-Demosthenes-
Registered Member
Do you think all or part of the Bible is true? What's wrong with it? What stories seem to have problems with them? How do you explain it?
How do you explain the Bible?
- Thread starter -Demosthenes-
- Start date
If I wrote a book of fiction about Los Angeles and used real street names and mention real politicians would that make my book non-fiction? The bible is a conglamaration of myth,hearsay,testemonials,real events,real people all woven together to make it appear that it's a non-fictional documentery. It's attempt to appear god inspired fails due to too many contradictions.
-Demosthenes-
Registered Member
interesting.
I think its mostly true. True when it was writen but some lost in the many translations.
I think its mostly true. True when it was writen but some lost in the many translations.
The translations haven't been too bad. Modern versions of the bible match portions of the Dead Sea Scrolls pretty closely, I think.
The bible is a collection of stories and myths. It is part historical record, but that is not its reason for existence.
The bible is a collection of stories and myths. It is part historical record, but that is not its reason for existence.
ConsequentAtheist
Registered Senior Member
Is this a case of wishful thinking, or do you have reason(s) for thinking this?-Demosthenes- said:
Barkhorn1x
Registered Senior Member
-Demosthenes- said:
Are you conciuously using one of the more common apologist excuses???
Barkhorn.
P. M. Thorne
Registered Senior Member
Marcus J. Borg wrote a book that some may find interesting, called:
TAKING THE BIBLE SERIOUSLY BUT NOT LITERALLY; READING THE BIBLE AGAIN FOR THE FIRST TIME.
As for the old Testament, Spinoza gave some very clear explanations and pointed out obvious errors therein, in his Theologico-Political Treatise, which may be found in Volume I of SPINOZA'S CHIEF WORKS by ELWES.
Of course, there are errors. There are errors in almost any historical recordings or anything else man touches.
PMT
TAKING THE BIBLE SERIOUSLY BUT NOT LITERALLY; READING THE BIBLE AGAIN FOR THE FIRST TIME.
As for the old Testament, Spinoza gave some very clear explanations and pointed out obvious errors therein, in his Theologico-Political Treatise, which may be found in Volume I of SPINOZA'S CHIEF WORKS by ELWES.
Of course, there are errors. There are errors in almost any historical recordings or anything else man touches.
PMT
Q: If every story in the Bible is not meant to be literal truth, how do you decide which ones are?, How do you know if ANY of it is?
How do you know what is true and what is parable?
-------------------------------------------------
Many have made their best guesses and put their own interpretations to it in the past, some were close in some areas and some were not. But God's Word is of no privite interpration. "Word" in the Greek means two different things - "Rhema" is the "letter of the word", and "Logos" is the thought or true meaning of the word". One word can have many differnt meanings. The author of the bible "God" who wrote it by the prophets, is the only one who can correctly interpret it.
God is a manifestion of the promises made in His word, in that effect, God is the Word. (1 John 1:1-14). The whole bible is the revelation of Jesus Christ. Just as God has chosen to hide Himself from the "world", He has also chosen to hide the meaning of His Word from the "world", so He can reveal it to whom He will in a time and place of His own chosing. In John 6:44, Jesus said: "No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him". Only those He has chosen to see, will, and the rest will not. What I'm about to tell you is profound and startling, but it is the truth. I'm not responcible for making anyone believe it, thats up to Him. The bible has been a locked, or "sealed" book, the complete revelation of which has been witheld until the last days. (Dan 12:9-10). Rev. 10:1-7 says the "book " will remain sealed until Christ returns with the book in His hand open, and in the "days of the voice of the seventh angel" the mysteries of God should be finished. Also read Hebrews 10:7, it says behold I come in the volume of the Book.
Every verse, every line speaks of Him...
The Jews missed their day of "visitation", 2000 years ago, because they mis-interpreted the scriptures' meaning, by confusing prophecies of Christ first and second comings. They thought He was coming to set up His kingdom, and missed His coming as the sacrifice. The "Gentiles" today and their organized religions have also missed, and are missing their "day of visitation". Mis-interpreting the scriptures, they have confused the people about how Christ has promised to return in His second coming. What was promised to the Gentiles was the "revelation of the Son of Man". Luke 17:26 " And as it was in the days of Noe, so shall it be also in the days of the Son of man." Luke 17:30 "Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed." Jesus refered to himself when he was here as the "Son of Man:, it is the title of an office, when God uses a prophet to reveal Himself to the people. John 6:53 "Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, ye have no life in you." The Word itself seperates those who beleive from those who do not. He didn't explain it. Some said: "This is an hard saying; who can hear it?" and in John chapter 6:66 ( notice the numbers here) "From that time many of his disciples went back, and walked no more with him". Others chose to stay even though they didn't understand, because they believed he was "The Christ".
Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today and forever.
He has come back and revealed Himself to this generation as the Son of Man, just as the bible promised would happen in Amos 3:7, Rev 10:7, Mal.4:5-6..........Mal. 3 was John the baptist's ministry, Mal 4 was to be revealed to the Gentiles, just before the end of the world, when "it shall burn as an oven".
The "Churches" saw this fullfilled 40 years ago, Christ revealing Himself as from heaven as the "Son of Man", the "Word" the thats been sealed through the ages revealed at last through the mouthpeice of a major prophet, a seer such as were the old testament prophets were..... with all the signs, wonders, and miracles the world has not seen since the days Jesus Christ walked the earth. The disernment of the thoughts and intents of the heart, that only God could know, was displayed thousands of times without one single error. But as it was in Jesus first ministry, the miracles were not merely done for show, it was to attract the peoples attention, then after God had vindicated His messenger, He sat down to teach them doctrine.
But see...just as it was in the first coming, He had no praise for these "churches" - the christian denominations, He had only rebuke for them for teaching their creeds and traditions, which makes His word of none effect to the people. So....they rejected Him.
They rejected the prophet He sent with His message, after they all admited this messinger was truly a prophet of God.
They (these churches, the organizations) have now had a space of about 40 years to repent. They won't admit they were wrong...the preachers who do and have are thrown out.
Read Rev.18: 1-4..."Come out of Her my people"
This all happened 40 years ago, fulfilling prophcey thats been laying in the Book for 2000 years.
It may be later than you think.
How do you know what is true and what is parable?
-------------------------------------------------
Many have made their best guesses and put their own interpretations to it in the past, some were close in some areas and some were not. But God's Word is of no privite interpration. "Word" in the Greek means two different things - "Rhema" is the "letter of the word", and "Logos" is the thought or true meaning of the word". One word can have many differnt meanings. The author of the bible "God" who wrote it by the prophets, is the only one who can correctly interpret it.
God is a manifestion of the promises made in His word, in that effect, God is the Word. (1 John 1:1-14). The whole bible is the revelation of Jesus Christ. Just as God has chosen to hide Himself from the "world", He has also chosen to hide the meaning of His Word from the "world", so He can reveal it to whom He will in a time and place of His own chosing. In John 6:44, Jesus said: "No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him". Only those He has chosen to see, will, and the rest will not. What I'm about to tell you is profound and startling, but it is the truth. I'm not responcible for making anyone believe it, thats up to Him. The bible has been a locked, or "sealed" book, the complete revelation of which has been witheld until the last days. (Dan 12:9-10). Rev. 10:1-7 says the "book " will remain sealed until Christ returns with the book in His hand open, and in the "days of the voice of the seventh angel" the mysteries of God should be finished. Also read Hebrews 10:7, it says behold I come in the volume of the Book.
Every verse, every line speaks of Him...
The Jews missed their day of "visitation", 2000 years ago, because they mis-interpreted the scriptures' meaning, by confusing prophecies of Christ first and second comings. They thought He was coming to set up His kingdom, and missed His coming as the sacrifice. The "Gentiles" today and their organized religions have also missed, and are missing their "day of visitation". Mis-interpreting the scriptures, they have confused the people about how Christ has promised to return in His second coming. What was promised to the Gentiles was the "revelation of the Son of Man". Luke 17:26 " And as it was in the days of Noe, so shall it be also in the days of the Son of man." Luke 17:30 "Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed." Jesus refered to himself when he was here as the "Son of Man:, it is the title of an office, when God uses a prophet to reveal Himself to the people. John 6:53 "Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, ye have no life in you." The Word itself seperates those who beleive from those who do not. He didn't explain it. Some said: "This is an hard saying; who can hear it?" and in John chapter 6:66 ( notice the numbers here) "From that time many of his disciples went back, and walked no more with him". Others chose to stay even though they didn't understand, because they believed he was "The Christ".
Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today and forever.
He has come back and revealed Himself to this generation as the Son of Man, just as the bible promised would happen in Amos 3:7, Rev 10:7, Mal.4:5-6..........Mal. 3 was John the baptist's ministry, Mal 4 was to be revealed to the Gentiles, just before the end of the world, when "it shall burn as an oven".
The "Churches" saw this fullfilled 40 years ago, Christ revealing Himself as from heaven as the "Son of Man", the "Word" the thats been sealed through the ages revealed at last through the mouthpeice of a major prophet, a seer such as were the old testament prophets were..... with all the signs, wonders, and miracles the world has not seen since the days Jesus Christ walked the earth. The disernment of the thoughts and intents of the heart, that only God could know, was displayed thousands of times without one single error. But as it was in Jesus first ministry, the miracles were not merely done for show, it was to attract the peoples attention, then after God had vindicated His messenger, He sat down to teach them doctrine.
But see...just as it was in the first coming, He had no praise for these "churches" - the christian denominations, He had only rebuke for them for teaching their creeds and traditions, which makes His word of none effect to the people. So....they rejected Him.
They rejected the prophet He sent with His message, after they all admited this messinger was truly a prophet of God.
They (these churches, the organizations) have now had a space of about 40 years to repent. They won't admit they were wrong...the preachers who do and have are thrown out.
Read Rev.18: 1-4..."Come out of Her my people"
This all happened 40 years ago, fulfilling prophcey thats been laying in the Book for 2000 years.
It may be later than you think.
Last edited:
Barkhorn1x
Registered Senior Member
Oh great - so God is playing with my head???
No, actually it's 12:36pm EST - you poor deluded fool.
Barkhorn.
Demosthenes
Awesome name. Good choice for forums... You would think more people would have chosen it and Locke.
Eh... to make this post matter:
The torah is a collection of stories, much like the Odyssey. Personally, I don't see why more people don't believe in the Odyssey than the torah. Now, these stories have the god-element in them... which is amazingly similar to older religions... Judaism is thousands of years old... but some eastern religions are older and have similar theologies...
The New Testament... shit. that was just a collection of stories with excessive embellishments that have spawned very, very bad things over the years... inquisition, crusades, Al Sharpton, KKK, imperialism, slavery... things of that nature.
Blame Roman Emperor Constantine for that one. Ha, what a flub.
By the way, I see religion as a joke. A big world-wide prank that the forefathers of all these nations felt like playing on the future. Haha. Slight hyperbole, but still... It is absurd if you start thinking and rid yourself of self-righteousness for a few minutes.
That's all.
Awesome name. Good choice for forums... You would think more people would have chosen it and Locke.
Eh... to make this post matter:
The torah is a collection of stories, much like the Odyssey. Personally, I don't see why more people don't believe in the Odyssey than the torah. Now, these stories have the god-element in them... which is amazingly similar to older religions... Judaism is thousands of years old... but some eastern religions are older and have similar theologies...
The New Testament... shit. that was just a collection of stories with excessive embellishments that have spawned very, very bad things over the years... inquisition, crusades, Al Sharpton, KKK, imperialism, slavery... things of that nature.
Blame Roman Emperor Constantine for that one. Ha, what a flub.
By the way, I see religion as a joke. A big world-wide prank that the forefathers of all these nations felt like playing on the future. Haha. Slight hyperbole, but still... It is absurd if you start thinking and rid yourself of self-righteousness for a few minutes.
That's all.
P. M. Thorne
Registered Senior Member
ELLIMIST: You are so wise. How do you ever manage to stay earthbound?
PMT
PMT
Jesus condemned his country’s leaders for having turned their government into a “religion”. As for the bible, I may point out that over 2200 years ago it was asked of a man to answer these questions and if he could then he would be able to start to understand some of his creators intelligence.
Weigh for me fire?
Measure for me a blast of wind?
Bring back for me a day that has passed?
Today we can answer.
BTU’s British thermal units.
Anemometer.
We have many ways of visually recording and play back today.
The bible is not about religion, but has been religionized by those that weren’t as knowledgeable as we are today to be able to understand what it was really all about. And most still are incapable of reading it for what it says and not what they are told it says.
Ellimist, don’t be so hasty to condemn what you don’t understand. And that goes for all of you. The bible didn’t do all those bad things, people did, the bible condemns such that do.
Weigh for me fire?
Measure for me a blast of wind?
Bring back for me a day that has passed?
Today we can answer.
BTU’s British thermal units.
Anemometer.
We have many ways of visually recording and play back today.
The bible is not about religion, but has been religionized by those that weren’t as knowledgeable as we are today to be able to understand what it was really all about. And most still are incapable of reading it for what it says and not what they are told it says.
Ellimist, don’t be so hasty to condemn what you don’t understand. And that goes for all of you. The bible didn’t do all those bad things, people did, the bible condemns such that do.
P. M. Thorne
Registered Senior Member
Ellimist writes: A strong cup of humble tea in the morning.
Okay, glad to see that you do not take yourself too seriously. You had me worried!
Best wishes, and the next time I will remember to laugh.
PMT
Okay, glad to see that you do not take yourself too seriously. You had me worried!
Best wishes, and the next time I will remember to laugh.
PMT
The bible is true to those who understand it's history, it's meaning, it's significance, and it's purpose. If you don't know what the bible is... if you don't see it for what it is... if you don't read it for what it is... it'll all be a load of crap. If you read the bible as an adult with childlike naiivity of course it'll seem like a storybook.... and just a note... a 'just a story book' may contain truth in it anyway. Smart choice lads. That choice, particularly, does not address its legitimacy.
That choice, particularly, does not address its legitimacy.
I think the bible is a dim reflection of true events, distorted way before they were written through re-telling, wishfull thinking, and psychological weakness. It is an incomplete collection of ancient stories, further warped by being handpicked for their moral lessons, and compatability with the status-quo power structure of the time. It is entirely possible that not a single disciple (except perhaps Judas) really understood Jesus's teaching, which was profound and subtle enough to peek through the cloud of distortions that surround them.