Creation

[Rosnet]

I don't believe the universe had a begining.

Where's the option for the universe probably wasn't created at all?

The last option! Where does it say anywhere in the last option that the Universe had a beginning? The question isn't whether it had a beginning or not, but whether God had any part in its creation. So as far as this thread is concerned, what you're looking for is the last option. That's what I understand.

 

[lightgigantic]

OK, riddle me this, I sometimes get an overwhelming urge to drink tea, I have one right now, and must go immediately, put the kettle on, and get brewing. What is this is if it not divine guidance from the 'Great Celestial Teapot' itself?

People feel things inside themselves, and attribute them to external influences. God or Teapot, it's all the same. Internal, personal, and has no external reality.

then you would be hard pressed to determine how your tea drinking is anything but the urge of yoru mind, and where the question of direct perception of a celestial teapot comes into being
(but I agree, its not uncommon to encounter a believer who confuses their mind for god - that's why it is recommended that one consults scripture rather than one's mind)

Unlike your god , there are claims of the direct perception of the celestial teapot (lunatics) and also processes for others to come to that point of direct perception

if they are lunatics, the processes they advocate will probably be vastly arrayed (unlike religion, which draws on similar principles of atonement, austerity, service to god etc) and incapable of drawing a uniformed response by following their "processes"

 

[Oniw17]

The last option! Where does it say anywhere in the last option that the Universe had a beginning? The question isn't whether it had a beginning or not, but whether God had any part in its creation. So as far as this thread is concerned, what you're looking for is the last option. That's what I understand.

To say that God didn't have a part in the creation of the universe is still admiting that it was created, right?

 

[James R]

There is no option for:

The universe was created by a natural entity/species

and

The universe was not created.

Those are covered by the last option.

 

[Ayodhya]

A quick question to those who do not believe the universe had a beginning... if the universe had no beginning, what do you believe? It's just been here forever?

 

[draqon]

A quick question to those who do not believe the universe had a beginning... if the universe had no beginning, what do you believe? It's just been here forever?

its cyclical. Beginning is also an end.

 

[(Q)]

if they are theists, the processes they advocate will probably be vastly arrayed (unlike belief in the celestial teapot, which draws on similar principles of milkyness, honey, service to tea, etc) and incapable of drawing a uniformed response by following their "processes"

See how easy? Same-same. Keep trying.

 

[Oniw17]

A quick question to those who do not believe the universe had a beginning... if the universe had no beginning, what do you believe? It's just been here forever?

Of course, coservation.

 

[lightgigantic]

See how easy? Same-same. Keep trying.

you failed to give processes and instead opted for qualities

 

[(Q)]

you failed to give processes and instead opted for qualities

you failed to give processes and instead opted for double-speak.

Again?

 

[Ayodhya]

Of course, coservation.

So energy has always existed?
The universe goes through a cycle of Big Bangs and Big Crunches, and has been since the beginning of time (whatever that is)?

 

[Oniw17]

So energy has always existed?
The universe goes through a cycle of Big Bangs and Big Crunches, and has been since the beginning of time (whatever that is)?

I'd imagine, except there is no begining of time. That's what seems likely.

 

[draqon]

I'd imagine, except there is no begining of time. That's what seems likely.

The bubble theory...is cool with that assumption.