You asked: "Do you think it impossible that a theist can perceive God, and an atheist can't?"Can you answer the question.?
To clarify my answer from above, which you seem to want spelled out: No, I do not think it impossible: a theist can perceive "God" whether God actually exists or not: if God does not exist then the "God" that the theist perceives and believes in is simply in his imagination. The perception is there and interpreted to be "God".
Perception is the interpretation that we give to what we sense. It can be fooled and is often fooled. It can be shaped by our experience, our motivation and expectations. While what we sense exists, our perception is entirely subjective and thus what we perceive might not actually exist.Yes.
If you disagree then feel free to browse the Internet for relatively simple optical illusions, where our perception can be demonstrably different to reality.
So, in summary, you are wrong; and just because you perceive God does not mean that God actually exists.
As said, you use the term in a restrictive sense not necessitated by the definitions.There is no "thing" to lack, unless it is something that ceased to exist.
It may make no sense to you but then you have always struggled with the agnostic atheist viewpoint.How can you not accept that God doesn't exist, when it is a fact that God doesn't exist at this moment, in your life.?
That makes no sense at all.
No, just because I have an absence of evidence I do not conclude that this is evidence of absence. But if you wish to keep asserting what you think my position is, I can happily drop out of the conversation entirely and let you argue with your strawman?If God existed, as far as you are aware, you would say I accept that God exists.
But your real position is, you are not aware of God's existence, hence God does not currently exist.
No, it does not mean that God does not currently exist. It means that God may exist but I just don't know.Which means God does not currently exist.
You can't escape it Sarkus. You might as well accept it.
Yet you argue as if all atheists are the same, and then in the next breath treat your own brand of atheism differently. Consistency, Jan.I don't need to think I'm atheist, my position is atheist. I am without God, whenever I forget about God.
So now you're equating an atheist to being not good and untrustworthy?Lets say we know someone who is genuinely, a good and trustworthy person. But gets tempted into doing something uncharacteristic. While committing the act, the person is, at that moment, not good and trustworthy.
The issue, though, is not with your analogy but with you arguing that "this is the way all not good and untrustworthy people behave..." (to continue the analogy) only to then say "but when I act not good and untrustworthy I am able to behave differently."
Do you not see that you are special pleading from your own arguments?
So clearly you think there IS a difference between them, rather than "nothing". Consistency, please, Jan.Nothing. God Is.
If you ask yourself that question you would say something like 'lack of evidence'.
So then the question is why do some people require evidence and some don't? And your inevitable answer of "they are without God" is a non-answer for question-begging, so please don't offer it up as your response. Come up with something that actually moves the conversation forward, if you can.
No, it is right to explore it in this thread. This thread is about atheism, and this seems to be a key difference between atheists and those that aren't atheists.Good question.
Perhaps the subject of a new thread.
So do you have an answer?
The quotation marks were not intended to suggest you had said it, just that it is a phrase in the same manner as "without God" - and in this context to be taken as meaning the opposite of "without God".I haven't mentioned anything about being with God. God Is.
No, it's really not.That's quite deep.
If God exists.You're referring to God, adequately, by putting Him in the correct position.
So are you going to actually respond to what I said with anything that moves the conversation forward?