I had just closed that link after reading another forum.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noncoding_DNA
Very interesting too.
Does DNA do this?
- Thread starter Robittybob1
- Start date
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noncoding_DNA
Very interesting too.
What is interesting are the base pairs on the DNA double helix are buried inside the double helix and surrounding by the phosphate groups. This arrangement lowers surface tension in water by placing the polar phosphate at the water interface and hiding the organics. Even with the bases hidden, enzymes are able to find specific base pairs and the sense strand.
What that means is the base pairs need to a way to transmit their signature to the surface of the double helix. This is done through the water. In the image below, water is part of the DNA's structure, with water hydrogen bonded to the bases in a way which create a double helix of water within the major and minor grooves of the double helix. This water structure, goes from the interior of the helix to the outside and links the bases with the phosphate on the surface. This water provides a base pair finger print on the surface, even with the bases buried.
What that means is the base pairs need to a way to transmit their signature to the surface of the double helix. This is done through the water. In the image below, water is part of the DNA's structure, with water hydrogen bonded to the bases in a way which create a double helix of water within the major and minor grooves of the double helix. This water structure, goes from the interior of the helix to the outside and links the bases with the phosphate on the surface. This water provides a base pair finger print on the surface, even with the bases buried.
That has left me thinking how mysterious life is once again, how did it know what pattern to look for at a specific time. Are there many different types of ribosomes/enzymes? For how many different tricks can the one type of ribosome do?
Utter nonsense, as is your previous post above.
Please stop posting crackpot gibberish in B&G about topics you clearly know little, or nothing, about. (This appears to be most biological topics.)I thought Wellwisher must have read about this somewhere, for it sounded quite possible. Where was it wrong?Utter nonsense, as is your previous post above.
He (or maybe she) is doing what he always does – taking numerous separate concepts and mashing them together into an incoherent (and abysmally wrong) word salad. I don’t know where to start describing the inaccuracies. Rather than try, the best thing I can do for you is direct you to one of the best online tutorials on the subject. I advise working through it in its entirety before resuming any confusing discussions like these on internet forums.
DNA From The Beginning
Molecules of Genetics and Genetic Organization and Control are the relevant sections for this thread.
DNA From The Beginning
Molecules of Genetics and Genetic Organization and Control are the relevant sections for this thread.
Thanks for your help.
What is interesting are the base pairs on the DNA double helix are buried inside the double helix and surrounding by the phosphate groups. This arrangement lowers surface tension in water by placing the polar phosphate at the water interface and hiding the organics. Even with the bases hidden, enzymes are able to find specific base pairs and the sense strand.
What that means is the base pairs need to a way to transmit their signature to the surface of the double helix. This is done through the water. In the image below, water is part of the DNA's structure, with water hydrogen bonded to the bases in a way which create a double helix of water within the major and minor grooves of the double helix. This water structure, goes from the interior of the helix to the outside and links the bases with the phosphate on the surface. This water provides a base pair finger print on the surface, even with the bases buried.
I have the impression if the strong polar groups are at the surface the surface tension increases. The addition of salt bind to water and it brings free water , the hydrogen bound double helix will help to open the helix
Biologists are not physical chemists, so you may not understand what I wrote based on a biology education, Hercules. Don't confuse your own lack of understanding with my ability to understand.
Last edited by a moderator:
OK the body needs to achieve a function and it requires a protein. The signal goes out the gene has to be located on the Chromosomes. How would the enzyme "know" where to go. OK I understand there is non-coding DNA preceding the gene, so are the enzymes instructed to recognise a certain pattern on the DNA helix.
There is breakthrough here for the computer world here I feel. quaternary code on a molecular level?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quaternary_numeral_system
There is breakthrough here for the computer world here I feel. quaternary code on a molecular level?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quaternary_numeral_system
No, the opposite is true. An increase in the salt concentration will increase the melting (denaturation) temperature of dsDNA. ie. make the duplex more stable. A major force favouring melting of the DNA duplex is electrostatic repulsion between phosphates, which will be diminished at higher salt concentration. The salt "shields" the negative charges on each phosphate. When the charges are NOT shielded, the electrostatic repulsion makes it energetically more favourable to separate the strands.
Nice bluff. I have more than enough genetics and molecular biology background and experience to spot when someone without a genetics and molecular biology background tries to force and contort and squeeze biology to fit their pseudoscience belief. The entropy-is-the-answer-to-any-and-all-biological-question thread is evidence enough. That’s where I’ve moved your recent posts from this thread.
Have you any answer to the question I posed before? "How would the enzyme "know" where to go? OK I understand there is non-coding DNA preceding the gene, so are the enzymes instructed to recognise a certain pattern on the DNA helix."
It would have to know where to access the right gene at the right time. What is the mechanism for this?
What enzyme(s) are you referring to? There are a very large number of DNA-binding proteins, although not all of them are enzymes. Anyway, it doesn’t matter as the principle is the same regardless of the function of the enzyme. The answer is that enzymes recognize their substrate via the “lock and key” mechanism, ie. the active site of the enzyme specifically and precisely recognizes the 3D shape of its substrate. In the case of DNA, it’s the 3D shape of a sequence of nucleotides that is recognized.
Google with “lock and key” + enzyme (or similar phrase) and you’ll find heaps of info.
Again, you will have to be more specific as to what enzyme you are referring to in order for me to answer that question. Gene expression is regulated on many different levels, ranging from the chromosome level (chromatin conformation) to the DNA level (presence/absence of appropriate transcription factors and enhancers) to the RNA level (mRNA stability). There are also controls on the export of mature mRNA from the nucleus and controls on its translation into protein at ribosomes. Then, of course, there are all the myriad controls at the protein level to regulate how the protein achieves its intended biological role.
@Hercules Rockefeller
I am even finding asking the right question difficult, so I looked at the section on transcription in Wikipedia again and think this section on "Pre-initiation" might give me roughly the answer I was looking for. where it says "RNA polymerase is able to bind to core promoters in the presence of various specific transcription factors."
So does that mean the body controls the proteins it requires for regulation by setting up the "specific transcription factors".
Say if it needs protein X which will reguire transcription of gene X the body (cell) primes that gene with "specific transcription factors" so the enzyme RNA polymerase can do its job.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transcription_(genetics)
In eukaryotes, RNA polymerase, and therefore the initiation of transcription, requires the presence of a core promoter sequence in the DNA. Promoters are regions of DNA that promote transcription and, in eukaryotes, are found at -30, -75, and -90 base pairs upstream from the transcription start site (abbreviated to TSS). Core promoters are sequences within the promoter that are essential for transcription initiation. RNA polymerase is able to bind to core promoters in the presence of various specific transcription factors.
I am even finding asking the right question difficult, so I looked at the section on transcription in Wikipedia again and think this section on "Pre-initiation" might give me roughly the answer I was looking for. where it says "RNA polymerase is able to bind to core promoters in the presence of various specific transcription factors."
So does that mean the body controls the proteins it requires for regulation by setting up the "specific transcription factors".
Say if it needs protein X which will reguire transcription of gene X the body (cell) primes that gene with "specific transcription factors" so the enzyme RNA polymerase can do its job.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transcription_(genetics)
In eukaryotes, RNA polymerase, and therefore the initiation of transcription, requires the presence of a core promoter sequence in the DNA. Promoters are regions of DNA that promote transcription and, in eukaryotes, are found at -30, -75, and -90 base pairs upstream from the transcription start site (abbreviated to TSS). Core promoters are sequences within the promoter that are essential for transcription initiation. RNA polymerase is able to bind to core promoters in the presence of various specific transcription factors.
Correct. One of the mechanisms a cell uses to regulate the expression of a gene is to regulate the production of the transcription factor(s) that is/are required for its transcription.
Now wrap your head around this....
Transcription factors are proteins, of course, that are encoded by genes. Cells regulate the expression of transcription factor genes by regulating the production of transcription factors that are required for the transcription of those transcription factor genes.
Correct. DNA-dependant RNA polymerase rarely, if ever, is capable of transcribing a gene without being complexed to a transcription factor.
Thanks - an interesting and complex field.