God, truth, us and the rest.

[Jan Ardena]

Originally posted by A4Ever
Jan, thank you for saving my thread from disappearing on the second page, never to be heard from again. I sure as hell wasn't going to save it myself.

No problemo! It has the potential to be very informative.

I do believe in the beyond. It's just that it doesn't seem to be knowable.

Why not?

I know Arjuna and his pal, but why would this story be covering any truth, any beyond?

At first glance, it does!
From there you have to try and realise the truth. The truth can only be relative.

Especialy when there are so many other stories. There is no ground to choose.

[/quote]

The stories aren't the issue, the essence is, so you need to find the essence.

I read this stuff once. It is from the Hindu tradition. You can believe this, but you can not proof this. Ah, I feel another quote coming on, a crucial one

Well tell me where in the body consciousness lies. Do you know?

Of course. Raithere, Cris et les autres sound very, very reasonable.

And they most probably are, but their views are bias.

Know that African tribe which still worships warplanes they saw flying over during world war?

Surely you can see what i wrong with that.

People make their own gods. How can you pick one?

I don't pick a god which "people" have made, there is already a Supreme Being who kindly makes His claim to His fallen children.
In all scripture there is a method on how to realise this Being. Especially in Vedic literature, it fully explains our position in this world, what we are and why we are. Modern science is now begining to understand some of these claims (although some refuse to admit it). You simply have to let go of your fear and open your mind, then you will see for yourself.
A leap of faith does not diminish your character, a good exampel is learning to ride a bicycle. When you first try, you wobble all over the place. This is not because the bike is faulty, it is because you have not let go of the fear of falling off. There is a point in that exercise when you finally let go and start to ride freely and once you are riding you realise it wasn't what you thought it was. In fact it was piss-easy and not worthy of the invested fear. A leap of faith is something like that. Science, logic or reasoning cannot teach that, it comes from within.

Why is it all so clear to you?

Because it can be observed by the individual.

What is placed opposit to this, is religion. Believing. In a book. In a story. A story which can be traced back, by antropology, to fear of nature and fear of death.

This is a nonsense idea. Religion is not about believing in a book. The book is there for one to read and understand that one needn't suffer the pangs of anxiety caused by identifying oneself with a temporal state. Fear is a product of ignorance and ignorance is born of "not knowing." The societies of the modern world are probably more fearfull now than ever before simply because they are more Godless which is why there is more suffering.
Look at what's actually happening around you, talk to ordinary people, you don't have to rely on science or logic to see the state we are in.

I mean: there's more in the bible than love your neighbour.

Love thy neighbour is an essence. If you can master that, everything else will become materable quite easily. To love thy neighbour means you love yourself and everything around you. It means that you have the virtues of a human being and not an animal. It means you will develop patience, tolerance, compassion and empathy, all in a stroke. There is nothing is science, logic or reasoning which opens that side to our nature, apart from a cold selfish ideal to ensure your special survival. That's okay, but i don't reagard it as a natural human development.

To all the people. And since Jezus was basicly human, I believe to him as well.

So you are only speculating?
This is what people do when they don't understand, and is the cause of much ignorance in both theist and atheist.
Just try and understand the whole deal by reading and communication with people, then see if you come to the same conclusion.

No, but the car is not self conscious. The human operating it, is. The energy knows itself in the man, not in the car. (for the feminist readers: the energy knows itself in the woman, not in the car)

Then the conscious (spiritual) energy is distinctive from the material (mundane) energy.
The man's body is like a car or vehicle, it cannot act without the self-conscious energy, hence there is a difference.

As long as it is strictly platonic

It is love for my fellow soul-brother/sister.
Regardless of whether they are hogs, dogs, ants etc...or human, and my temporary position.

Love

Jan Ardena.