If god were omniscient, omnipresent and omnipotent, there would be no atheists.

M

Medicine*Woman

Jesus: Mythstory--Not History!
Valued Senior Member
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M*W: If there were a god, and he had all the redeeming qualities of obviousness, no one would be an atheist. Why, then, can only christians see, hear, touch, smell, taste and feel their all-powerful, all-knowing god, but others can't?
 
Medicine*Woman said:
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M*W: If there were a god, and he had all the redeeming qualities of obviousness, no one would be an atheist. Why, then, can only christians see, hear, touch, smell, taste and feel their all-powerful, all-knowing god, but others can't?
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You mean why doesn't Jesus do what He did to Paul to you? Obviousness pertains to the person. What I mean is if someone walks into my school with bright neon green pants that would be obvious. The only way someone wouldn't be able to see is because their eyes are closed. I have never seen God, however I do see is actions. I have never heard God's voice but I have heard his teachings. I have never touched God because if I did I wouldn't let go. I have never smelled God but I imagine He smells good. I have never tasted God because I do not eat Him or plan on licking Him. I have felt Him but I don't think we mean the same. Others can not because like I said they have their eyes closed. I think He is obvious, plus I believe some would still question what they saw, touched, felt, smelled, heard, or even tasted. What I consider obvious you considered God hiding or say it is something else.

Thank you,
His son,
><>Warrior61<><
 
Medicine Woman:

You fail to mention the fact that God mayn't care to manifest himself in a theistic manner. Or, conversely, we are aware of God - as existence.
 
Medicine*Woman said:
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M*W: If there were a god, and he had all the redeeming qualities of obviousness, no one would be an atheist. Why, then, can only christians see, hear, touch, smell, taste and feel their all-powerful, all-knowing god, but others can't?
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It's a form of voluntary hypnosis...believers project their internal authority-figure onto the external symbols of faith (including their bodies) thus embuing them with 'life'.
 
Prince_James said:
Medicine Woman:

You fail to mention the fact that God mayn't care to manifest himself in a theistic manner. Or, conversely, we are aware of God - as existence.
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That sounds more like Taoism. I think it's more like the bible intended, too. I see nothing wrong or dishonest about the concept of existence as living and unified. Living, because it has a very active and ever changing quality, and unified because there are no real boundries between phenomenon.
 
spidergoat said:
That sounds more like Taoism. I think it's more like the bible intended, too. I see nothing wrong or dishonest about the concept of existence as living and unified. Living, because it has a very active and ever changing quality, and unified because there are no real boundries between phenomenon.
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Thats also reminiscent of Heideggers concept of Being-in-the-World. Taoism is an excellent basis for a philosophy of the absolute.
 
W61;1290597]You mean why doesn't Jesus do what He did to Paul to you?
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M*W: I'm not quite following you here. Are you saying what Jesus did to Paul, he should have also done to me?

There was a time when I believed, but now I realize I believed blindly what others professed to me. I thought my eyes were open, but I found out they probably never were... or... that what I thought I was seeing was just an illusion. Oh, I truly believed, alright! I made a point of teaching others... so I must've believed what I taught. I knew, felt, saw, tasted, touched, smelled god... or at least that was what I wanted others to believe! But to answer your analogy, I had my own kind of revelations of god, jesus and mary... mostly mary, because I was a young mother. I identified with her, but now I know she never existed, and jesus didn't either.

Obviousness pertains to the person. What I mean is if someone walks into my school with bright neon green pants that would be obvious. The only way someone wouldn't be able to see is because their eyes are closed.
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M*W: My eyes weren't closed, exactly. I believed overtly. I practiced my faith openly. I scorched the earth trying to convert every soul I came in touch with! Now, I'm thankful I missed some!

I have never seen God, however I do see is actions. I have never heard God's voice but I have heard his teachings. I have never touched God because if I did I wouldn't let go. I have never smelled God but I imagine He smells good. I have never tasted God because I do not eat Him or plan on licking Him. I have felt Him but I don't think we mean the same. Others can not because like I said they have their eyes closed. I think He is obvious, plus I believe some would still question what they saw, touched, felt, smelled, heard, or even tasted. What I consider obvious you considered God hiding or say it is something else.
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M*W: I must say, you are eloquent in your prose. At one time, I felt that I had seen him, heard him, touched him, ate him, drank him, smelled him, got drunk in his spirit, yada yada yada, but now, I know what I had experienced was my own delusion, and I'm forever bitter about that! Not at some supposed god out there, but at own self! I was a fool! I believed what I thought everyone else expected me to believe! For a time, I denied my own intelligence! That's what's pathetic!

I do appreciate your responding to my thread. I appreciate your input. The more I move forward, the less I believe in what I believed. How many years did I waste? And for what? For nothing! The truth is not always obvious when you see it. Sometimes it can be a conflict -- even a major conflict! Get rid of all conflict and the truth becomes clearer. That's where I am today. My future is clear. I won't put anything in to my presence unless I know it is valid. What is valid to me is that there is no god. I'm comfortable with that. I can eat, drink, taste, feel, hold, comfort, and bear that feeling, because it is real.

I'm glad you are a member of sciforums. When I came here, I believed as you believe. Sciforums has been my salvation.
 
Look. If god were obvious, there'd be no atheists. All would be well with the world, as MW says.

If god exists, yet dosen't deign to give the slightes hint of his existence, how is that different (from a human perspective) from just not existing at all?

Theists ain't got nothin'. Bags of hot air. Amateur magicians at best. Experts at deception, digression, avoidance, and self-justification.
 
All of religion boils down to one childishly rediculous concept:

The most powerful force in the cosmos, nay, the very creator of the cosmos, is so elusive that your only way to know this creature is to have faith. That is, fully understand that there is zero evidence for this creature, yet accept it more fully that anything else in your world.

How dumb is that? I mean, really? C'mon humans. Wakey, wakey.
 
Medicine*Woman said:
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M*W: If there were a god, and he had all the redeeming qualities of obviousness, no one would be an atheist. Why, then, can only christians see, hear, touch, smell, taste and feel their all-powerful, all-knowing god, but others can't?
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Maybe 'God's deranged? Running around creating universes all wacked up on Scooby snacks?
 
Medicine*Woman said:
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M*W: I'm not quite following you here. Are you saying what Jesus did to Paul, he should have also done to me?
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What would be obvious to you. I mean what is real to you.

There was a time when I believed, but now I realize I believed blindly what others professed to me. I thought my eyes were open, but I found out they probably never were... or... that what I thought I was seeing was just an illusion. Oh, I truly believed, alright! I made a point of teaching others... so I must've believed what I taught. I knew, felt, saw, tasted, touched, smelled god... or at least that was what I wanted others to believe! But to answer your analogy, I had my own kind of revelations of god, jesus and mary... mostly mary, because I was a young mother. I identified with her, but now I know she never existed, and jesus didn't either.
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LOL How do you know they didn't exist. That is your opinion. You can't prove that. Aside from that because that isn't the topic. Now there are Christians whose denomination is Catholic but then there is the religion called Catholicism. I don't believe that communion is literaly eating the body and drinking the blood of God. Again please explain how you know about Him if He doesn't exist

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M*W: My eyes weren't closed, exactly. I believed overtly. I practiced my faith openly. I scorched the earth trying to convert every soul I came in touch with! Now, I'm thankful I missed some!
Click to expand...

My opinion.

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M*W: I must say, you are eloquent in your prose. At one time, I felt that I had seen him, heard him, touched him, ate him, drank him, smelled him, got drunk in his spirit, yada yada yada, but now, I know what I had experienced was my own delusion, and I'm forever bitter about that! Not at some supposed god out there, but at own self! I was a fool! I believed what I thought everyone else expected me to believe! For a time, I denied my own intelligence! That's what's pathetic!
Click to expand...

Thank you. Planing on writing a book. I am sorry for your trial that you went through and deeply upset on your conversion to atheism. Can I ask what you believed?

I do appreciate your responding to my thread. I appreciate your input. The more I move forward, the less I believe in what I believed. How many years did I waste? And for what? For nothing! The truth is not always obvious when you see it. Sometimes it can be a conflict -- even a major conflict! Get rid of all conflict and the truth becomes clearer. That's where I am today. My future is clear. I won't put anything in to my presence unless I know it is valid. What is valid to me is that there is no god. I'm comfortable with that. I can eat, drink, taste, feel, hold, comfort, and bear that feeling, because it is real.

I'm glad you are a member of sciforums. When I came here, I believed as you believe. Sciforums has been my salvation.
Click to expand...

I don't know if you believed as I did. Oh yea I am kinda upset for you not responding to my post on my thread, so can I ask Why?

Thank you,
His son,
><>Warrior61<><
 
superluminal said:
Look. If god were obvious, there'd be no atheists. All would be well with the world, as MW says.

If god exists, yet dosen't deign to give the slightes hint of his existence, how is that different (from a human perspective) from just not existing at all?

Theists ain't got nothin'. Bags of hot air. Amateur magicians at best. Experts at deception, digression, avoidance, and self-justification.
Click to expand...

Holy crap. I'm a magician. Woop Woop.

No evidence you say. Really?
 
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M*W: Wow! Thanks, guys! I've finally touched a nerve! Bags 'o hot air! Yes! There is no return to insanity.
 
Warrior61 said:
I have never tasted God because I do not eat Him or plan on licking Him.
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Obviously not a Roman Catholic then?

If you have never seen, smelled, heard, tasted etc God directly - how can you differentiate between what you perceive of as God's works / words and the works of, say, humanity as a whole?

Why do you ascribe the "teachings" to God and not merely to someone who bothered to write down some fairly common-sense things?

Why do you see God's "actions" in things rather than just the workings of the Universe in accordance with the few laws it has?

Why is it obviously God to you, and to someone else obviously not?

How do you know it is your eyes that are truly open, and not yours that are actually closed to the truth of the matter?
An atheist could quite happily say that your eyes have been closed by the indoctrination you have received from birth - either consciously or sub-consciously - and that you are thus blinded to reality by placing this idea of God where mere wonderment should be.
 
Medicine*Woman said:
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M*W: If there were a god, and he had all the redeeming qualities of obviousness, no one would be an atheist. Why, then, can only christians see, hear, touch, smell, taste and feel their all-powerful, all-knowing god, but others can't?
Click to expand...
Because we can't see, hear, touch, smell, taste or feel Him in any tangible way. While you seem to think that we can, and because you can't then you think that you are different than us, and that God that we believe in is fictional. If you let go of the predefined ideas you have of us and God then perhaps you see that we aren't that different and that there are ways for everyone to believe what we do, not because there is evidence for it, but because it's good for you, as it is good for us.
 
Cyperium said:
If you let go of the predefined ideas you have of us and God then perhaps you see that we aren't that different and that there are ways for everyone to believe what we do, not because there is evidence for it, but because it's good for you, as it is good for us.
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How is an irrational belief "good for me"?
How does it give me anything that I either need or want that I can't get from my position of non-belief?

I can see how the community aspect of religions can help those that need a sense of community - but that can be achieved through other non-religious activities.
 
superluminal said:
All of religion boils down to one childishly rediculous concept:

The most powerful force in the cosmos, nay, the very creator of the cosmos, is so elusive that your only way to know this creature is to have faith. That is, fully understand that there is zero evidence for this creature, yet accept it more fully that anything else in your world.

How dumb is that? I mean, really? C'mon humans. Wakey, wakey.
Click to expand...

You de man!
 
Medicine*Woman said:
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M*W: If there were a god, and he had all the redeeming qualities of obviousness, no one would be an atheist. Why, then, can only christians see, hear, touch, smell, taste and feel their all-powerful, all-knowing god, but others can't?
Click to expand...

Not necessarily...it all depends on how define those qualities (omniscient, omnipresent, omnipotent).....God would then not want anyone to have free-will according to you....
 
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