ok so the other day I noticed my 6 year old brother talking about god and we never go to church and he goes to a public school and he still seemed to know a lot about it. How are atheist supposed to rasie there children in a religious society with all this other crap around. all the pressure that will be put on atheist when growing up. do yall ever think religion will ever go away. a lot of non religious people think that you need religion to teach morals which you dont.
how to rasie atheist children.
- Thread starter yumyum
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yumyum, lay off the crack. Please. I'm begging on my knees now.
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There is no god, afterlife or divine love. There is only Entropy, the mother from which we were all born. She tugs our souls with the beautiful, maternal love of chaos. Why do you keep Her waiting?
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There is no god, afterlife or divine love. There is only Entropy, the mother from which we were all born. She tugs our souls with the beautiful, maternal love of chaos. Why do you keep Her waiting?
*gasps in horror* You're all on crack! NOOOOOOO!!!!!
Do you think contemplating if religion will ever go away anything more than a topic for LSD addicts? Does it matter? Is it worthy of discussion?
__________________________________________
There is no god, afterlife or divine love. There is only Entropy, the mother from which we were all born. She tugs our souls with the beautiful, maternal love of chaos. Why do you keep Her waiting?
Do you think contemplating if religion will ever go away anything more than a topic for LSD addicts? Does it matter? Is it worthy of discussion?
__________________________________________
There is no god, afterlife or divine love. There is only Entropy, the mother from which we were all born. She tugs our souls with the beautiful, maternal love of chaos. Why do you keep Her waiting?
Your six your old brother knew about the christian god? Good. That's a good age to start learning the world. Perhaps a little too young, but about hte age that I believe kids should start being exposed to world cultures (about 8 is where I see it, though 10 is acceptable it may be too old).
See this is an opportunity to explore the issue. Open it up for genuine discussion. Perhaps even provide a bible (I’m assuming this is a Christina exposure), one of the Good News variations or a children’s bible. These use very clear and simplistic English. Used in an objective manner the bible is one of the biggest aids to atheism.
Point out the issues and explain your own opinions and let them explore.
Providing they are not being indoctrinated by a charismatic evangelist, then exposing them early to these issues will enable them to be prepared before they meet the snake-oil salesmen.
The biggest danger to any child is the repeated and frequent exposure to religious propaganda and indoctrination.
It is far better to give them a balanced view and teach them how to evaluate the issues for themselves.
What you should never do is command them not to listen to such stuff, or imply that it is bad. Don’t teach bigotry or hate but teach them how to think. If you do your job well then they will come to the correct conclusions by themselves, and that has infinitely more value than them having been TOLD what to think, by you or a priest.
Point out the issues and explain your own opinions and let them explore.
Providing they are not being indoctrinated by a charismatic evangelist, then exposing them early to these issues will enable them to be prepared before they meet the snake-oil salesmen.
The biggest danger to any child is the repeated and frequent exposure to religious propaganda and indoctrination.
It is far better to give them a balanced view and teach them how to evaluate the issues for themselves.
What you should never do is command them not to listen to such stuff, or imply that it is bad. Don’t teach bigotry or hate but teach them how to think. If you do your job well then they will come to the correct conclusions by themselves, and that has infinitely more value than them having been TOLD what to think, by you or a priest.
That seems a bit closed minded...
How do we raise atheist children if the kids keep learning about god?
I don't think parents are supposed to mold their kids; they are supposed to teach the kids how to mold themselves. By blinding them to religious ideas, you are stunting their intellectual growth.
Let them see both sides of an issue and decide for themselves.
How do we raise atheist children if the kids keep learning about god?
I don't think parents are supposed to mold their kids; they are supposed to teach the kids how to mold themselves. By blinding them to religious ideas, you are stunting their intellectual growth.
Let them see both sides of an issue and decide for themselves.
yep.
I know that its better to leave people epesically kids to come up with the ideas on there own but I dont want him to grow beliving in something so irrational id reather him have an open mind but I guess exposer to all this stuff is the best way.
*breaks down and weeps in relief*
Oh so you weren't on crack. Good.
Now as for raising the kid part, now that's a bone worth picking. I'd definitely say, show him both sides of the issue. Show him logic, and show him faith. Let him choose one. Or two.
__________________________________________
There is no god, afterlife or divine love. There is only Entropy, the mother from which we were all born. She tugs our souls with the beautiful, maternal love of chaos. Why do you keep Her waiting?
Oh so you weren't on crack. Good.
Now as for raising the kid part, now that's a bone worth picking. I'd definitely say, show him both sides of the issue. Show him logic, and show him faith. Let him choose one. Or two.
__________________________________________
There is no god, afterlife or divine love. There is only Entropy, the mother from which we were all born. She tugs our souls with the beautiful, maternal love of chaos. Why do you keep Her waiting?
I was raised entirely without religion. If at any time I was curious about the christian god, Buddha, Shiva, or any other fairytale, my parents took me to Frankston Library to find books on the subjects. I never experienced any peer pressure or teasing about it. The very first time anyone ever gave a damn was when I first got on the internet and people from the USA and undeveloped south east Asian nations went nuts at me for being ungodly. :/
I guess Australia is much different to America though, in some matters.
I guess Australia is much different to America though, in some matters.
I was intentionally brought up without being told "see, honey, that's why theists are all crackpots!" or "see, honey, that's why our family believes in god!"
My first real religious experience was when my saintly mother put me in a presbyterian preschool because it was just down the street. Big mistake. For the most part it was good, but they talked about god every day, and since they just assumed all the students were Christian, they made me think I was a Christian. The existance of a god was presented to me as a fact. (I remember when the kids were talking about what church they went to, I didn't know which one I went to, so I said I didn't know lol.)
I knew about other people's religious beliefs. Of course, being far ahead of my chronological age, I began to get curious about how the world was started. And of course, to me, the Big Bang theory and evolution seem quite a bit more plausible than "we're created by this all-powerful guy", which sounded to me like a passage one might take from a fairytale.
When I was growing up, I celebrated Christmas and Hannukah. Christmas was 100% without religious connotations except for what they taught me in preschool and the star on top of the tree. Hannukah had some religious overtones because it's almost impossible to celebrate it without them, for example we said prayers in Hebrew and English (archaic modern English, so I didn't really understand it)
barukh ata adonai
elohainu melekhaolom
asher kidishanu ba'mitsvosov
vsti vanu lahadlikner shel hannuka (lol. that's a little messy)
and then we'd say the English translation,
blessed art thou
o lord our god
king of the universe
who kindled these hannukah lights (or something like that).
You see, my mom was brought up Jewish (she thinks her parents didn't believe, but wanted their kids to), and my dad was brought up Christian (he's not sure about his parents), but they both don't believe. My mom likes to say she's agnostic, but when I told her the distinction between a weak atheist and a strong, she decided she better fit a weak atheist than an agnostic. I'd say my dad is a strong atheist, now that I'm older we talk about religious people and how most of them are just spoon-fed what they believe and never think about it.
But if you want your children to be atheists, but you want them really to choose for themselves, the best way is to bring them up as very intelligent children, and when they are exposed you can talk to them about it from a neutral point of view. Of course, if you really want to tell them all the stuff that's wrong with the bible, go to the skeptic's annotated bible. But a better idea is saying, "you see, some people believe that the universe was created by a creature that is infinitely powerful, infinitely intelligent, and is inside of everything. some other people believe that the earth has always existed. just like some people have friends that other people think aren't there."
Err... that didn't come out right. lol. nevermind.
My first real religious experience was when my saintly mother put me in a presbyterian preschool because it was just down the street. Big mistake. For the most part it was good, but they talked about god every day, and since they just assumed all the students were Christian, they made me think I was a Christian. The existance of a god was presented to me as a fact. (I remember when the kids were talking about what church they went to, I didn't know which one I went to, so I said I didn't know lol.)
I knew about other people's religious beliefs. Of course, being far ahead of my chronological age, I began to get curious about how the world was started. And of course, to me, the Big Bang theory and evolution seem quite a bit more plausible than "we're created by this all-powerful guy", which sounded to me like a passage one might take from a fairytale.
When I was growing up, I celebrated Christmas and Hannukah. Christmas was 100% without religious connotations except for what they taught me in preschool and the star on top of the tree. Hannukah had some religious overtones because it's almost impossible to celebrate it without them, for example we said prayers in Hebrew and English (archaic modern English, so I didn't really understand it)
barukh ata adonai
elohainu melekhaolom
asher kidishanu ba'mitsvosov
vsti vanu lahadlikner shel hannuka (lol. that's a little messy)
and then we'd say the English translation,
blessed art thou
o lord our god
king of the universe
who kindled these hannukah lights (or something like that).
You see, my mom was brought up Jewish (she thinks her parents didn't believe, but wanted their kids to), and my dad was brought up Christian (he's not sure about his parents), but they both don't believe. My mom likes to say she's agnostic, but when I told her the distinction between a weak atheist and a strong, she decided she better fit a weak atheist than an agnostic. I'd say my dad is a strong atheist, now that I'm older we talk about religious people and how most of them are just spoon-fed what they believe and never think about it.
But if you want your children to be atheists, but you want them really to choose for themselves, the best way is to bring them up as very intelligent children, and when they are exposed you can talk to them about it from a neutral point of view. Of course, if you really want to tell them all the stuff that's wrong with the bible, go to the skeptic's annotated bible. But a better idea is saying, "you see, some people believe that the universe was created by a creature that is infinitely powerful, infinitely intelligent, and is inside of everything. some other people believe that the earth has always existed. just like some people have friends that other people think aren't there."
Err... that didn't come out right. lol. nevermind.
jesus comicbook
i was supposedly a catholic. My parents went around under the same label, but never went to church...
my school was catholic. bible stories with christmas and stuff...
one time we were given a comic about some bible story featuring jesus doing all his miracles and stuff. At that point in my life I was quite artistic together with my friends and would add stufff ourselves to comic books. Usually this entailed arrows, knives, guns and lots of blood. We did the same with the jesus comic book of course. The next day the teacher was extremely angry with us. Apparently teachers go through your stuff after school and check up on you. Naturally they found jesus pierced with arrows with stream of gushing blood. Apparently we had done a horrible deed. All I could remember was that I was thinking " what is all this fuzz about...it is just a frikking comic book."
I guess religion is not innate to humans. Some people are just susceptible to it. You know them...the ones that can't live without some kind of authority controling them, telling then what to do, how to live, how to be happy, what to think. It must be great...
wonderful
edit: it would be difficult i guess to tell your child that religion is for the weak, since they usually do the opposite of what you want them to do. Who cares anyway...everybody is responsible for their own actions.
i was supposedly a catholic. My parents went around under the same label, but never went to church...
my school was catholic. bible stories with christmas and stuff...
one time we were given a comic about some bible story featuring jesus doing all his miracles and stuff. At that point in my life I was quite artistic together with my friends and would add stufff ourselves to comic books. Usually this entailed arrows, knives, guns and lots of blood. We did the same with the jesus comic book of course. The next day the teacher was extremely angry with us. Apparently teachers go through your stuff after school and check up on you. Naturally they found jesus pierced with arrows with stream of gushing blood. Apparently we had done a horrible deed. All I could remember was that I was thinking " what is all this fuzz about...it is just a frikking comic book."
I guess religion is not innate to humans. Some people are just susceptible to it. You know them...the ones that can't live without some kind of authority controling them, telling then what to do, how to live, how to be happy, what to think. It must be great...
wonderful
edit: it would be difficult i guess to tell your child that religion is for the weak, since they usually do the opposite of what you want them to do. Who cares anyway...everybody is responsible for their own actions.
Matter of priorities
Depends on whether the question is how to program a child to be an atheist. I'm all for protecting kids from theistic threats and blackmail, but to program an atheist is no different than programming a Communist, a Republican, or a Catholic. I think the anti-identification of atheism may be out of hand when people are looking to program children.
To the other, one of the problems you'll find in socialization among children is the need for conformity and selection. What an atheist needs to do is to give a child a vocabulary that is capable of discussing ideas without resorting to God.
Furthermore, how important is it to create division between people good 'n' early? Maybe you could hand out flyers at Baby GAP.
It's all idealistic, but I just took heat for months while losing a fight to give my daughter a name nobody else in her class would have. Conformity is just that important to some people. I mean, if something as fundamental as a name should be subject to conformist ideology, I doubt the atheist parent has much hope.
In such an instance, I point back to one of my very common criticisms of just about any philosophical identification that holds itself in the comparative with another: Is it enough to be "just as good as" the people one criticizes, or does criticism and negativity invite the obligation of transcension?
In other words, is it about a label--atheism--or about creating the ideas necessary to transcend the petty needs of religious ideology? If the former, then it really doesn't matter. That is, if one is going to teach selective rejection, they will be in distinguished company among Christians, Muslims, Socialists, Republicans (GOP), Democrats (DNP) and others who teach that their label is more important than the ideas represented.
Take "gangsta style" as a comparison: Would it be offensive to someone if the child flashed a sign and said, "I'll be chillin' with the O.G."? And what would one do then? Denounce blacks? Denounce "gangstas"? Or perhaps offer a more coherent and useful method of expression?
If a parent tries too hard to cause any one result, they will generally get the exact opposite. Hell, my dad thought he was teaching me to despise Communism. That "they want to give everyone a home and a job" was intended to be a bad thing ... well, I missed it. And today I'm bleeding leftist.
Heck, look at the Drug War for another example.
thanx,
Tiassa
Depends on whether the question is how to program a child to be an atheist. I'm all for protecting kids from theistic threats and blackmail, but to program an atheist is no different than programming a Communist, a Republican, or a Catholic. I think the anti-identification of atheism may be out of hand when people are looking to program children.
To the other, one of the problems you'll find in socialization among children is the need for conformity and selection. What an atheist needs to do is to give a child a vocabulary that is capable of discussing ideas without resorting to God.
Furthermore, how important is it to create division between people good 'n' early? Maybe you could hand out flyers at Baby GAP.
It's all idealistic, but I just took heat for months while losing a fight to give my daughter a name nobody else in her class would have. Conformity is just that important to some people. I mean, if something as fundamental as a name should be subject to conformist ideology, I doubt the atheist parent has much hope.
In such an instance, I point back to one of my very common criticisms of just about any philosophical identification that holds itself in the comparative with another: Is it enough to be "just as good as" the people one criticizes, or does criticism and negativity invite the obligation of transcension?
In other words, is it about a label--atheism--or about creating the ideas necessary to transcend the petty needs of religious ideology? If the former, then it really doesn't matter. That is, if one is going to teach selective rejection, they will be in distinguished company among Christians, Muslims, Socialists, Republicans (GOP), Democrats (DNP) and others who teach that their label is more important than the ideas represented.
Take "gangsta style" as a comparison: Would it be offensive to someone if the child flashed a sign and said, "I'll be chillin' with the O.G."? And what would one do then? Denounce blacks? Denounce "gangstas"? Or perhaps offer a more coherent and useful method of expression?
If a parent tries too hard to cause any one result, they will generally get the exact opposite. Hell, my dad thought he was teaching me to despise Communism. That "they want to give everyone a home and a job" was intended to be a bad thing ... well, I missed it. And today I'm bleeding leftist.
Heck, look at the Drug War for another example.
thanx,
Tiassa
Oh yes, I love JEwish food. I had some of those whatdoyoucallit pancake things, and also some matzos...they really know their snacks. Love em. I happen to have quite a few Jewish friends, and they're in my classes, so we decided to use one of their jewish holidays as an excuse to have a party during class. He he he.
As for raising a kid neutrally...it would be insanely hard to do that, since much of your lifestyle will be affected by your viewpoint. You would still be sending non-verbal messages about religion to your kids. Kids notice a lot.
__________________________________________
There is no god, afterlife or divine love. There is only Entropy, the mother from which we were all born. She tugs our souls with the beautiful, maternal love of chaos. Why do you keep Her waiting?
As for raising a kid neutrally...it would be insanely hard to do that, since much of your lifestyle will be affected by your viewpoint. You would still be sending non-verbal messages about religion to your kids. Kids notice a lot.
__________________________________________
There is no god, afterlife or divine love. There is only Entropy, the mother from which we were all born. She tugs our souls with the beautiful, maternal love of chaos. Why do you keep Her waiting?
I live in an area where all the descent schools are catholic schools. The public schools are pure crap. I am either going to have to move or send my child to a catholic school in 6 yrs or so.
This sucks because I love my neighborhood. I do not think catholic school would be that bad, I am prepared to talk about whatever they throw.
Does anyone have experience with catholic schools? Do they make the children pray or anything like that?
This sucks because I love my neighborhood. I do not think catholic school would be that bad, I am prepared to talk about whatever they throw.
Does anyone have experience with catholic schools? Do they make the children pray or anything like that?
I'm athiest and this is how I plan on raising my kids. I will make it known that I do not believe in a God or any religions so the child knows that's ok in this world. But I'd also inform him/her on all religions. Buddhism, Taoism, Christianity, etc... Let the child make its own decision, knowing especially that the first decision s/he makes probably won't stick, the child will probably experiment. In the end, no matter what s/he decides, I will encourage them to use it to further their wisdom and find a place in this world.