Does organized religion destroy belief in the supernatural?
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snake river rufus
Registered Senior Member
No, organized religion is belief in the supernatural.
Supernatural: something that appears to transcend the laws of nature
Laws of nature are based on fundamental laws
fundamental laws: unexplained but testable attributes of our physical reality.
So a supernatural event is something that breaks an unexplained law.
In a nutshell, scientific reality is based mainly on probability, so long as that probability falls within that belief system.
Laws of nature are based on fundamental laws
fundamental laws: unexplained but testable attributes of our physical reality.
So a supernatural event is something that breaks an unexplained law.
In a nutshell, scientific reality is based mainly on probability, so long as that probability falls within that belief system.
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Wouldn't you say that organized religion is a very rigid set of believes that under certain sets result in supernatural actions?
... Basicly if it aint in the bible it didn't happen. The universe for example could have been created by a slightly obese elder figure but not by a mutated flying spahetti monster.
maybe you should give us a definition of the supernatural you are running with since at the moment it doesn't make sense.
I mean in what ways is a flying spaghetti monster more supernatural or more mainstream definition of god less supernatural?
.... in one way you could say that organized religion does destroy the belief in the supernatural in the sense that it offers transcendental knowledge (I mean if one is working with the idea that supernatural involves issues of ghosts, voodoo, myth etc ... at the least it doesn't seem to be a coincidence that atheists prefer to use the word supernatural rather than transcendental)
I mean in what ways is a flying spaghetti monster more supernatural or more mainstream definition of god less supernatural?
.... in one way you could say that organized religion does destroy the belief in the supernatural in the sense that it offers transcendental knowledge (I mean if one is working with the idea that supernatural involves issues of ghosts, voodoo, myth etc ... at the least it doesn't seem to be a coincidence that atheists prefer to use the word supernatural rather than transcendental)
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Simon Anders
Valued Senior Member
I can agree with this given certain definitions of the supernatural. Organized religions reduced the number of 'creatures' or 'spirits' when compared to pagan religions. They also cut down on who got to perform supernatural acts - priests only, for example - and even these were considered acts of God.
A Native American, for example, could easily have found his 'supernatural' beliefs assaulted on two sides by both religious and secular authorities.
Organized religions also to do give transcendant things and creatures and realms more value than 'here'. This also sections off a lot of the supernatural - or what rationalists call supernatural - phenomena and acts to a kind of devil controlled maya subset that is simply to be shunned, tortured to death, eliminated or avoided (by the good people).
To me theists from organized religions and atheist rationalists have, on a practical level, much more in common than they perhaps notice. And this is not a surprise, given that current secular society arose in many ways out of Middle Eastern monotheism, and a worship of transcendance (the objective mind, the transcendant deity) is an example of what ends up for the pagan being ironically similar.
snake river rufus
Registered Senior Member
Well, I'd use the word "beliefs" and I think that "supernatural actions" (oxymoron?) come only from superstition.
The FSM is just as likely to have 'created' the universe as any god.
snake river rufus
Registered Senior Member
Aethist religion? hmmm religion refers to belief in and worshop of some diety. An atheist does not believe in a diety so,,,,
Perhaps another oxymoron. :shrug:
Simon Anders
Valued Senior Member
If I ever find out you and Q live together and should really be fighting about housework or that one of you always gets to be the 'nice parent' well....gosh, I don't know what I'll do.
Thats what I used to think too, before I got the new updated atheist dictionary of revised definitions. For some reason, we Indians never considered a religious person as being an atheist. :shrug:
Perish the thought, our religious differences are too vast. He thinks he's God and I disagree.
snake river rufus
Registered Senior Member
Who published said book? Who wrote/compiled it?
It deem to me that to call atheism a religion dilutes the word religion to the point of making it meaningless.
snake river rufus
Registered Senior Member
Yeah, thats my opinion too. Its a secret dictionary which some atheists pull up on this forum now and again, when they define communism as a religion of atheists.
Oh, secret dictionary
communism is a religion of atheists I think that your leg is being pulled.snake river rufus
Registered Senior Member
It seems to me that xians only want to count their own religion as a religion. Perhaps I've been mis-informed?
I'll assume God is not considered supernatural by the religious before I start.
I think the author is implying that as the world becomes progressively more informed, organized religion may be relying less on the supernatural as a cause or explanation for certain things or events. As scientific knowledge increases and people become more accustomed to the real world and its wonders there may come a time when the supernatural will have to be pushed aside in order to maintain the flock.
In that respect then I say yes, some organized religions are tearing themselves away from the supernatural. IOW...Destroy it by not using it. However some religions appear to remain status quo and must go through a period of gradual change that may seem repulsive to even contemplate at this juncture but eventually they will come in line.