FBI spies in U.S. Mosques?

M

mikenostic

Stop pretending you're smart!
Registered Senior Member
http://www.cnn.com/2009/US/03/20/fbi.muslim.groups/index.html
Not that I would be totally 100% against this per se, but if this is true about what the FBI is doing, is it even legal?

Ten U.S. Muslim organizations threatened this week to cease working with the FBI, citing "McCarthy-era tactics" by the agency, including efforts to covertly infiltrate California mosques.
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Uh guys, threatening to cease working with the FBI, yeah that will definitely keep them off your back and not put anymore pressure on you. :rolleyes:
 
John99 said:
yes, it is legal.
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Well if it's legal, then those Muslims aren't in much of a position to be beligerent with the FBI.
I'm not saying that what the FBI is doing isn't scheisty, but in this case the FBI does seem to have the upper hand here (especially if they keep their tactics legal).
 
Since it happens in every country under varying circumstances and since the beginning of time i would think it is legal.
 
They did it to the communists, so why should Muslims be different?
 
Well Muslims and Communists are like night and day and complete opposite sides of the spectrum. Communism is an entirely political philosophy which is also nearly entirely devoid of religious philosophy. The FBI also monitors Christian organizations, all governments monitor various groups. Some dont let them exist at all, that is the difference.
 
I don't think it is legal. It qualifies as an unreasonable search with no warrant, unless there is a specific reason to target a specific mosque.
 
A mosque is a public place. I don't think the threats to make your life a living hell are legal, but if the person is innocent they can always get a lawyer and sue the FBI for assault. Of course, if there is rendition and they get kidnapped and shipped out thats a different matter entirely.
 
S.A.M. said:
They did it to the communists, so why should Muslims be different?
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Yeah but communism while good on paper, was not so good in a practical application setting. Are you saying Islam is the same way?
 
mikenostic said:
Yeah but communism while good on paper, was not so good in a practical application setting. Are you saying Islam is the same way?
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No I mean its their modus operandi so its ludicrous to expect them to behave differently.

I don't see anything inherently wrong in gathering information from the mosques. But they would achieve more if they recruited members of the community rather than sent in non-Muslims pretending to be worshippers. The British are smarter in this regard.
 
At least there is freedom of religion. in many countries there is no freedom of religion but we cant tell them how to live their lives either because that wouldnt be right.
 
S.A.M. said:
No I mean its their modus operandi so its ludicrous to expect them to behave differently.

I don't see anything inherently wrong in gathering information from the mosques. But they would achieve more if they recruited members of the community rather than sent in non-Muslims pretending to be worshippers.
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Yeah? And what happens if the FBI tried that approach only to be met with vehemently uncooperative Muslims? The FBI will get the information they need one way or another.
Oh and you can bet your Muslim ass sam that the FBI is doing the same shit with the KKK and white supremacist groups. They will do that to any group they think has the potential to cause trouble.

The British are smarter in this regard.
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Yeah and Britain seems to be getting overrun with Islam/Muslims too.
I just don't see the U.S. letting that happen.
 
John99 said:
At least there is freedom of religion. in many countries there is no freedom of religion but we cant tell them how to live their lives either because that wouldnt be right.
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There is no freedom of religion if the FBI are spying on people in mosques.
 
spidergoat said:
There is no freedom of religion if the FBI are spying on people in mosques.
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And what if they are applying these tactics to any suspicious religious group?
If they are hammering down on any religion equally, then how can you say there is no freedom of religion?
And besides, for the most part local/national law > freedom of religion.
You can't kill someone here in the U.S. in the name of <your god> and not expect to go to jail.
 
The thing is, we have no way of knowing if the FBI was engaged in a legitimate investigation, or if they were just illegally spying on mosques just because they are mosques.
 
spidergoat said:
There is no freedom of religion if the FBI are spying on people in mosques.
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Thats like saying there is no right to food if the FBI are spying in restaurants.

The mosque is only a place for ja'maah, to get together. You can pray, hold classes, have talks.

Ideally speaking, if they want to locate an extremist, their best choice will be a mosque since it is one place you can visit 5 times a day as a matter of course, everyday all year round, without arousing suspicion.
 
I don't follow your analogy. If you are being intimidated by the FBI, you will not feel free to practice your religion. Also, extremists tend to break off from mosques, since most members aren't extreme. I heard this on an NPR story about a recent Somali suicide bomber who was active in a Minnesota mosque.
 
There is no such thing as "breaking off" from a mosque.

No one is tied down to a particular mosque, except the guy hired to take care of it.
 
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