Congratulations America - you got the president you deserve

[Seattle]

No links to "funny" videos about DEI hiring practices this time?

I could if you would like. Let's face it, you guys are clearly out of touch.

 

[billvon]

Maybe you could work in "Hitler" as well.

Looks like you don't understand the term "progressive." Is it too "woke" for you?

 

[Seattle]

Looks like you don't understand the term "progressive." Is it too "woke" for you?

It's not effective. Giving someone $25K as a first time home buyer just raising the cost of a house by $25k. Education loans raise the cost of education. Guaranteeing sub-prime mortgages still doesn't make the house any more affordable.

Not understanding inflation isn't helpful. Modern Monetary Theory isn't reality. It goes on and on. Perhaps you don't really understand "progressive"?

 

[billvon]

It's not effective. Giving someone $25K as a first time home buyer just raising the cost of a house by $25k.

Ah you think progressive is "subsidy!" No. The term for that is "subsidy."

Progressives are adherents of a political philosophy that tries to advance the human condition through social reform, generally through changes in society, government, science and technology. For example, progressives wanted to end slavery by passing laws that prevented it. This was a huge social change, and a great many people fought against it. Progressives wanted to legalize gay marriage - again a huge change, and again accomplished against a great deal of opposition from conservatives.

Progressives who advocate for reduction of climate change might push electric cars and renewable energy - new technologies that help humanity by reducing the future severity of global warming. Progressives who support LGBT causes might advocate for equal rights for trans people by allowing them the same access to technology as cis people - specifically, plastic surgery.

Think of progressives as the top of the Overton window. Below them you have 'vanilla' liberals, then middle of the roaders, then conservatives, then fundamentalists.

 

[Write4U]

Yep. Once progressives freed the slaves, they destroyed America.

It seems to me that when the Europeans came to America, they began destroying it.

The US was built on the backs of slaves.

Michelle Obama correct that White House built by slaves

 

[Seattle]

Ah you think progressive is "subsidy!" No. The term for that is "subsidy."

Progressives are adherents of a political philosophy that tries to advance the human condition through social reform, generally through changes in society, government, science and technology. For example, progressives wanted to end slavery by passing laws that prevented it. This was a huge social change, and a great many people fought against it. Progressives wanted to legalize gay marriage - again a huge change, and again accomplished against a great deal of opposition from conservatives.

Progressives who advocate for reduction of climate change might push electric cars and renewable energy - new technologies that help humanity by reducing the future severity of global warming. Progressives who support LGBT causes might advocate for equal rights for trans people by allowing them the same access to technology as cis people - specifically, plastic surgery.

Think of progressives as the top of the Overton window. Below them you have 'vanilla' liberals, then middle of the roaders, then conservatives, then fundamentalists.

I understand how terms have been bastardized. I understand that progressive use to mean "progress" rather than going backward or a being a "Luddite".

I'll still stand with my characterization of actual "progressive" policies.. They are ineffective and why we now have a President Trump again.

 

[(Q)]

Biden got about 81 million votes to Trumps 71 million in 2020. Trump managed to gain another million or so votes this time round but Harris got less than 70 million. What happened to the 10+ million voters who came out in 2020 but not this time round?

Arguments to be made:

America is still not ready to elect a female president, but is starting to accept the idea a bit more considering Clinton got 65 million votes in 2016.

The blame therefore can be placed squarely on the Democratic Party and the voters for not showing up. They might have won.

Republicans may have somehow managed to steal this election and we may never know. They've been working on planting people in the government and will continue to do so based on Project 2025. Have millions of Dem votes been purged in Red states?

Joe Biden could have won this election, but was pushed out by people who panicked. The Democratic party should have rallied behind him considering he managed to win in 2020.

Funding for the Republicans outnumbered the Democrats by 7-1, easily, which doesn't include the 'dark money' funneled in by oligarchs The Dems spent about $1 billion while it may show the GOP spent anywhere from $15-$20 billion.

Conservative billionaires have multiple media platforms and channels while Progressives are struggling with having only a couple... MSNBC for example. Right-wing propaganda is blasted out non-stop, 24/7 all over America.

Perhaps, the 250 year old 'Freedom and Liberty' experiment has run it's course and now it's time for Fascism and the predicted dystopian society we've all been dreading.

As well, Xi, Kim, Orban and Putin are all jumping up and down like little kids with new toys. Ukraine will fall, Gaza will get paved over and become Trump tower ME.

We are all screwed, folks.

 

[Gawdzilla Sama]

It seems to me that when the Europeans came to America, they began destroying it.

The US was built on the backs of slaves.

Michelle Obama correct that White House built by slaves

Simplifications.

 

[billvon]

I'll still stand with my characterization of actual "progressive" policies.

OK. In that case, I shall refer to "conservatives" as "people who want to greatly increase the debt." Since that's actually what they do.

 

[Seattle]

OK. In that case, I shall refer to "conservatives" as "people who want to greatly increase the debt." Since that's actually what they do.

Feel free to do so. That's another bastardized term along with "liberal".

I don't really care what you call a bad policy. It's the policies that I am focusing on. If "slavery" is all you have, you probably have a losing argument. We're all against slavery.

 

[parmalee]

Gee
What a pity.

Trump advocates assassination of his political enemies, so why we should we walk on eggshells?

Example?

This very question, asked--by you--and answered at least a dozen times *, by this point. What are you not getting?

Then there's this, from July:

Days before an assassination attempt on former President Donald Trump, President Joe Biden said it was time to “put Trump in a bullseye.”

MSN

One wonders why this hyperbole?

it not hyperbole
it Metaphor

do Understand?

And this:

Trump's lawyer was supposed to get Stormy to shut up----and he failed---miserably!
And the structured payment led to 34 convictions(which will, most likely be thrown out on appeal.
Meanwhile----Clinton tried to get the monica thing to go away, He failed---miserably.
One wonders why politicians seem to need to hide their sexuality.
Would Clinton have been better off if instead of claiming "I did not have sex with that woman", he would have said:
"jeez people-it was just a blow job---get over it."

Let's all hope you are not making a comparison between consensual sex and rape here.

I do not know what you are referencing. Details please? ie who raped whom, when and where?

So, like I said, you are a pathological liar and an idiot.

* Not wasting my time searching for links here--see above. "Civil discourse", Jesus Fucking Christ. It's about priorities for me, IOW I consider you hopeless garbage and I'm not gonna waste a few more of my precious minutes on you. Simple as that.

Edited to add: also re: "Civil discourse": cuz I find the "Southern Strategy" loathesome.

 

[Jeeves]

Once progressives freed the slaves, they destroyed America.

Not all of it, just the economy - which is possibly all that matters.

Maybe you could work in "Hitler" as well.

No need; he inspired the playbook.

 

[billvon]

If "slavery" is all you have, you probably have a losing argument.

Then I don't think you are following the argument.

The argument is not slavery. It is the definition of "progressive." And back in the 1860's, the progressives were the ones trying to end slavery - trying to advance the human condition through social reform. That was high up on the Overton window. Since the Overton window moves with time, it is now squarely in the center of the window.

Today trans rights are the top of that window, and progressives are fighting for that. With time, that will move to the center of the window as well. And in the future, someone will be angered by someone saying that trans rights were once a progressive cause. "If trans rights are all you have, you have a losing argument!"

Subsidies are fought for by both liberals and conservatives. (Or progressives and fundamentalists, if you prefer two positions farther apart in that window.) Conservatives want subsidies for veterans and large businesses; liberals want subsidies for poor people. So using that as your definition for "progressive" is somewhat foolish.

 

[James R]

Trump advocates assassination of his political enemies, so why we should we walk on eggshells?

If someone shot Trump, I'd certainly raise a glass of champagne to his death.

I'm disappointed to hear that from you.

Two wrongs don't make a right. Why lower yourself to Trump's standards?

 

[James R]

Oh there's no doubt of the existential threats. What's problematic is that an assassin's bullet can't take out the whole MAGA power structure and the 70-plus million Americans who believe in these destructive politics. And if you kill a few, they are like Hydra heads, instantly replaced and doubled. Plus the other problem with whacking heads of state and their lines of succession is that of becoming a banana republic in terms of cultural norms where assassination is routine and all politics laced with lethal violence.

No good answers that I can see.

This, too, is quite problematic. Would you advocate the assassination of "the whole MAGA power structure", if it could be arranged without being "problematic"? Really?

 

[Seattle]

Then I don't think you are following the argument.

The argument is not slavery. It is the definition of "progressive." And back in the 1860's, the progressives were the ones trying to end slavery - trying to advance the human condition through social reform. That was high up on the Overton window. Since the Overton window moves with time, it is now squarely in the center of the window.

Today trans rights are the top of that window, and progressives are fighting for that. With time, that will move to the center of the window as well. And in the future, someone will be angered by someone saying that trans rights were once a progressive cause. "If trans rights are all you have, you have a losing argument!"

Subsidies are fought for by both liberals and conservatives. (Or progressives and fundamentalists, if you prefer two positions farther apart in that window.) Conservatives want subsidies for veterans and large businesses; liberals want subsidies for poor people. So using that as your definition for "progressive" is somewhat foolish.

It's foolish to have a discussion if you label the other person's comments as "foolish".
Someone who is fiscally conservative doesn't want subsidies for veterans or businesses. If there is a policy that makes sense that involves a business, a market and a temporarily subsidy then that's a political decision.

If you decide that you want to encourage a business to make electric cars and you provide a subsidy, fine, that your political decision. I would be leary in general but I might be OK with it given the other aims (or not). Otherwise for veterans or the poor, it's generally not a good idea but it could be if it is temporary and depending on the change you are trying to effect.

If you don't have the money to do it, it's not a good idea in any event. To do so would be foolish, which is why most progressive policies are foolish and it's why Trump is now President.

 

[Seattle]

Here's how to lose an election. Listen to someone's personal observations, don't listen, just wait for them to stop talking so that you can now try to win the argument with stats about how good the economy is, crime is down and immigrants commit less crime than others.

You will lose. Why, because in many cities, the local government did try "defund the police", local crime is up and particularly in the downtown areas where small businesses are now closing up and moving due to the crime. Much of that crime may be by immigrants especially if it is an asylum city.

Decide that it's not a felony to shoplift if it's under $1K and watch the blatant shoplifting that now occurs. Stores close and move to the suburbs. Police only show up for major crimes so minor crime goes up. Courts don't jail minor crime anymore so it goes up.

No loitering laws go away, people doing drugs and living on the streets go up. These are all progressive policies. The result...people elect Trump. It's predictable.

What about slavery isn't going to win any discussion.

 

[Write4U]

Simplifications.

It is not complicated.
Harris advanced a principle of peaceful Democracy, based on “inclusion”.
Trump advanced a principle of hateful Autocracy based on “exclusion”.

 

[Write4U]

Simplifications.

It is not complicated.

Harris advanced a principle of peaceful Democracy, based on “inclusion”. DEI (Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion)

Diversity, equity, and inclusion (DEI) are organizational frameworks which seek to promote the fair treatment and full participation of all people, particularly groups who have historically been underrepresented or subject to discrimination on the basis of identity or disability.[1]

Trump advanced a principle of hateful Autocracy based on “exclusion”. Anti-DEI.

These (DEI) efforts have come under attack in many quarters as multiple lawmakers have employed various tactics, including rolling back broad environmental, social, and governance (ESG) initiatives by corporations as well as restricting teachers from teaching broad historical topics in their classrooms.

Current anti-DEI initiatives focus on defunding DEI programs in higher education or prohibiting the use of DEI policies in hiring decisions. Below are snapshots from some of the 19 states that have introduced or passed anti-DEI legislation.

State Anti-DEI Initiatives Explained | Perkins Coie

Over the past year, several states have rolled out plans to defund diversity, equity, and inclusion efforts. While these initiatives are focused on state agencies and state-funded higher education, they may cause concern for private employers.

perkinscoie.com

Trump managed to appeal to our baser side, by misrepresenting facts, with the help of some biased news organizations.

 

[Write4U]

The selfishness and irresponsibility of Trump will cost countless lives and leave the world in a state in which grabbing territory by force of arms is once again the norm.

Biden has 60 days to declare Trump an "enemy of the State", and arrest him for the crimes he has already been convicted of.
Once Trump takes office he becomes "untouchable". There is still time to avoid worldwide disasters.