the bible.

Again you keep coming with easily defused thoughts, with nearly no argumentative value. Randolfo screaming it over and over does not change the truth.

No, that's more of a problem nowadays; thanks to muslims, secularists, liberals & anti-christians

You are welcome. We always like to share the truth with the rest. And he is quite right. Except in presecutors and enemies, Muslims are not his persecutors nor his enemies, but his true followers!

 

[skywalker]

Randy is not a follower of christ, he is a follower of homo paul. Yes we all know that ;-) Randy doesn't follow christ he follows Paul who was infact a Anti christ himself.

 

[WildBlueYonder]

lol. Yeah, sure :

And what about the foul language.

'loser' is foul to you? what a weak-crybaby, ahh, did I hurt your feelings?

I wonder who it was that said:" By their fruits you shall know them" Sounds very true to me.

yeah sure, & do you feel that you will be judged accordingly? or are you exempt?

Oh, and btw you didn't "win". Samaria (If it was the one meant at all) was inhabited 4000 yeas B.C.E.

inhabited in 4000 B.C.? by whom? prove it, seems it was first built (& occupied) by King Omri in 880 B.C.
come on, you're going "al-taqiyya" on me, tell the truth, at least to yourself

see the following;
from:
http://www.ourfatherlutheran.net/biblehomelands/palestine/samaria.htm

Samaria is unique in that it was the only city founded by the Northern Kingdom of Israel, and Omri had grand ideas for his seat of power. This new, previously unoccupied site gave him more possibilities than than either Shechem or Tirzah. Appropriately its name means "watch mountain," for it was situated at the intersection of two major caravan routes. Like Jerusalem, it commanded the north-south road along the watershed of the central hills, connecting it with Shechem to the southeast, and Dothan and the Jezreel Valley to the north. The modern road (Route 60) passes along its western foot, and the ancient one must have followed a similar line. Another road connected it with the main international trade route, later called "Via Maris" by the Romans, to the west. From this commanding position Omri and his successors could control traffic to and from the rival Southern Kingdom of Judah, while establishing important communication and trade contacts with the cities of Phoenicia (i.e., Tyre, Sidon and Biblos) to the north. Furthermore, the hill on which the city lay rose steeply above the surrounding valley and was sufficiently isolated. The location was ideal, except that it lacked springs and other water resources. Therefore the inhabitants had to depend on cisterns which proved crucial to the city's survival during the many sieges later laid against it.

from:
http://encyclopedia.thefreedictionary.com/Samaria

Biblical usage
Shomron (Samaria) is literally a watch-mountain or a watch-tower. In the heart of the mountains of Israel, a few miles north-west of Shechem, stands the "hill of Shomeron," a solitary mountain, a great "mamelon". It is an oblong hill, with steep but not inaccessible sides, and a long flat top. Omri (Omriyah, Hebrew: "Yahweh is my life") was king of Israel and father of Ahab. Albright has dated his reign to 876 - 869 BC, while Thiele offers the dates 885 - 874 BC. He was "commander of the army" for Elah when Zimri slew Elah and made himself king. The troops at Gibbethon decided instead to elect Omri as king, and he led them to Tirzah where they trapped Zimri in the royal palace, and where Zimri died (1 Kings 16:15-19)

"It was the only great city of Palestine created by the sovereign. All the others had been already consecrated by patriarchal tradition or previous possession. But Samaria was the choice of Omri alone. He, indeed, gave to the city which he had built the name of its former owner, but its especial connection with himself as its founder is proved by the designation which it seems Samaria bears in Assyrian inscriptions, Beth-khumri ("the house or palace of Omri")", Stanley.

Ethnically, the Samaritans are the inhabitants who came to Samaria after the beginning of the Jewish Babylonian Exile. 2 Kings 17 and Josephus (Ant 9.277–91) claim that the Samaritans are descendants of deportees brought into the region of Samaria by the Assyrians from other lands they had conquered, including Cuthah. Samaritanism is a religion related to Judaism in that it accepts the Torah as its holy book, though little of latter Jewish theology, leading to a deep antagonism between Samaritans and Jews. Their temple was at Mount Gerizim, not Jerusalem.

for any rebuttals, use that search engine of yours & post the links

 

[WildBlueYonder]

Pas vraiement.

non parle france, noch spraeken duesche

Mohammad and Isa -peace be upon them- and paul will face One God. Allah.

mohammad, isa & allah will face God for judgement, for leading men astray.

oh, & no christian knows this 'isa' dude, must be judas?

too bad for you, Paul will be with Jesus at the right hand of God the Father

Is true, But if you were not a christian but a follower of the Messiah -peace be upon him- you would see it as a defeat.

do you even know what "Messiah" means? you don't even know what 'Jesus' means, no, how could you?

That is not debatable. Total concensus about one Qur'an. In fact no sect of Islam has ever doubdet the one version. The Qur'an was written down in small pieces but it was learned by heart too. Less that 2 years after the death of the Prophet -peace be upon him- some 500 or 1000 men that learned the Qur'an by heart fought along. So it was memorized. And it was written down by men around the Prophet, but there were multitudes of them, If one thought of deviating he would be caught.

This memorization is so very important. Because thanks to it we did not need a conference 300 years after the departure of the prophet -peace be upon him- to judge what is scripture and what is not. For Muslims there has never been a shred of doubt contrary to the many many different readers of the bible.

hey, I didn't write the hadiths, christians didn't write them either, if they are weak, &/or refutable, why that calls into question this 'vaunted memorization" of all these early muslims, why if Mohammad's followers couldn't be trusted to remember the circumstances of the compilation of the quran, why should they be trusted in other less mundane things?

Again you keep coming with easily defused thoughts, with nearly no argumentative value. Randolfo screaming it over and over does not change the truth.

thanks for dismissing me so easily, it does wonders for your propaganda machine, so stop "al-taqiyya" 'ing me, I can tell you're lying, is the truth even found in you?

I stand by this statement, "but a lie that is repeated constantly, so that in the Hitler model of propaganda, 'a lie told often enough becoms the truth'. you need to read your own hadiths about that, they already state that there were at least 4 versions of the quran, plus many missing suras, oh, & calif Uthman got rid of the evidence, he burned it!!!"

copied from:
http://sciforums.com/showthread.php?t=36553&page=3&pp=20

as to hadiths, here goes
from:
http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/fundamentals/hadithsunnah/bukhari/
http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/fundamentals/hadithsunnah/bukhari/061.sbt.html
“
Volume 6, Book 61, Number 509:

Narrated Zaid bin Thabit:

Abu Bakr As-Siddiq sent for me when the people! of Yamama had been killed (i.e., a number of the Prophet's Companions who fought against Musailama). (I went to him) and found 'Umar bin Al-Khattab sitting with him. Abu Bakr then said (to me), "Umar has come to me and said: "Casualties were heavy among the Qurra' of the! Qur'an (i.e. those who knew the Quran by heart) on the day of the Battle of Yalmama, and I am afraid that more heavy casualties may take place among the Qurra' on other battlefields, whereby a large part of the Qur'an may be lost. Therefore I suggest, you (Abu Bakr) order that the Qur'an be collected." I said to 'Umar, "How can you do something which Allah's Apostle did not do?" 'Umar said, "By Allah, that is a good project. "Umar kept on urging me to accept his proposal till Allah opened my chest for it and I began to realize the good in the idea which 'Umar had realized." Then Abu Bakr said (to me). 'You are a wise young man and we do not have any suspicion about you, and you used to write the Divine Inspiration for Allah's Apostle. So you should search for (the fragmentary scripts of) the Qur'an and collect it in one book)." By Allah If they had ordered me to shift one of the mountains, it would not have been heavier for me than this ordering me to collect the Qur'an. Then I said to Abu Bakr, "How will you do something which Allah's Apostle did not do?" Abu Bakr replied, "By Allah, it is a good project." Abu Bakr kept on urging me to accept his idea until Allah opened my chest for what He had opened the chests of Abu Bakr and 'Umar. So I started looking for the Qur'an and collecting it from (what was written on) palmed stalks, thin white stones and also from the men who knew it by heart, till I found the last Verse of Surat At-Tauba (Repentance) with Abi Khuzaima Al-Ansari, and I did not find it with anybody other than him. The Verse is:

'Verily there has come unto you an Apostle (Muhammad) from amongst yourselves. It grieves him that you should receive any injury or difficulty..(till the end of Surat-Baraa' (At-Tauba) (9.128-129) Then the complete manuscripts (copy) of the Qur'an remained with Abu Bakr till he died, then with 'Umar till the end of his life, and then with Hafsa, the daughter of 'Umar.

Volume 6, Book 61, Number 510:

Narrated Anas bin Malik:

Hudhaifa bin Al-Yaman came to Uthman at the time when the people of Sham and the people of Iraq were Waging war to conquer Arminya and Adharbijan. Hudhaifa was afraid of their (the people of Sham and Iraq) differences in the recitation of the Qur'an, so he said to 'Uthman, "O chief of the Believers! Save this nation before they differ about the Book (Quran) as Jews and the Christians did before." So 'Uthman sent a message to Hafsa saying, "Send us the manuscripts of the Qur'an so that we may compile the Qur'anic materials in perfect copies and return the manuscripts to you." Hafsa sent it to 'Uthman. 'Uthman then ordered Zaid bin Thabit, 'Abdullah bin AzZubair, Said bin Al-As and 'AbdurRahman bin Harith bin Hisham to rewrite the manuscripts in perfect copies. 'Uthman said to the three Quraishi men, "In case you disagree with Zaid bin Thabit on any point in the Qur'an, then write it in the dialect of Quraish, the Qur'an was revealed in their tongue." They did so, and when they had written many copies, 'Uthman returned the original manuscripts to Hafsa. 'Uthman sent to every Muslim province one copy of what they had copied, and ordered that all the other Qur'anic materials, whether written in fragmentary manuscripts or whole copies, be burnt. Said bin Thabit added, "A Verse from Surat Ahzab was missed by me when we copied the Qur'an and I used to hear Allah's Apostle reciting it. So we searched for it and found it with Khuzaima bin Thabit Al-Ansari. (That Verse was): 'Among the Believers are men who have been true in their covenant with Allah.' (33.23)

Volume 6, Book 61, Number 511:

Narrated Zaid bin Thabit:

Abu Bakr sent for me and said, "You used to write the Divine Revelations for Allah's Apostle : So you should search for (the Qur'an and collect) it." I started searching for the Qur'an till I found the last two Verses of Surat At-Tauba with Abi Khuzaima Al-Ansari and I could not find these Verses with anybody other than him. (They were):

'Verily there has come unto you an Apostle (Muhammad) from amongst yourselves. It grieves him that you should receive any injury or difficulty ...' (9.128-129)

Volume 6, Book 61, Number 512:

Narrated Al-Bara:

There was revealed: 'Not equal are those believers who sit (at home) and those who strive and fight in the Cause of Allah.' (4.95)

The Prophet said, "Call Zaid for me and let him bring the board, the inkpot and the scapula bone (or the scapula bone and the ink pot)."' Then he said, "Write: 'Not equal are those Believers who sit..", and at that time 'Amr bin Um Maktum, the blind man was sitting behind the Prophet . He said, "O Allah's Apostle! What is your order For me (as regards the above Verse) as I am a blind man?" So, instead of the above Verse, the following Verse was revealed:

'Not equal are those believers who sit (at home) except those who are disabled (by injury or are blind or lame etc.) and those who strive and fight in the cause of Allah.' (4.95)

Volume 6, Book 61, Number 513:

Narrated 'Abdullah bin 'Abbas:

Allah's Apostle said, "Gabriel recited the Qur'an to me in one way. Then I requested him (to read it in another way), and continued asking him to recite it in other ways, and he recited it in several ways till he ultimately recited it in seven different ways."

Volume 6, Book 61, Number 514:
Narrated 'Umar bin Al-Khattab:

I heard Hisham bin Hakim reciting Surat Al-Furqan during the lifetime of Allah's Apostle and I listened to his recitation and noticed that he recited in several different ways which Allah's Apostle had not taught me. I was about to jump over him during his prayer, but I controlled my temper, and when he had completed his prayer, I put his upper garment around his neck and seized him by it and said, "Who taught you this Sura which I heard you reciting?" He replied, "Allah's Apostle taught it to me." I said, "You have told a lie, for Allah's Apostle has taught it to me in a different way from yours." So I dragged him to Allah's Apostle and said (to Allah's Apostle),

"I heard this person reciting Surat Al-Furqan in a way which you haven't taught me!" On that Allah's Apostle said, "Release him, (O 'Umar!) Recite, O Hisham!" Then he recited in the same way as I heard him reciting. Then Allah's Apostle said, "It was revealed in this way," and added, "Recite, O 'Umar!" I recited it as he had taught me. Allah's Apostle then said, "It was revealed in this way. This Qur'an has been revealed to be recited in seven different ways, so recite of it whichever (way) is easier for you (or read as much of it as may be easy for you)."

Volume 6, Book 61, Number 515:

Narrated Yusuf bin Mahk:

While I was with Aisha, the mother of the Believers, a person from Iraq came and asked, "What type of shroud is the best?" 'Aisha said, "May Allah be merciful to you! What does it matter?" He said, "O mother of the Believers! Show me (the copy of) your Qur'an," She said, "Why?" He said, "In order to compile and arrange the Qur'an according to it, for people recite it with its Suras not in proper order." 'Aisha said, "What does it matter which part of it you read first? (Be informed) that the first thing that was revealed thereof was a Sura from Al-Mufassal, and in it was mentioned Paradise and the Fire. When the people embraced Islam, the Verses regarding legal and illegal things were revealed. If the first thing to be revealed was: 'Do not drink alcoholic drinks.' people would have said, 'We will never leave alcoholic drinks,' and if there had been revealed, 'Do not commit illegal sexual intercourse, 'they would have said, 'We will never give up illegal sexual intercourse.' While I was a young girl of playing age, the following Verse was revealed in Mecca to Muhammad: 'Nay! But the Hour is their appointed time (for their full recompense), and the Hour will be more grievous and more bitter.' (54.46) Sura Al-Baqara (The Cow) and Surat An-Nisa (The Women) were revealed while I was with him." Then 'Aisha took out the copy of the Qur'an for the man and dictated to him the Verses of the Suras (in their proper order) .
”

"
I especially like the 7 versions part, so much for perfect memory "

You are welcome. We always like to share the truth with the rest. And he is quite right. Except in presecutors and enemies, Muslims are not his persecutors nor his enemies, but his true followers!

you must make Jesus laugh & cry at the same time, so deluded, poor little 'batboy' thinks he's 'Batman' & a good 'christian'.

if you really believe in the Messiah, find out what it means, use your handy dandy browser to find a hebrew translation of the word, then take up your cross & follow Jesus

 

[WildBlueYonder]

Randy is not a follower of christ, he is a follower of homo paul. Yes we all know that ;-) Randy doesn't follow christ he follows Paul who was infact a Anti christ himself. :

sleepwalker,












wake up!!!!

ok, now that I have your attention, don't make me laugh, the only 'homo's are all those poor muslims that have to bug each other, because it is shirk to have sex before marraige & looks like not enough females to go around

http://www.al-fatiha.net/
http://www.forward.com/issues/2003/03.08.15/news12.html

The love by men for younger, beautiful males, who are called halekon, is even enshrined in Pushtun literature. A popular poem by Syed Abdul Khaliq Agha, who died last year, notes Kandahar's special reputation. "Kandahar has beautiful halekon," the poem goes. "They have black eyes and white cheeks."

But a visitor who comments on such things is likely to be told they are not signs of homosexuality. Hugging doesn't mean sex, locals insist. Men who use kohl and henna are simply "uneducated." Regardless, when asked directly, few deny that a significant percentage of men in this region have sex with men and boys. Just ask Mullah Mohammed Ibrahim, a local cleric.

"Ninety percent of men have the desire to commit this sin," the mullah says. "But most are right with God and exercise control. Only 20 to 50% of those who want to do this actually do it." Following the mullah's math, this suggests that between 18% and 45% of men here engage in homosexual sex--significantly higher than the 3% to 7% of American men who, according to studies, identify themselves as homosexual.

That is a large number to defy the strict version of Islam practiced in these parts, which denounces sex between men as taboo. Muslims seeking council from religious elders on the topic will find them unsympathetic. "Every person has a devil inside him," says Ibrahim. "If a person commits this sin, it is the work of the devil." The Koran mandates "hard punishment" for offenders, the mullah explains. By tradition there are three penalties: being burned at the stake, pushed over the edge of a cliff or crushed by a toppled wall.

But many accuse the Taliban of hypocrisy on the issue of homosexuality. "The Taliban had halekon, but they kept it secret," says one anti-Taliban commander, who is rumored to keep two halekon. "They hid their halekon in their madrasas," or religious schools.

It's not only religious authorities who describe homosexual sex as common among the Pushtun. Dr. Mohammed Nasem Zafar, a professor at Kandahar Medical College, estimates that about 50% of the city's male residents have sex with men or boys at some point in their lives. He says the prime age at which boys are attractive to men is from 12 to 16--before their beards grow in. The adolescents sometimes develop medical problems, which he sees in his practice, such as sexually transmitted diseases and sphincter incontinence. So far, the doctor said, AIDS does not seem to be a problem in Afghanistan, probably because the country is so isolated.

"Sometimes when the halekon grow up, the older men actually try to keep them in the family by marrying them off to their daughters," the doctor says. Zafar cites a local mullah whom he caught once using the examination table in the doctor's one-room clinic for sex with a younger man. "If this is our mullah, what can you say for the rest?" Zafar asks.

Richardson, the psychiatry professor, says it would be wrong to call Afghan men homosexual, since their decision to have sex with men is not a reflection of what Westerners call gender identity. Instead, he compares them to prison inmates: They have sex with men primarily because they find themselves in a situation where men are more available as sex partners than are women. "It is something they do," he notes, "not something they are."

Daud, the motorbike repairman, would concur that the segregation of women lies at the heart of the matter. He says his first sexual experience with a man occurred when he was 20, about the time he realized that he would have difficulty marrying. In Pushtun culture, the man has to pay for his wedding and for gifts and clothes for the bride and her family. For many men, the bill tops $5,000--such an exorbitant sum in this impoverished country that some men, including Daud, are dissuaded from even trying.

from:
http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/sa.html#People

People Saudi Arabia
Top of Page
Population:
Definition Field Listing Rank Order
25,795,938
note: includes 5,576,076 non-nationals (July 2004 est.)
Age structure:
Definition Field Listing
0-14 years: 38.3% (male 5,039,578; female 4,845,937)
15-64 years: 59.3% (male 8,810,705; female 6,494,770)
65 years and over: 2.3% (male 327,047; female 277,901) (2004 est.)
Median age:
Definition Field Listing
total: 21.2 years
male: 22.8 years
female: 19.1 years (2004 est.)
Population growth rate:
Definition Field Listing
2.44% (2004 est.)
Birth rate:
Definition Field Listing Rank Order
29.74 births/1,000 population (2004 est.)
Death rate:
Definition Field Listing Rank Order
2.66 deaths/1,000 population (2004 est.)
Net migration rate:
Definition Field Listing
-2.71 migrant(s)/1,000 population (2004 est.)
Sex ratio:
Definition Field Listing
at birth: 1.05 male(s)/female
under 15 years: 1.04 male(s)/female
15-64 years: 1.36 male(s)/female
65 years and over: 1.18 male(s)/female
total population: 1.22 male(s)/female (2004 est.)
Infant mortality rate:
Definition Field Listing Rank Order
total: 13.7 deaths/1,000 live births
female: 11.58 deaths/1,000 live births (2004 est.)
male: 15.72 deaths/1,000 live births
Life expectancy at birth:
Definition Field Listing Rank Order
total population: 75.23 years
male: 73.26 years
female: 77.3 years (2004 est.)
Total fertility rate:
Definition Field Listing Rank Order
4.11 children born/woman (2004 est.)

 

[Bruce Wayne]

inhabited in 4000 B.C.? by whom? prove it, seems it was first built (& occupied) by King Omri in 880 B.C.
come on, you're going "al-taqiyya" on me, tell the truth, at least to yourself

for any rebuttals, use that search engine of yours & post the links

Here is my earlier post:

Surrender,

the link:

http://www.ancientties.com/Antika%20details/Antika%20Samaria.htm

There it says.

Samaria is an ancient town located on a hill northwest of Nabulus (Shechem) in the West Bank territory under Israeli administration since 1967. Excavations in the 1930's revealed that the site had been occupied occasionally during the late 4th millennium BCE. The city was not founded until about 880 BCE, when Omri made it the new capital of the northern Hebrew kingdom of Israel and named it Samaria. Although the northern kingdom was often stronger than Judah to the south and enjoyed greater economic development, it was crushed by Assyria in 722, and much of its population was carried into captivity. It remained the capital until its destruction by the Assyrians in 722.

If I say, as some do, that humanity originated from africa, even though africa at the time wasn't called africa my statement would still be correct.

Peace be unto you, Brother.

'Nuff said.

..3..

 

[Bruce Wayne]

more heavy casualties may take place among the Qurra' on other battlefields, whereby a large part of the Qur'an may be lost

So you see why, very good.

So I started looking for the Qur'an and collecting it from (what was written on) palmed stalks, thin white stones and also from the men who knew it by heart, till I found the last Verse of Surat At-Tauba (Repentance) with Abi Khuzaima Al-Ansari, and I did not find it with anybody other than him. The Verse is:

'Verily there has come unto you an Apostle (Muhammad) from amongst yourselves. It grieves him that you should receive any injury or difficulty..(till the end of Surat-Baraa' (At-Tauba) (9.128-129) Then the complete manuscripts (copy) of the Qur'an remained with Abu Bakr till he died, then with 'Umar till the end of his life, and then with Hafsa, the daughter of 'Umar.

So they were thorough.

"O chief of the Believers! Save this nation before they differ about the Book (Quran) as Jews and the Christians did before."

It beats relying on paul.

'Uthman said to the three Quraishi men, "In case you disagree with Zaid bin Thabit on any point in the Qur'an, then write it in the dialect of Quraish, the Qur'an was revealed in their tongue." They did so, and when they had written many copies, 'Uthman returned the original manuscripts to Hafsa. 'Uthman sent to every Muslim province one copy of what they had copied, and ordered that all the other Qur'anic materials, whether written in fragmentary manuscripts or whole copies, be burnt. Said bin Thabit added, "A Verse from Surat Ahzab was missed by me when we copied the Qur'an and I used to hear Allah's Apostle reciting it. So we searched for it and found it with Khuzaima bin Thabit Al-Ansari. (That Verse was): 'Among the Believers are men who have been true in their covenant with Allah.' (33.23)

The different dialect don’t negate one another. This shows the difference between the Qur’an and the bible. The bible itself has nothing to do with Jesus –peace be upon him- while the precision of the Qur’an streches out to cover even the pronounciation (!)

Abu Bakr sent for me and said, "You used to write the Divine Revelations for Allah's Apostle : So you should search for (the Qur'an and collect) it." I started searching for the Qur'an till I found the last two Verses of Surat At-Tauba with Abi Khuzaima Al-Ansari and I could not find these Verses with anybody other than him. (They were):

'Verily there has come unto you an Apostle (Muhammad) from amongst yourselves. It grieves him that you should receive any injury or difficulty ...' (9.128-129)

Already adressed above.

'Not equal are those Believers who sit..", and at that time 'Amr bin Um Maktum, the blind man was sitting behind the Prophet . He said, "O Allah's Apostle! What is your order For me (as regards the above Verse) as I am a blind man?" So, instead of the above Verse, the following Verse was revealed:

'Not equal are those believers who sit (at home) except those who are disabled (by injury or are blind or lame etc.) and those who strive and fight in the cause of Allah.' (4.95)

[/] Volume 4, Book 52, Number 85:

Narrated Sahl bin Sad As-Sa'idi:

I saw Marwan bin Al-Hakam sitting in the Mosque. So I came forward and sat by his side. He told us that Zaid bin Thabit had told him that Allah's Apostle had dictated to him the Divine Verse:

"Not equal are those believers who sit (at home) and those who strive hard and fight in the Cause of Allah with their wealth and lives.' (4.95)

Zaid said, "Ibn-Maktum came to the Prophet while he was dictating to me that very Verse. On that Ibn Um Maktum said, "O Allah's Apostle! If I had power, I would surely take part in Jihad." He was a blind man. So Allah sent down revelation to His Apostle while his thigh was on mine and it became so heavy for me that I feared that my thigh would be broken. Then that state of the Prophet was over after Allah revealed "...except those who are disabled (by injury or are blind or lame etc.) (4.95)[/I]

…’Nuff said.

Allah's Apostle said, "Gabriel recited the Qur'an to me in one way. Then I requested him (to read it in another way), and continued asking him to recite it in other ways, and he recited it in several ways till he ultimately recited it in seven different ways."

This explains Uthman’s tackling of the pronounciation issue. Also the different pronounciations were later on very usefull in properly understanding the Qur’an.

I heard Hisham bin Hakim reciting Surat Al-Furqan during the lifetime of Allah's Apostle and I listened to his recitation and noticed that he recited in several different ways which Allah's Apostle had not taught me. I was about to jump over him during his prayer, but I controlled my temper, and when he had completed his prayer, I put his upper garment around his neck and seized him by it and said, "Who taught you this Sura which I heard you reciting?" He replied, "Allah's Apostle taught it to me." I said, "You have told a lie, for Allah's Apostle has taught it to me in a different way from yours." So I dragged him to Allah's Apostle and said (to Allah's Apostle),

"I heard this person reciting Surat Al-Furqan in a way which you haven't taught me!" On that Allah's Apostle said, "Release him, (O 'Umar!) Recite, O Hisham!" Then he recited in the same way as I heard him reciting. Then Allah's Apostle said, "It was revealed in this way," and added, "Recite, O 'Umar!" I recited it as he had taught me. Allah's Apostle then said, "It was revealed in this way. This Qur'an has been revealed to be recited in seven different ways, so recite of it whichever (way) is easier for you (or read as much of it as may be easy for you)."

Already explained, and understood (I hope, but doubt)

Show me (the copy of) your Qur'an," She said, "Why?" He said, "In order to compile and arrange the Qur'an according to it, for people recite it with its Suras not in proper order." 'Aisha said, "What does it matter which part of it you read first? (Be informed) that the first thing that was revealed thereof was a Sura from Al-Mufassal, and in it was mentioned Paradise and the Fire. When the people embraced Islam, the Verses regarding legal and illegal things were revealed. If the first thing to be revealed was: 'Do not drink alcoholic drinks.' people would have said, 'We will never leave alcoholic drinks,' and if there had been revealed, 'Do not commit illegal sexual intercourse, 'they would have said, 'We will never give up illegal sexual intercourse.' While I was a young girl of playing age, the following Verse was revealed in Mecca to Muhammad: 'Nay! But the Hour is their appointed time (for their full recompense), and the Hour will be more grievous and more bitter.' (54.46)

Yeah, SO??

It serves to know that the Prophet had 48 scribes. Now most fortunately, Uthman –may Allah reward him- was there. And most fortunately he did stand where he was needed.

…2…

 

[WildBlueYonder]

Here is my earlier post:

There it says.

Samaria is an ancient town located on a hill northwest of Nabulus (Shechem) in the West Bank territory under Israeli administration since 1967. Excavations in the 1930's revealed that the site had been occupied occasionally during the late 4th millennium BCE. The city was not founded until about 880 BCE, when Omri made it the new capital of the northern Hebrew kingdom of Israel and named it Samaria. Although the northern kingdom was often stronger than Judah to the south and enjoyed greater economic development, it was crushed by Assyria in 722, and much of its population was carried into captivity. It remained the capital until its destruction by the Assyrians in 722.

If I say, as some do, that humanity originated from africa, even though africa at the time wasn't called africa my statement would still be correct.

Peace be unto you, Brother.

'Nuff said.

..3..

No, very weak arguement still, even in its 3rd go round... its "Africa" now, but would it still be true in 1000 years when it is called "A' SEE'ghe"?

'Samaritans" refers to a specific people, that originated at a specific time. The Bible and most archeologists & all ethnographers refer to "Samaritans" as a very specific people, the quran does not, because Mohammad did not know any better, he only heard the stories second hand, he could not read, so he could not see for himself or place these people in time, a people that "originated" shortly after the Assyrians did some racial mixing by forcably Israelites & people from other parts of their Empire after 722 BC, these people existed from that time, up the time of Mohammad & still exist to this day, as a small minority in Israel & Palestine. Mohammad called the unnamed man "Samaritan" in the Moses story (the Exodus was about 1440 BC), because he did know any better. Samaritans did not exist before 722BC, no matter how hard you try to "force" the issue, Mohammad didn't know, because allah didn't know, because they didn't 'know' these Samaritans personally (only by stories & legends) & now you don't know

also, what was N. America called 1000 years ago? was it "america"? if I referred to the Mayan City-states, as the cultural cream of the "american people", would I be 'technically' right, according to you? what is your expert opinion?

are you trying to to "al-taqiyya" us? wink, wink. huh?