Does God wants us to know him?

Notes on the topic

• H = Hellbound Jesus H. Baldheaded Christ!

• re: Genesis--when God prepares to punish Adam and Eve, he makes references to "us", implying a collective such as angels, a heavenly court, or even the trinity as it has been variously argued. But I still don't get it: who was "us"? Angels? Heavenly court? Okay, I see God frightened of humanity. The trinity? Great. That means the Redeemer, the Son, has been around since day one and everything that happened was according to God's plan.

• Thus, I'm wondering about the puppy example. It seems to me that the puppy is further innocent because it seems that we sent our friend into the room while we were away to tempt the puppy with the shoes? Sent someone in to encourage the puppy to chew on the shoes? Think of it that way: you spend every day of your life punishing a puppy and its offspring because you had your friend tempt it into chewing on shoes and it did. Really, what does that say about you as a sadist, so to speak? I mean, seriously--if God had been patient, one of them would have piddled on the rug eventually and the Almighty could have escaped the appearance of a double-cross.

• As it is, I wonder sometimes if metaphysically, God isn't supposed to be unattractive just to make the quest harder for the redemptionists. I mean, sure, it's a cruel God, it's a mean God, it's an ugly God, but hey, this is redemption and the soul and eternity we're talking about .... It's kind of like separating wheat and chaff. Those who worry that much about their souls, well, at least we know a bit about what's important to them, and to what degree.
Lord, here comes the flood
We'll say goodbye to flesh and blood
If again the seas are silent,
In any still alive
It'll be those that gave their island to survive,
Drink up, dreamers, you're running dry.

(Peter Gabriel)
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thanx,
Tiassa :cool:
 
Adam and eve weren't children - they were created man and woman (how's your Hebrew?) - in the image of God.

If 'nothing' is a dimension where neither time nor physics could exist (or 'before the fall' was a time when they could not be understood), it follows that mathematics was also part of the knowledge people only gained after 'eating the fruit'.
Adam and Eve didn't take notes. Genesis was written waaay after, and the writers would imagine God as He was known at the time of writing: The Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost - i.e. "Us".

PS. God did not create the sin or the temptaion (why would He want to create something and hide behind a snake to undo it?), He trusted them. He gave Adam & Eve everything they needed to know NOT to sin, but they wanted to be 'like God', rebelling against his authority.

Tiassa - how can you call a God who has been betrayed by his own creation, and still able to forgive, malicious? Remember, He didn't just chase A&E out of Eden to punish them, but to keep them from rebelling further - trying to live forever. People are still looking for immortality...why? because they want to make God obsolete and redundant. People are malicious, not God.
 
26: Then God said, "Let us make man in our image, after our likeness; and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the birds of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creeps upon the earth."
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Is there a possibility God speaks about himself in plural?
Like Caeser talked about himself with 'Him'.
In fact us should be written with a capitol (in my translation it is btw) which also gives the intention of him speaking about himself in plural.
The tree of knowledge is probably a metaphor for a thought/action of wanting to be God (i.e. not having to love Him anymore, but ourselves). The snake could also be metaphor for tempation. Something that comes with the act of existing (because we *want* things).
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Maybe the tree of knowledge ain't a metaphor for an action of wanting to be God, a fact is Eve wanted to be like God...:
Genesis
3,4 The serpent said to the woman, "You won't surely die,"

3,5 "for God knows that in the day you eat it, your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil."

3,6 When the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was a delight to the eyes, and that the tree was to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit of it, and ate; and she gave some to her husband with her, and he ate.

So the serpent told Eve that she could be God by eating the apple, and Eve apparently wanted that....and took Adam with her.
And of course, A&E weren't puppys or children.
Do with it what you want....
 
Originally posted by firdroirich
Do you want to know God or do you want proof of his existence?
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I admit, the title for this thread sucks.
I was wondering if God wants that we know that he exists...I want to know why he doesn't give us proof of his existence.
 
He has given you proof that He is. The proof is before your eyes. The proof is your eyes! The trees. The planets. You. He shows you His signs in everything that you do. In all that you think, feel, taste, touch. Man has gotten to the point where these things have become common place and he no longer sees them as signs. Man wants more but why would He who created all give more when man is not thankful for what he has?

To the blind man, sight is a blessing.
To the one without food, food is a blessing.
To the one without water, water is a blessing.
To the one without knowledge...

If one wants to know Him, stop looking for the sun to fall from the sky. Stop looking for the dead to speak. Stop looking for the moon to turn into a donkey. Stop looking for great and spectacular signs. Look for the small things. Look at yourself. Look at the order He created. Look at the vastness. What you may see as choas is actually order.

If you want to know Him, ask Him. But always remember that He it is that created you from nothing. He created all that is. All. I mean ALL! Should you not be in awe of One who has the power to do such things. Should you not fear One who, if He willed, could destroy all just by saying "BE"?

The signs are all around you but will you take heed of them? Will you see them for what they are?
 
This board has a lot of eggheads {very smart folks} subscribed. Find out, if you will what it takes to sustain life on this planet. Find out what would happen if the elements that make up air were proportioned, say 10% plus or minus. If the sun was 100,000 miles closer to the earth. If the sun only heated the earth for say 3 hours a day. If the moon was a mile closer to the earth. If the earths orbit shift 20 degrees.

One of His signs is the night and the day.
 
Originally posted by dkb218
Find out, if you will what it takes to sustain life on this planet. Find out what would happen if the elements that make up air were proportioned, say 10% plus or minus. If the sun was 100,000 miles closer to the earth. If the sun only heated the earth for say 3 hours a day. If the moon was a mile closer to the earth. If the earths orbit shift 20 degrees.

You put the cart before the horse here. If things were different then life would be different or life wouldn't exist here at all. These conditions were here before the evolution of life and the conditions set the parameters within which life on this planet could develop or not. When one bakes a cake in a pan they should not be surprised that the cake fits the shape of the pan perfectly.

~Raithere
 
Originally posted by Raithere
When one bakes a cake in a pan they should not be surprised that the cake fits the shape of the pan perfectly.

~Raithere
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Very well said. :)
 
Re: Notes on the topic

Originally posted by tiassa
[B

• As it is, I wonder sometimes if metaphysically, God isn't supposed to be unattractive just to make the quest harder for the redemptionists. I mean, sure, it's a cruel God, it's a mean God, it's an ugly God, but hey, this is redemption and the soul and eternity we're talking about .... It's kind of like separating wheat and chaff. Those who worry that much about their souls, well, at least we know a bit about what's important to them, and to what degree.[/B]
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Worth consideration, but in my mind it's right up there with your puppy example, and would require a similar mentality on the part of god.

This would also mean that those who "make it" would not be the clever, not the kind (unless by an accidental coincidence with god's rules), and/or not those i would consider the cream of humanity... but the pious, and those too scared to think about an alternative. Who'd wanna be stuck with that mob for eternity anyway?
 
And the meek will inherit the earth

Ever notices how easy it is to love someone if you really need their attention? It's that 'need' that makes it easy. If you need God, it will look for everyone like you are weak and submissive, but some of the most influencial people are spiritual. It's a 'spirit of need' and a 'spirit of thankfulness' that changes life into something less selfish. Being clever and kind isn't on the other side of the scale from being 'pious' - as a matter of fact, being meek is not the same as being powerless - the original Hebrew word comes from 'being receptive and soft' as opposed to being hard and ungiving. It means that you don't aspire to have power or to control it for your own benefit, but surrender it to God. When you 'need' God, it is an atitude that makes it easier and more possible to love people - and yourself.
 
According to the Bible,

Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble. James 2:19
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For those who seek God, God do show unto them.
 
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